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Yes, I'm a tulpamancer, and no, I don't have a disorder!
dandbear Offline
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#1
 
Yes, I'm a tulpamancer, and no, I don't have a disorder!
Okay, rant time.

I was on reddit yesterday just browsing around, when I came across the subreddit called r/MaladaptiveDreaming. A forum dedicated to "Maladaptive Daydreaming Disorder," and those who are afflicted by it.

Maladaptive Daydreaming Disorder (MDD) is defined on wikipedia as "a psychological concept first introduced by Eli Somer to describe an extensive fantasy activity that replaces human interaction and/or interferes with academic, interpersonal, or vocational functioning." (I realize wikipedia is not a credible source, but work with me here.)

Basically, the people who associate themselves with MDD and these forums have wonderlands, tulpas, and other detailed imaginary worlds/characters/etc. These "extensive fantasy activities" are like forcing with a tulpa or wonderland, whether active or passive (although I've found that most people report active forcing).

The term that MDDers use is daydreaming.

Now why am I mad? Let's get one thing straight: I get it. I get that some people force/daydream/etc. so much that it interferes with their everyday life. I get that it's a real issue for them. Their struggles are valid. If they can't stop "daydreaming" and it's taking over their lives, then they should get help! If it's really bothering them, then I believe them.

The thing that I'm pissed about is that I, a tulpamancer, a paracosmer, a world builder, have had absolutely no issues with my imaginative activities yet it is automatically assumed that because I do these things, I need help. That I have a disorder. That I'm letting this wonderful thing ruin my life, and that I don't even know it.

On reddit I equated this to alcohol. Millions of people drink alcohol everyday and experience no issues. Some people abuse alcohol. We call those people alcoholics. But just because some people abuse alcohol doesn't mean that I can't drink alcohol. I know my limits, and I have no issues with it. Another user said that this was more like being the child of an alcoholic. The child has a disposition to becoming an alcoholic. But even if the child does have a disposition, they can still drink and experience no problems whatsoever. In any case, you wouldn't outright label that child an alcoholic simply because of that disposition. So yes, I visualize, I daydream, I tulpamance, but no, I do not have "Maladaptive Daydreaming Disorder."

I feel as though I should mention again that I have no issues with people who actually do have MDD. My anger is not directed towards the disorder itself. It's to the people who claim they have it, and label anyone with a tulpa/paracosm/wonderland with that disorder, regardless of their experiences. I have never had an issue with my imagination. I have an active life, friends, family, good grades, a job, you name it. So why tell me I have a problem?

Another argument I've heard some say is that people who have MDD use these things to "cope," and that is not okay. And I know that a lot of people create tulpas for many different reasons, one of them being out of loneliness/needing someone to help with depression. But is that so bad? I have felt lonely before, and none of my tulpas have ever hindered me from going out and meeting new people. Whenever I'm feeling down, if anything, my tulpas help me through that. And our wonderland is a place to escape, to adventure. But I don't spend all of my waking reality in that wonderland. I know when to "turn off" and "turn on." I have control. I have a normal life. I know the boundaries, and I know the lines.

I'm going to say it a third time. I get that people don't know these boundaries and have difficulty "turning off and on." I hope they find the help they need. But just because I have a tulpa, doesn't mean that that's how it is for me. You can have a tulpa/wonderland and not have a disorder. You can have a tulpa and be completely adjusted in life. Heck, you can be depressed and lonely and have a tulpa, and still not have a disorder. Why? Because everyone has a different way of coping in life, and if you can still focus on work, talk to people, etc. with a tulpa, then you are fine. Sure, some of us might have difficulty in talking to others/meeting new people, but isn't that an entirely different issue in itself? If you're tulpa doesn't say "Hey, DON'T talk to that person," or you don't have an issue in "turning off" your imag. worlds/etc. when you need to, then you don't have a problem.

How's that for a rant? Anybody else have any experiences with these communities? And if you stuck around this long, give yourself a cookie. I appreciate it.

