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Lance's Head, the Thread
Breloomancer Offline
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#71
 
RE: Lance's Head, the Thread

You are totally right about switching; learning to switch isn't a skill, it's more of a puzzle, you just have to find the right solution, but it's something that you have the capacity to do from the beginning. It is something that in all likelihood won't take all that much time. It only took a couple weeks for us iirc. Of course switching itself is a skill, but that's something to worry about once you figure out how to do it in the first place

I have a tulpa named Monika who I love very much.


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12-13-2018, 02:01 AM
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Reilyn-Alley Offline
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#72
 
RE: Lance's Head, the Thread

Originally mentioned in a different thread, this seemed like way too good stuff to not add here too. It's on the subject of something I heard referred to as wonderland sharing, or sharing a wonderland with another, however you want to say it. I have a couple different experiences from this, which I will toss into hiddens, not because they are dirty, but because they are long and I'm just gonna fold them into the same post. I don't consider this concept metaphysical/parapsychological either. I see it as trust and willingness increasing suggestibility, allowing disbelief to be suspended more easily and doubt not to get in the way.


Experiment 1 and 2: Inter-system

So, my first experience with sharing a wonderland was from a longtime member and all-around amazing person (Aurora-Senpai), whom I have tons and tons to learn from. Anyway, she mentioned sharing a wonderland in a PM to me and I was just boggled, like what's that? Was it some kinda metaphysical thing? Some kinda.. universal consciousness thing or something? I had absolutely no idea what was going to happen going into this and I think that actually helped. I had zero preconceived notions, had no doubt or disbelief to make things more difficult and just really wanted to experience whatever this amazing-sounding thing was.


I asked for a description first and she said it would be easier to just show me. She started off asking me "where I was right now", and I just bluntly answered "where I usually am, kinda that feeling of being between the body's eyes. Basically, sitting here typing to you" and she told me to imagine a simple room in headspace/wonderland. Simple description: cream-color walls, white ceiling, gray fuzzy carpet, a little tv in the corner, blue fluffy bed. Then she said she was there, seated on the bed. She said get myself in there any way I wanted to and just try to see things as well as I could. Lance and I hopped our forms in through a closet/wardrobe that appeared because, well why not?

It started off right away, she would do something, maybe talk some too, I would visualize it all happening as best I could, then give me a turn (Lance just hung around quietly to chaperone) to do the same, while she visualized it. It went on back and forth like this the whole time. Without really thinking about it, I hopped right in, happy and excited to be a part of something and just put my trust in her, kinda making myself vulnerable without realizing it. She gave me a hug and asked me to hop in her lap and we just chatted for awhile, with her tossing in an addition *pats your head* or *rubs your back* and such and it was just really neat. At first Lance was thinking "This is just roleplaying", but didn't comment and I was pretty wrapped up in the experience and had never actually done anything like this before, not as myself at least (we have played D&D twice now with his friends, with me roleplaying the character, it was neat!).

I have commented before that we noticed a powerful emotional response from certain things and those responses make us more engaged and drawn into our headspace stuff so even though we haven't really been able to synthesize any senses (except some visual and a little bit of temperature once, we think) yet, the powerful emotions have drawn us in deeply and made things like hugs seem real. The bond, the connection, the care and warm fuzzy love and sense of safety in each other's arms is there and it's about all we get to experience so we learned to enjoy it. A comment on our wonderland experiences will be below, in the next experiment. I can't explain it but I felt that same connection to her and it was strong. I don't know if I just admired her from the beginning or liked the attention, or just wanted to try super hard to enjoy this experience. Headpats might have been a motive too, I dunno. :P

Some time after starting, I had at some point just "let go" and felt some kind of deeper and deeper connection to her and to me, it seemed like the most "real" thing I had ever done so far. Still no senses except some imagery but my emotions were strong and out of control and everything about it just felt safe and happy and belonging and whatever else. By the end of it, I commented that I wonder if this is what it feels like to have a big sister or a mother. I had nothing else to compare it to but it was probably one of the better experiences I've ever had. Now, having to read and type replies did break my immersion some but not enough to spoil the experience. Before we stopped, she asked "so, where are you right now?" again, and I started to type a happy "with you" and realized that.. waaait, I had a freaky feeling of still being in the body but a decently real sense of being in there with her as well. I've never understood what people meant when they said during things like visualization and imposition, practitioners should try to "move their perspective" to another place because it seemed impossible to do, but for the first time I had a brief sense that I was there with her and it really opened my eyes up to doing wonderland stuff with other people. I mentioned as such and she said "Good, that was the point of this", as in, to let myself go enough to just engage in the shared experience and actually make it a worthwhile experience.

