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#21
If you think I wasn't responding to what you said, then you are the one who misunderstood.

Mistgod Wrote:My second point is that tulpas are not that important in the real tangible world.

How is emotional support not important in the real world?

Mistgod Wrote:My first number one angst with it is this finger pointing that goes on in the tulpa community about who does it better is stupid.  There is no better way or right way to make a tulpa because it is so subjective and based on faith and imagination.  

I don't really have much to say on this. I don't have an opinion, really. There are certainly things you should avoid doing (like sex before they can give consent), but mostly it's fine to do whatever the hell you want because it's nearly impossible to fuck up in my opinion. I think there are certain things that make it easier (e.g., forms and wonderland), but it's a convenience and not a necessity.
Niteo and Amber Take On the World

Amber speaks in italics right now.

Talk to Niteo on here or on discord

Yuki Wrote:We share the body, we share a life. I'm not an accessory to his life...

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#22
Mistgod Wrote:I personally do not think the tulpa should really get the credit in the real world for anything that matters.

Why?

Not everyone is a median like you, Mistgod. There are definitive lines between Niteo and I. What he does is not what I do.
Niteo and Amber Take On the World

Amber speaks in italics right now.

Talk to Niteo on here or on discord

Yuki Wrote:We share the body, we share a life. I'm not an accessory to his life...

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#23
Because the real world does not give a shit that you have a tulpa or not.  

In fact I think in most cases people think their tulpas matter for a while but eventually lose interest in them and move on.  The tulpas become an interesting episode in their lives but really not much more than that.  That is why this forum and community is so dead when it used to thrive.  Most lost interest eventually and moved on to real world interests.  We just pretend there are all these tulpas still out there having second jobs for their hosts.  

Most probably forget about it as they enter college and the work environment.
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#24
Mistgod Wrote:Because the real world does not give a shit that you have a tulpa or not.  

That's not quite true, is it? My interactions with people who know seems to reinforce my idea that I do matter. Besides the fact that people don't have to know or care for it to matter.

Mistgod Wrote:In fact I think in most cases people think their tulpas matter for a while but eventually lose interest in them and move on.  The tulpas become an interesting episode in their lives but really not much more than that.  That is why this forum and community is so dead when it used to thrive.  Most lost interest eventually and moved on to real world interests.  We just pretend there are all these tulpas still out there having second jobs for their hosts.  

That's not what we're talking about, and you have no way of proving that's the case. It's an assumption you've made about people who are no longer posting on the website. For example, we used to not post here, but we were still active as a system. We came back, but not everyone will.
Niteo and Amber Take On the World

Amber speaks in italics right now.

Talk to Niteo on here or on discord

Yuki Wrote:We share the body, we share a life. I'm not an accessory to his life...

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#25
I care about my Melian very, very much and she matters to me personally in an emotional way.  She has helped me a lot.  So has a lot of internal, subjective things.  But outside of a very small group of people, Melian does not matter at all.  In the objective real world we are a single human being.  Whether you have one tulpa or a hundred tulpas, in the objective real world you are still a single human being.  I am talking about relative perspective.  Objectively, you either do well as a human being, or you do not.  The human being gets credit and recognition, not the tulpa.  

My family cares that I, David, work to bring home money and take care of the home.  Objectively in the real world, Melian matters only about as much as any knowledge or imagination matters.  Melian existing is no different from than my imagination and skills in teaching mathematics to students.  I am good at teaching mathematics as a human being, so I got the job doing that to pay my bills.  It matters not if Melian is real, not real, or whatnot, as a human being I teach math and earn a paycheck.  If she taught the math through me, it still wouldn't matter.  The school hired a human being to do that job, not a human being and a tulpa.  We don't get two paychecks.  We only get one paycheck and it has my name on it.    

The fact of me having Melian in my mind does not make me suddenly more than one human being.  I am one person.  The world does not give a hoot about Melian's existence ultimately.  She only matters internally.  