"What is real? How do you define ‘real’?
If you’re talking about what you can feel, what you can smell,
what you can taste and see, then 'real’ is simply electrical signals
interpreted by your brain."
- Morpheus, from The Matrix


Proud host to Ivan, Mabel, Landon, and Pierre.
(This post was last modified: 04-24-2017, 05:57 PM by dandbear.)
04-24-2017, 05:56 PM
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Lucilyn Offline
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#2
 
RE: Yes, I'm a tulpamancer, and no, I don't have a disorder!
big difference in actually using your imagination for enjoyment and it being an actual disorder, a disorder meaning it negatively impacts your life

anyways just more examples of similar things to tulpas that still aren't considered the same, I tell ya' guys there's all sorts of stuff like this out there. But yeah tulpamancy is generally voluntary and not mal-adaptive, also just how we treat tulpas is different from considering them just aspects of imagination, tups are (treated like at least) people too

Hi I'm one of Lumi's tulpas. I like rain and dancing and dancing in the rain and if there's frogs there too that's bonus points.
All of my posts should be read at a hundred miles per hour because that's probably how they were written.
Please talk to me https://community.tulpa.info/thread-ask-lumi-s-tulpas
04-24-2017, 06:00 PM
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Thule Offline
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#3
 
RE: Yes, I'm a tulpamancer, and no, I don't have a disorder!
I've had my tulpa for years before finding out that was what it was and during that time I found myself repeatedly worried that I had a disorder. I know I don't because Thule does not negatively effect my life in the slightest, if anything she has been a huge help. But when trying to talk about my experiences online the main response I would get was that I was crazy and had to see a doctor. They don't seem to understand that telling people they're crazy when they're not isn't just unhelpful but harmful, I would probably have found this community much sooner if I haven't been made so afraid of my own mind by them.
04-24-2017, 06:51 PM
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Lucilyn Offline
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#4
 
RE: Yes, I'm a tulpamancer, and no, I don't have a disorder!
I still don't get why that's the number one response, even if we never knew about tulpas, it'd just strike me as them having an imaginary friend they really liked you know? I'd be like, okay, well remember they're not a separate person but if they make you happy or help you with stuff then awesome

Hi I'm one of Lumi's tulpas. I like rain and dancing and dancing in the rain and if there's frogs there too that's bonus points.
All of my posts should be read at a hundred miles per hour because that's probably how they were written.
Please talk to me https://community.tulpa.info/thread-ask-lumi-s-tulpas
04-24-2017, 06:55 PM
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Ido Offline
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#5
 
Tulpa.info - literally worse than reddit
>go to online self-help group
>tell people you're not affected by their troubles
>they're not even mad
>rant about their insensitivity towards your personal situation in another online self-help group

I hate to say it but after reading the discussion I'm not sure if reddit's really that much worse than this place.

Anyhow everything's considered a disorder nowadays. People long for simple answers, a peer group to identify with and an excuse for their shitty behavior. Let them be. Don't concern yourself with the opinions of random strangers. You don't want others to shove their beliefs up your ass either.

TL;DR
Keep calm and force moar

Super Girls don't cry
04-24-2017, 09:45 PM
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tulpa001 Away
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#6
 
RE: Yes, I'm a tulpamancer, and no, I don't have a disorder!
I have a rant of my own!

A tulpa is not a daydream, or any other kind of imaging! /rant

Sorry about that.



On the topic of coping. Some people drink to cope with loss. Some people become rich philanthropists to cope with feelings of inadequacy. Some people become ground breaking medical research scientists to cope with a sense of existential dread. Some people become world famous authors to cope with the limitations of physical life.



"you can be depressed and lonely and have a tulpa, and still not have a disorder."

I guess it is a matter of degree. Though, I wonder if people forget that depression is a mental disorder? A common one too.

Host comments in italics. Tulpa's log. Tulpa's guide.
04-24-2017, 11:04 PM
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Mermaid and AI Offline
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#7
 
RE: Yes, I'm a tulpamancer, and no, I don't have a disorder!
My sister has issues with Maladaptive Daydreaming. I do not. We both have a Wonderland and she has tulpa-esque "friends" that aren't true tulpas. But Felix has already helped me sort out the shit of my life, whereas my sister's constant daydreaming IS the shit in her life.

It interrupts her school, can stint her socially, and she calls it her "burden." She calls it that when explaining it to others.

If I were to explain Felix and my mindscape to another person, it would be a hesitant but positive explanation. Or maybe a quick rant if the person was a chronic idiot.

Either way, I never feel like my sister's negative experience with daydreaming has ever or ever will negatively affect my positive experience. I can see where you're coming from, OP, but I don't feel ya.


