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[Sentience] Tips for those who are getting "parrotnoid".
NekoiNemo Offline
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#51
 
RE: Tips for those who are getting "parrotnoid".
I understand your concerns since i had to struggle with the same problem for a while.
I can recommend listening closely to his reaction to what you have implanted and if you feel a slightest doubt that it's what he wanted to say - suggest him another option and see what he has to say about it. Of course, obvious downside is that it can sometimes turn into quite tedious throwing options at him like "Yes? No? No, not "no"? Then maybe "yes"? U-ugh, so was that a "no" then? ...".
It's nice to see you're so concerned about not putting words into his mouth Smile

現実に抗え!
04-25-2015, 06:03 PM
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Yori Offline
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#52
 
RE: Tips for those who are getting "parrotnoid".
I looked at this tip, but it stopped being reassuring for future me when OP suggested that parroting has to be deliberate. When people are parrotnoid, the main worry is that it wasn't their tulpa. You don't have to deliberately try to puppet or parrot to visualize your tulpa saying or doing something they didn't do. Remember "glitches", or unavoidable violent imagery? You didn't want that, but neither did your tulpa. Sometimes when I'm forcing a tulpa, I wait for them to say something I didn't premeditate it, but I know I'm not some insta-tulpa maker either.

I just wanted to point out that you can't assume something was your tulpa just because you didn't do it deliberately. That could lead to issues like, "Why did my tulpa just stab me?" Or "why is my tulpa trying to look like a golem and scare me?" :P This isn't the answer to the paranoia. You don't want to be paranoid, but you want to Listen to your actual tulpa, and your tulpa wants to be heard.
04-28-2015, 05:51 PM
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Luminesce Offline
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#53
 
RE: Tips for those who are getting "parrotnoid".
As a general rule for possible-parroting, whenever your tulpa does something you have doubt was entirely their own will, ask yourself "Would my tulpa want to do/say this? Would it hurt to give credit to my tulpa for this?"

Doing that pretty much solved any puppet/parrot problems I might've had almost instantly. I knew my tulpas had to develop and that worrying about if they really did/said something or not was hurting their progress, so I came up with that rule and it worked perfectly. Were Reisen's first words just "I love you"? Would she have anything wrong with me thinking they were? Not remotely so. And it didn't take terribly long before parroting was no longer a concern as their voices developed to a point where I could sort of "feel" them saying things, felt the intention and meaning. I wouldn't have gotten to that point if I were still doubting that they could even talk.

Hi! I'm Lumi, host of Reisen, Tewi, Flandre and Lucilyn.
Everyone deserves to love and be loved. It's human nature.
My tulpas and I have a Q&A thread, which was the first (and largest) of its kind. Feel free to ask us stuff.
04-29-2015, 02:04 AM
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Glitterbutt Offline
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#54
 
RE: Tips for those who are getting "parrotnoid".
(04-29-2015, 02:04 AM)Reisen Wrote: Were Reisen's first words just "I love you"? Would she have anything wrong with me thinking they were? Not remotely so. And it didn't take terribly long before parroting was no longer a concern as their voices developed to a point where I could sort of "feel" them saying things, felt the intention and meaning. I wouldn't have gotten to that point if I were still doubting that they could even talk.

I think Reisen said the same thing I am going to say but just in different words. It is kinda the same thing.

Puppeting and parroting! OMG! I realize why this is an issue for peeps and why they talk about it here. I don't know if it is right to tell my story when things like this come up. People take it as me trying to be pretentious and superior. But, I hope maybe it will help someone who is more like Davie and I and looking for answers.

Parroting and puppeting? Who cares?

Before David and I found Tulpa Info, we had no idea there was such a thing as "parroting" or that it is supposed to be bad. We still don't care. Meh. In fact, it seems a very silly thing to worry about. We have always operated the same way for decades. He calls me "Miss Sock Puppet" sometimes. Other times he can't get me to shut up and he gets frantic because I won't be quiet and let him sleep. So go fig. I can't help it, I get excited and wanna talk.

Like this morning at about 2:30am. I had some things I wanted to say on the forum and I woke him up. So, we got on the keyboard and he typed what he feels I want to say and hears my voice when he types, like we are sorta collaborating-merging, like right now. Exactly right now we are doing it again. Parroting? Role playing? Maybe. We don't know and quite frankly, we don't really care.

I think honestly that is my answer to "parrotnoia" is to say stop worryin bout it. If it's your tulpa talking, its your tulpa talking. David has never once said, in all the years I have been around, "Wait, was that Melian or just me?" It never occurred to us that it mattered. He knows I am him. I mean... *sigh*. It doesn't matter! He has always known I am driven by imagination at my core. HIS imagination.

Because of that we are immune to the fear of doubt, and things like parrotnoia. We just enjoy being together. We don't care what anyone else thinks of it. That doesn't matter either. We enjoy meeting so many other headmate peoples and people sorta like Davie. I like talking to people on the internet so much! But we are so not worried bout all these things that seem to give people anxiety.