I am a single human being and so are you.  Tulpas don't impress me that much.  In fact, as Melian and I have said many times on this forum, we can't tell the difference between someone with a role playing character and someone with a tulpa.  So, to us, objectively in a real world sort of way, it doesn't really matter.


(08-24-2016, 10:47 PM)Procron X Wrote: Not everyone is a median like you, Mistgod. There are definitive lines between Niteo and I. What he does is not what I do.

So what?  

Ultimately it is one human being doing something regardless of the internal source.  From my perspective outside of your system, it makes no difference really who did what or how it happened.  I see one human being producing something whether it be a tulpa personality expression or a piece of artwork.  

Objectively there isn't any difference between you and I.  We are both human beings.  In the outside world, no one can really tell the difference between what Niteo is and what Melian is.  

Let's say your host decided tomorrow that Niteo was a median and not a tulpa.  Would it make any difference to me really?  What if your host declared Niteo an astral spirit?  What if your host declared him only an rp character?  For me, no change.  It would be the same.  

It would all look the same.
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#26
Mistgod Wrote:I am a single human being and so are you.

One human =/= one person, and I shouldn't have to tell you this, but I do.

Just because people don't know about it doesn't mean it doesn't matters. I shouldn't have to tell you this but I do.

I refuse to waste my time arguing with someone who doesn't know these things at their age. You waste my time and insult me at the same time, and I won't have any more of it.
Niteo and Amber Take On the World

Amber speaks in italics right now.

Talk to Niteo on here or on discord

Yuki Wrote:We share the body, we share a life. I'm not an accessory to his life...

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#27
(08-25-2016, 02:11 AM)Procron X Wrote: One human =/= one person, and I shouldn't have to tell you this, but I do.

Just because people don't know about it doesn't mean it doesn't matters. I shouldn't have to tell you this but I do.

I refuse to waste my time arguing with someone who doesn't know these things at their age. You waste my time and insult me at the same time, and I won't have any more of it.

At my age I know the real world isn't going to give a flying shit.  That's my point. Niteo and Melian are about as impressive in the real world as inspirational cartoon characters.  Outside of ourselves, they don't matter to the world much in any significant way.  You can't change that.  These stupid details and labels and the tulpa "guides" only matter in this little internet pseudo-science sub culture.  Outside nobody is going to really care whether or not you are insulted by my blunt assessment of things.  Very few will even ever see it as real.  

I cared a LOT about how Melian was regarded inside of this community. We wrote a lot about whether she is real and whether she is a tulpa or not.  It mattered socially here in this little place.  But outside of it, no one gives a shit.  Melian is a cartoon character and an rp character to 99.99% of the world.  To the real world she doesn't matter that much.  It is a waste of energy to be insulted by that or for Melian to be insulted by that.  

Yeah I treat Niteo and Amber as separate persons, I want to and like to, but I also regard your system ultimately as a single human being.  I am not wrong about that.  It does not matter if Niteo is real or pretend in the objective world I see you from.  Go look in the mirror and tell me you don't see a single human being in that mirror.  

You can't expect me to be absolutely certain what is going on in your brain.  I can only take you at your word on it.  If I meet someone who has a seasoned rp character they want to role play, and they tell me it is important to them that I treat their rp character as a real person, I would be happy to do it.  I would put no greater value qualifier on that then anyone claiming to have a tulpa, because I have no idea who has what going on in their mind.  I can only see the human being. 

Real people with tulpas, soulbond, daemons, median systems, natural multiple systems, therians, spirit channelers, people with imaginary friends, role players...each and every one of them is a single human being.   

I treat everyone the same way and I cannot judge between them.  They all look the same to me.  Sorry about that.
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#28
...wow.

I'm kind of confused as to why there's (what appears to be) a gangsta-rap song prefacing the critique of why half the guides ought to be wiped out, unless it's supposed to be an entry that shouldn't be taken seriously.