I commented at the time that I had a strong sense that this wasn't a game, this wasn't me pretending, I was using myself as the character and my own obvious strong attachment to myself made it super easy to directly associate the experience as happening to me. In other words, I think it was believable and "real" because I was able to go in without any preconceived notions of what was going to happen and trusted that a long-time community member I admired would show me something super amazing. It may have actually put me in a state where I had no guard up and was easily open to suggestion, kinda like hypnosis. It doesn't matter if it was actual real or not, in my mind it seemed like a real enough experience, or as close as I could get at the time. Personal perception being manipulated or influenced to give the impression of an altered reality.

She later would comment that from what she could see of how blindly and willingly I went into it all and was willing to include someone else in my (even though momentary) sense of reality, that if the wrong kind of person had wanted to manipulate me in that state it would have been pretty easy. When he was first starting tulpa stuff, Lance read something on a reddit about general warnings, and one was that some tulpas, typically younger ones but not always, who are doing close wonderland stuff with others can have difficulty in separating illusion from reality and this can lead to some really traumatic experiences with others who aren't trustworthy. He dismissed it as nonsense, wondering who would ever believe in roleplay that much, but now.. We gotta wonder.. For his part, he was there too during my experience, carefully observing, and said he probably wouldn't have believed it if he didn't experience it too. All in all, it was a fun new experience that was able to strengthen my bond to another great person and practice doing stuff in wonderland which is great training.

-----------------------------------------------------

I repeated this the next day, except I was leading and I was wonderland sharing with Matsuri. Now figuring there could be potential dangers, I knew I had absolute trust in my bestie so we wouldn't try to manipulate each other or anything and I just wanted to share a neat experience and she really wanted to try too. I tried to exactly replicate it pretty much the way I described earlier but she made a door and knocked to come in and I hopped up from the bed and let her in and we basically just happily hugged the whole time and talked, trying really hard to visualize each other and connect and make it as real an experience as we could. Maybe because I'd already done it once and kinda knew what to expect, it didn't quite feel as thrilling and new but Matsi and I have chatted for hours and hours and played games together and love hanging out so this was just a natural extension of that, or something, and we were able to connect stronger than usual from it. Intellectually and emotionally, we had the experience that we were really with each other and as best as we were capable of experiencing it, we were hugging and enjoying each other's company greatly.

At the end, when she was about to go, I asked her like I'd been asked "ok, so where are you right now?" and she said "with you silly" then paused and said "that question really messed me up, seriously" and I told her I can relate, it did the same thing to me. XD


Annnd Experiment 3: Intra-system
I explained my experience to Bear (we hadn't tried sharing with Matsi yet) and he seemed really interested. He asked a bunch of questions and seemed interested in replicating the process but internally, with system-mates. I had such a positive experience my first time sharing that when he asked, it really raised Lance and my curiosity as well. Could it be done in the same system? Would the same kind of connection be there? Would it be any different from typical wonderland stuff for us? So we gave it a try. We were trying to recreate my first experience as well as we could, with the added benefit that we wouldn't have to deal with typing and reading to break our immersion. We wondered if our existing intimate knowledge and and familiarity with each other would somehow blunt the same experience two completely different people could have. With all the unknowns between people not as personally close as headmates, maybe part of this was the thrill of connecting to someone outside?

First we took a few minutes to try and "check our doubts at the door". We both knew it could be emotionally powerful and didn't want things like "this is just silly roleplay" or "we already do this all the time" get in the way, if possible. He has been trying lately to figure out how to disassociate and part of that involved trying to convince himself that he wasn't the body, that we just were like roommates and it was the shared house, not "him" as an identity. He figured this would be good exercise for visualization and toward switching too. We were starting to consider that the interactions somehow produced a heightened state of suggestibility so maybe I could convince him he was really in wonderland, we figured, kinda like a tulpa-led hypnosis session. Anyway, we started and I led like Aurora did with me or I did with Matsi, and we took turns doing stuff and talking, doing stuff and talking. Simple hugs and cuddles, but made it a point to keep up body contact like rubbing each others backs, holding each other's hands, whatever we felt like as we just hung out, just to see if that was part of the bonding process. We have watched some hypnotists do the same thing to their subjects, after all, and made a point to do that too.

