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Misinterpretation of “assuming sentience from start” philosophy.
Kiahdaj Offline
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#11
 
RE: Misinterpretation of “assuming sentience from start” philosophy.
I just think the point in your original post is a little too far from the fact that people are misinterpreting the philosophy.
It's more about the fact that if you don't put effort into your tulpa, it can cause problems, which is a no-brainer, and doesn't necessarily have anything to do with that philosophy.
It's true that people misinterpret it, but that main thing here is simply the fact that you shouldn't half-ass the process, which I thought people already knew.

"If this can be avoided, it should. If it can't, then it would be better if it could be. If it happened and you're thinking back to it, try and think back further. Try not to avoid it with your mind. If any of this is possible, it may be helpful. If not, it won't be."
(This post was last modified: 05-29-2013, 06:30 AM by Kiahdaj.)
05-29-2013, 06:29 AM
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MegaBusta
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#12
 
Default  RE: Misinterpretation of “assuming sentience from start” philosophy.
(05-29-2013, 06:29 AM)Kiahdaj Wrote: It's true that people misinterpret it, but that main thing here is simply the fact that you shouldn't half-ass the process, which I thought people already knew.

People are dumb. They have to have warning labels on coffee just so they don't burn themselves.
05-29-2013, 06:39 AM
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Spook 19 Offline
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#13
 
RE: Misinterpretation of “assuming sentience from start” philosophy.
I can attest to the same problem/mistake as cruse. I assumed my tulpae were sentient from the start and it probably skewed my perceptions of them. (Not to blame Phi, I wholeheartedly agree with that philosophy, if one actually realizes that it is more of a way of thinking rather than something you are just automatically given).

Basically, all of the conversations between myself and my tulpae to date have been (We're pretty sure) them infiltrating my consciousness and pushing my own thoughts back at me, they've never truly given me an 'alien' thought'. This type of communication certainly works. Up to a point.

To get past that point, tulpae must learn how to reach out to their 'host' on their own. Which requires time and attention on all sides, something that everyone here is saying in some form or another.

Kiahdaj, it isn't that people are trying to cut corners during the tulpa forcing process, it's that a lot of people, from what I've seen, don't realize the corners even exist. We got caught up in trying to make sure our tulpae are independent that we don't give them a chance to truly become so.

We're all on the same side here. So please, let's all stop fighting, hold hands, and sing Kumbaya as we tulpaforce into the sunset.
~Spook
(And yes, this is a better title cruse!)
05-29-2013, 06:42 AM
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Phi Offline
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#14
 
Default  RE: Misinterpretation of “assuming sentience from start” philosophy.
(05-29-2013, 06:29 AM)Kiahdaj Wrote: It's more about the fact that if you don't put effort into your tulpa, it can cause problems, which is a no-brainer

The idea started out as you sitting down and forming a bond with your tulpa by letting them know that the creation process was going to by cooperative and not just you forcing them one-sidedly. It was also supposed to give a basic shape to their "soul".
Then it suddenly because "they are sentient from the start" period. "You should just assume that they are sentient so that you don't hinder progress." (EDIT: Although the title of the original post agreed with this, it was originally much more than that.)
Then it went to "just believe that they are sentient from the start."
Then it became "your tulpa is already there."
Now it's "you don't have to do anything but passive forcing because your tulpa is already there."

People slowly lost their brains. I don't particularly blame them, it was like playing that old children's game, "telephone". One person tries to pass along an idea, and before long it's something completely different. Nobody stopped to think that maybe something was wrong.

(05-29-2013, 06:42 AM)Spook 19 Wrote: (Not to blame Phi, I wholeheartedly agree with that philosophy, if one actually realizes that it is more of a way of thinking rather than something you are just automatically given).

Thank you.
(This post was last modified: 05-29-2013, 06:53 AM by Phi.)
05-29-2013, 06:44 AM
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Viceroy Offline
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#15
 
Default  RE: Misinterpretation of “assuming sentience from start” philosophy.
Which is why it was good of Cruse to write up this thesis.

Cool theory in your sig there, Phi. Work those philosopher muscles.
(This post was last modified: 05-29-2013, 07:09 AM by Viceroy.)
05-29-2013, 07:01 AM
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Kiahdaj Offline
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#16
 
Default  RE: Misinterpretation of “assuming sentience from start” philosophy.
(05-29-2013, 06:42 AM)Spook 19 Wrote: it isn't that people are trying to cut corners during the tulpa forcing process, it's that a lot of people, from what I've seen, don't realize the corners even exist.

Yes, I suppose that really is true, for many.
But that's just because this whole phenomenon seems to have lost its art.
But don't even get me started on that.

"If this can be avoided, it should. If it can't, then it would be better if it could be. If it happened and you're thinking back to it, try and think back further. Try not to avoid it with your mind. If any of this is possible, it may be helpful. If not, it won't be."
05-29-2013, 07:04 AM
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Viceroy Offline
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#17
 
RE: Misinterpretation of “assuming sentience from start” philosophy.
I think you're trying to displace blame for your earlier outrage by making such apologetic statements. Why not simply apologize straight-up, instead of being bashful?
05-29-2013, 07:14 AM
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Kiahdaj Offline
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#18
 
RE: Misinterpretation of “assuming sentience from start” philosophy.
I'm sorry Viceroy, but you're just a whole new level of pathetic.

"If this can be avoided, it should. If it can't, then it would be better if it could be. If it happened and you're thinking back to it, try and think back further. Try not to avoid it with your mind. If any of this is possible, it may be helpful. If not, it won't be."
05-29-2013, 07:19 AM
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Viceroy Offline
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#19
 
RE: Misinterpretation of “assuming sentience from start” philosophy.
Try to stay focused. This discussion isn't about me. It's about you. We're examining your words, and the feelings you have behind them. Misdirecting tactics won't work here.
05-29-2013, 07:54 AM
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Semi-Nomadic Offline
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#20
 
Default  RE: Misinterpretation of “assuming sentience from start” philosophy.
(05-29-2013, 06:44 AM)Phi Wrote: The idea started out as you sitting down and forming a bond with your tulpa by letting them know that the creation process was going to by cooperative and not just you forcing them one-sidedly. It was also supposed to give a basic shape to their "soul".
Then it suddenly because "they are sentient from the start" period. "You should just assume that they are sentient so that you don't hinder progress." (EDIT: Although the title of the original post agreed with this, it was originally much more than that.)
Then it went to "just believe that they are sentient from the start."
Then it became "your tulpa is already there."
Now it's "you don't have to do anything but passive forcing because your tulpa is already there."

People slowly lost their brains. I don't particularly blame them, it was like playing that old children's game, "telephone". One person tries to pass along an idea, and before long it's something completely different. Nobody stopped to think that maybe something was wrong.
Excellent assessment.
To be frank, these days I'm increasingly afraid that in our zeal to distance ourselves from FAQ_Man's rigor, we've drifted away too far into the opposite end. For many people this will end with bitter disappointments months from now.
05-29-2013, 08:34 AM
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