If I may try to salvage an item of interest, I'm of the thought that guides oughtn't be destroyed out-right nor should they be denied under the auspices of a group that attempts quality-control. I think everyone has something they can bring to a table, doubly so if the tulpa phenomenon is focused so intently upon one's subjective experiences. I would prefer the user-base to identify what exactly works for and with them, and to rate or laud a work after they and others garner success with it, rather than entertaining the pretension that maintaining a scientific perspective is doable with tulpas, at least, at this point in time - outside of philosophy, theology, history and psychology/behavioural sciences, methinks harder studies would seek to ridicule and thoroughly debunk what has been established herein.

P.S. - Hey there Niteo. I'd recommend using the ignore function if your jimmies get rustled. Like with all forums, there are users who are unhealthy and not worth the effort communicating with. You should also reconsider sharing some personal details and taking certain posts seriously, as others may prey upon and exploit this information as well as the disposition in which it is broadcasted. You and Amber have a good one.
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#29
(08-24-2016, 10:33 PM)Mistgod Wrote: I personally do not think the tulpa should really get the credit in the real world for anything that matters.  I think the host ultimately gets the credit for everything the tulpa does.  I know you guys don't agree.  But to me the tulpa(s) and the host are ultimately functioning as one person in the real world.

(08-25-2016, 02:11 AM)Procron X Wrote: One human =/= one person, and I shouldn't have to tell you this, but I do.

Here's the thing, you're right in that it's a single human and single human brain to be credited. It is also a single human legally to be credited. But on a more personal level (because those are just societal technicalities and labels that fit a system, but not a person), there is more than one "person" in that mind. And so you can say the "host" will be credited, but that isn't true. Their name will be credited. But you know what, my tulpas have to respond to that name when they're switched. By your terms, they are me anyways. So they'll also be credited. Our system as a whole, the body's given identity will be credited. But it won't be my personal identity that gets the credit (or at least, the credit is misplaced). It would be theirs. Another equal member of the system. Saying that the "host" will always be given credit is kinda racist against tulpas, because a tulpa can take over their host's life entirely potentially. The body's legal identity, and the personal identity that people know the host as, may be given credit. At least outside of circles where you can share that information. But on a personal level, if we're not talking about the legal identification of the body, we're talking about who you are as a person. And that identity is what changes between tulpa and host. You can respect it or not, but it's less that you're "right" and more that you're resigning us to what's most likely or easiest. Kinda like telling a transsexual they'll always be their birth gender, because that's all people will recognize them as. Maybe true, sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't. It's best to be at least a little optimistic lest you give up the chance entirely. Same for tulpa individuality, maybe they won't be recognized as separate people, but hoping for that some day is better than resigning themselves to getting no credit for anything.

Some of my tulpas already get credit for things, from you guys and myself. They could get more, or they could've had none at all. Just because something is hard or unlikely doesn't mean you can say it "isn't" what it could be. It could be.
Hi! I'm Lumi, host of Reisen, Tewi, Flandre and Lucilyn.
Everyone deserves to love and be loved. It's human nature.
My tulpas and I have a Q&A thread, which was the first (and largest) of its kind. Feel free to ask us stuff.
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#30
Reading all this, all that comes to my mind is this : "host" doesn't qualify the system's body.
The system's body IS what society sees and gives credit to. The host, in my humble opinion, is just the thoughtform that was in this body first. You cannot say the host is credited more than any other tulpa.
The body is credited by society, because it's all society sees. Up to the system to decide which thoughtform did this and who should "receive the credits".

Reading so much "hate" and toughness hurts me... This community should be united, but I often read such misunderstanding and people not really reading each-others, entering a spiral of pain and hatred. Nothing good comes out of this.
I'm pretty sure no one here meant any bad to anyone, but the words used don't have the same meaning for everyone, leading to misunderstanding, and grief...
No animosity intended ever 

Cora now has her own account ! Big Grin

English isn't our native language, please be indulgent Smile
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