We did feel a connection, maybe a little more than usual, maybe the same as usual but we were just taking the time to notice it, we dunno. What we DID notice was we were taking our time and staying engaged and that was kinda new. We have gone through several times or phases in our wonderland activity and had gotten to the point where we tried to bypass our tenancy to get bored and fall asleep almost right away with rushing through things. Our visualization as never great either, so a simple blurry scene we are flying over or something seemed easy to stay in. Even that wasn't working out so great. We had gotten to the point where we were like daredevils, or thrill-seekers, looking for the next new, fresh, exciting experience and growing bored of the same old stuff or things that seemed too boring to keep us engaged. Bear's visualization scripts and exercises helped by providing structure we lacked because we never just got into the place and had stuff randomly happen, like I said before, it was like we were just putting on a puppet show and our forms were favorite puppets. The emotions had to be there or we pretty much experienced nothing but some imagery and a little bit of bonding but it was otherwise boring and starting to seem a little pointless to even keep up doing wonderland stuff anymore..

But this was different. We managed to get engaged or emotionally invested pretty quickly. Us taking turns provided structure and made our interactions seem more real. Instead of trying to seek some thrill, we were standing next to each other or hugging like actual people do, just calmly enjoying the experience and giving each other turns to talk and paying attention to each other respectfully. This is not exactly something we typically do, which may or may not be atypical in the community, so we dunno. We laid awake for almost 2 hours, trying to get wrapped up on what was going on inside and ignore the meat body on the outside. Most of it was in the bed, snuggled against each other peacefully and trying to fall asleep with no luck at all. Lance said so far our experiment felt about as real as he had ever felt in wonderland stuff, again, just with a strong intellectual and emotional experience being shared between us and deepening our bond a little. Unfortunately we had to be up in a few hours for a long work day and it seemed like we weren't gonna be able to actually fall asleep like this so we both kinda agreed he should hop out and "go sleep on the couch", as it were. It was a huge change from "ho hum", focus lost and asleep in 10 minutes. For better or worse. :P

The next day at work, we noticed that our "connection" seemed stronger, that our mind voices were a little more clear to each other and we were taking turns in our talk instead of just doing what we usually did, sorta trying to both smoosh the talk button at the same time and yelling over each other. It seemed to inject a bit of that structure, that polite and respectful order from the previous night and just, I dunno, worked out better for us.

It got us thinking that maybe all along we had been going at wonderland interaction wrong and we were just taken by the fantasy of it all and assuming we had to sprint through everything. Taking the time to have these calm, controlled interactions instead is not only easier to visualize and focus on but just so.. natural. Regular people respectfully exchange pleasant conversations like this, why have we been trying to make everything larger than life? It's hard to explain, we have even read guides before that mentioned an importance in taking time and focusing on details or trying to synthesize one little sensation at a time and add stuff in layers till a scene comes together.. We never got it to work too well, which made us think fast and exciting experiences were the answer and for a time that seemed to work but we were missing something, dunno what, to make the slow stuff work and I think we found it, so... Maybe we can start wonderland activity anew and work on the skills and foundation we have apparently been lacking this whole time?


Feel free to post any comments, suggestions, etc here and/or in Bear's thread here https://community.tulpa.info/thread-shared-wonderlands.

Aurora-Alley, my precious Senpai. I'm all hers!
Samantha-Alley, my Mama!
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01-07-2019, 12:37 PM
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Reilyn-Alley Offline
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#73
 
RE: Lance's Head, the Thread

Oh! I forgot to add that something which made a difference for us (we tried it both with and without) when Lance and I were trying the intra shared wonderland experiment was we still took the time to dictate our actions to each other. It was done the same as the text version with an outside person just.. without the text or computer or outside distractions stifling immersion. Basically, we were co-authoring a scene to each other, in as much surface detail as we wanted to, in order to help the other person really envision what was going on.

So, as an example, I want to give Lance headpats and tell him he means a lot to me. We describe events in either detached mindspeak or full-on mouth-moving talking in wonderland, if that doesn't seem too silly. This may vary between systems and even current mood and level of immersion what seems best. It might have gone something like this...

(In mindspeak, or even doing mouth-moving talking in wonderland if that doesn't seem too silly, I dictate: I walk up to you and crack a smile, bring my right hand up to give several loving headpats to your head. I meet your eyes and say with a conviction-

Then I definitely say this part out loud. "We are in this together to the end, little bro!"

Maybe I finish up with a firm pat on the shoulder or something, specifying which hand and how hard. 

All that gets my actions across pretty well, I think, gives him a lot to work with to fill the gaps of imagery and makes it easier to focus. It's also a bonding experience because hey, I wouldn't have said it, let alone gone into caring detail if I didn't mean it and besides, we have little problems conveying emotions to each other and experiencing those so now we have a whole detailed experience the feelings. Imo, sounds a lot better than just a faint visual image of me headpatting and speaking. Detailing the experience even makes me think about it deeper and express myself easier. It's a great exercise for both of us in several ways.

Aurora-Alley, my precious Senpai. I'm all hers!
Samantha-Alley, my Mama!
My PR page
01-08-2019, 12:51 AM
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