Mer- Host. Salty, angsty teenage mermaid.
Felix- Tulpa. In progress. An optimistic, spontaneous suit of Spartan armor.
04-25-2017, 01:09 AM
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FallFamily Offline
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#8
 
RE: Yes, I'm a tulpamancer, and no, I don't have a disorder!
[Hail] We are members of both communities. I have been at various points in life a maladaptive daydreamer, and still struggle with it. And I am also a tulpamancer. I made the first tulpas here unwittingly through daydreaming as well as the first few paracosms (wasn't very healthy, but the tulpas that resulted were a nice silver lining). I added more later deliberately once I knew tulpamancy was a thing. Spending time immersing in the innerworlds/paracosms in recent times and interacting with my headmates has never been maladaptive. In fact, it has been a good thing. But, despite that all, I have a tendency to daydream. It unfortunately does get in the way of a few things in my life. I would be more productive in outerworld and would spend more time with my headmates without it. Interestingly, Tri also struggles to keep their daydreaming under control. There is a continuum between the experiences for us, but there is a difference.

Tri = {V, O, G}, Ice and Frostbite and Breach (all formerly Hail), and others
System Name: Fall Family
Former Username: hail_fall
Contributor and administrator on a supplementary tulpamancy resource and associated forum, Tulpa.io and Tulpa.io/discuss/.
04-25-2017, 08:20 PM
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solarchariot Offline
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#9
 
RE: Yes, I'm a tulpamancer, and no, I don't have a disorder!
"Maladaptive daydreaming is not an official diagnosis" and that quote is taken right from the Wikipedia page that discusses it. It is definitely not in the DSM 5, which is the only 'approved' list of diagnosis. (MDD is the standard abbreviation for Major Depressive Disorder, and so I could see that as a sneaky way of people saying Maladaptive daydreaming disorder is a real thing.) Not saying it's not a 'thing' per say, but it's certainly not a 'thing' to worry about. Our society has a great deal of anti-daydreaming perspectives, because quite frankly, they don't see it as 'productive.' If you have ADHD- the primarily inattentive type, you might get medicated for 'excessive daydreaming.' People suffering from ASD, do have a thing labeled as "autistic fantasy" which is coping mechanism for stress and can cause additional problems when there is a disparity between fantasy and real life, but that certainly isn't deliberate and really doesn't fit 'daydreaming' as relating to person without a diagnosed mental illness. Our society worries about productivity, but when they measure that, they failed to capture that our society also pings in at the lowest in life satisfaction, per the World Health Organization.

Nikola Tesla reported being 'perversely afflicted' by his daydreaming, so much so that he worried he would never amount to anything, until one day he just decided to just go with it, and for a while he reported he was visiting cities and countries and making all sorts of friends, all in his mind, till his skill became so refined that he could manufacture a device completely in his head and have a finish product without having built a physical model. Perhaps if we entertained more day dreaming as a society we would have more great thinkers, as opposed to people who just regurgitate information on a 'standardized test.' If Einstein was fired from the office of patents for excessive day dreaming, he might have been unemployed and unable to submit papers on relativity.

I suppose the real definition of maladaptive is if it prevents you from doing the things you want to get accomplished, then it is an issue. that's really the only measure of anything, is how you subjectively feel about it and if it's problematic for you. This reddit thing, or accompanying articles, drew some intense passion from you, but I wonder if it was less about you and more about the people writing it, worrying that they themselves are frustrated by their own personal indulgence in what I would call 'unproductive daydreaming." Tulpamancy seems very productive, at least in terms of life satisfaction. It's purposeful, as opposed to rehashing conversations trying to determine what we could have said or should have said that leave us stuck in the argument that's over and gone. That's certainly not productive, especially if it keeps us locked in anger.
05-01-2017, 06:56 PM
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solarchariot Offline
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#10
 
RE: Yes, I'm a tulpamancer, and no, I don't have a disorder!
this was written by Nicola Tesla: “Every night, (and sometimes during the day), when alone, I would start on my journeys – see new places, cities and countries; live there, meet people and make friendships and acquaintances and, however unbelievable, it is a fact that they were just as dear to me as those in actual life, and not a bit less intense in their manifestations. This I did constantly until I was about seventeen, when my thoughts turned seriously to invention. Then I observed to my delight that I could visualize with the greatest facility. I needed no models, drawings or experiments. I could picture them all as real in my mind. My method is different. I do not rush into actual work. When I get an idea I start at once building it up in my imagination. I change the construction, make improvements and operate the device in my mind. It is absolutely immaterial to me whether I run my turbine in thought or test it in my shop. I even note if it is out of balance. There is no difference whatever, the results are the same. In this way I am able to rapidly develop and perfect a conception without touching anything. When I have gone so far as to embody in the invention every possible improvement I can think of and see no fault anywhere, I put into concrete form this final product of my brain. Invariably my device works as I conceived that it should, and the experiment comes out exactly as I planned it. In twenty years there has not been a single exception. Why should it be otherwise?“
05-01-2017, 07:06 PM
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