OH btw, this is what I woke Davie up for, at 2:30am, so I could write it. https://community.tulpa.info/thread-is-s...-this-site

(This post was last modified: 07-21-2015, 12:05 AM by Mistgod.)
07-20-2015, 11:42 PM
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Haven Offline
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#55
 
RE: Tips for those who are getting "parrotnoid".
wow, this was so helpful! thank you!!
04-22-2016, 04:43 AM
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faraway Offline
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#56
 
RE: Tips for those who are getting "parrotnoid".
I have a question.
So, I'm new to creating tulpae, and just started creating my first one. His name is Jack, and I'm rather impressed by my own progress with wonderland immersion and visualization as well as his own development thus far on various things- however, I can't help but feel like I'm parroting.
Granted, I've only just started 3-4 days ago, however whenever he responds to a question I ask or something of the like, it feels like, somewhere in the back of my mind, I'm trying to think of a response, and not him. It's sort of like I'm trying to think of a response for him, and it feels like sort of artificial. Obviously, I do believe he sentient on some level as he can move on his own if I focus with him hard enough, but I'm not sure if he's speaking, or me simply wanting him to speak and imagining it.
However he is using his own voice I imagined for him and not mine, I can't get away from this. Any explanation or tips that could help at all?

Just me and Jack, taking walks in our wonderland~
1 tulpa: Jack, in development
"Whatever we plant in our subconscious mind and nourish with repitition and emotion will one day become a reality" - Earl Nightingale
03-24-2017, 03:02 PM
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tulpa001 Offline
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#57
 
RE: Tips for those who are getting "parrotnoid".
Here's a tip, give it time.

Assuming sentience from the start is not about believing your tulpa sentient/sapient when they aren't. It's about interacting with them as if they are. This is a basic yet effective strategy for forcing, that allows them to grow quickly early on.

Edit:

(1) If belief does anything, it is getting your subconscious to do work for you. Here's the secret. Whatever you invest emotion into, your subconscious listens to. If you worry about parroting, your subconscious is going to focus on that. This is not useful. If, you get excited about your tulpa, your subconscious is going to focus on that. This is very useful. It is the emotion, not the belief that matters.

(2) Your subconscious is in the process of internalising the processes that will make up your tulpa's core. You are peeking in on these forming processes. This is much easier when you can't see them, as this convinces the person these processes are alien. But you can see them. Because of psychology, you witness something inside yourself and automatically feel like it is you. Just how the mind works. This is both true and false at such an early stage.

Host comments in italics. tulpa's log.
(This post was last modified: 03-24-2017, 05:30 PM by tulpa001.)
03-24-2017, 05:09 PM
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faraway Offline
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#58
 
RE: Tips for those who are getting "parrotnoid".
(03-24-2017, 05:09 PM)tulpa001 Wrote: Here's a tip, give it time.

Assuming sentience from the start is not about believing your tulpa sentient/sapient when they aren't. It's about interacting with them as if they are. This is a basic yet effective strategy for forcing, that allows them to grow quickly early on.

Edit:

(1) If belief does anything, it is getting your subconscious to do work for you. Here's the secret. Whatever you invest emotion into, your subconscious listens to. If you worry about parroting, your subconscious is going to focus on that. This is not useful. If, you get excited about your tulpa, your subconscious is going to focus on that. This is very useful. It is the emotion, not the belief that matters.

(2) Your subconscious is in the process of internalising the processes that will make up your tulpa's core. You are peeking in on these forming processes. This is much easier when you can't see them, as this convinces the person these processes are alien. But you can see them. Because of psychology, you witness something inside yourself and automatically feel like it is you. Just how the mind works. This is both true and false at such an early stage.

 This actually helped quite a bit, thank you! I'll be sure to remember that next time I start worrying. Also a little off topic, but how much time does it usually take? I don't want it to take months and lose my drive because I feel like it's not happening, even if it is.

Just me and Jack, taking walks in our wonderland~
1 tulpa: Jack, in development
"Whatever we plant in our subconscious mind and nourish with repitition and emotion will one day become a reality" - Earl Nightingale
(This post was last modified: 03-24-2017, 06:53 PM by faraway.)
03-24-2017, 06:48 PM
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Heckhound Offline
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#59
 
RE: Tips for those who are getting "parrotnoid".
It may take months. I don't think anyone here can reassure you that it won't. Some things may take weeks, months or years, and if you really care about creating the tulpa, you'll just have to accept that and keep going, even when it seems like nothing is improving. Improvement can sometimes be in leaps, but most of the time it's tiny steps.

Don't give up, even if it takes months. This isn't a hobby.

Progress Report // discord: Glitchmeat#6112
Yesterday, 10:12 PM
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faraway Offline
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#60
 
RE: Tips for those who are getting "parrotnoid".
(Yesterday, 10:12 PM)Heckhound Wrote: It may take months. I don't think anyone here can reassure you that it won't. Some things may take weeks, months or years, and if you really care about creating the tulpa, you'll just have to accept that and keep going, even when it seems like nothing is improving. Improvement can sometimes be in leaps, but most of the time it's tiny steps.

Don't give up, even if it takes months. This isn't a hobby.

Yeah, I realized that last time I forced. He's starting off his development really quickly, but I'm sure it'll slow down a bit once we start on the more complex subjects of tulpa creation. Thank you for replying though, everyone is super helpful!

Just me and Jack, taking walks in our wonderland~
1 tulpa: Jack, in development
"Whatever we plant in our subconscious mind and nourish with repitition and emotion will one day become a reality" - Earl Nightingale
11 hours ago
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