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  1. Sorry, if this is off topic, but... I just found out about the situation, and it makes me really sad. As I'm another trans tulpamancer² I would so have loved to see where she would have taken things, and that... is just so damn disappointing. ._. Also, it is another thing that will probably reflect badly on the whole healthy-plurality-community. Media will always be drawn to the shitty things first, right? Gah. :´- ( ² by some definitions of the word. Most of my headmates are in a process of reintegrating I think... other things in life took my attention.
  2. People wrongly capitalizing english nouns could also just be german-speaking people writing english. We have a Tendency to do that, you know.^^ I might tend towards being an elitist... but I know just enough about language to know that there is no such thing as wrong spelling on a fundamental level. All the words and phrases we use today were wrong at some time in history. :-)
  3. As a non native-speaker, "tulpae" confuses me and I also didn't know how to even pronounce it. (I mean, I had Latin in school, but the latin pronounciation is not the same as the english pseudo-latin one, right?) In german tulpa-tumblrs (which I do not follow but I have looked into once or twice) I have seen the word "Tulpe" used as a slang for tulpa - which is the german word for "tulip". Language is fun. Also, in languages with grammatical genders, you can have endless debates about what gender the word "tulpa" should be.^^ I don't know where, but I think I've read somewhere that Tibetan nouns don't even have a plural form? Two tulpa. Twolpa? :-D I have found my new favourite plural.^^ Tulpamancy is kind of fancy.^^ I guess "tulpology" wouldn't really sound good, because the "o" sound is strange for a word that ends in -a. Tulpa theory? Tulpa studies? Tulpalogy? Tulpassion? ^^
  4. Hey, So what happened on monday was that I was talking to my therapist, and she suggested that I formally retire my tulpa or something like that. I was pretty revulsed by that idea and this left me in a bad state, wondering if she was right - it's the first time I ever considered completely giving up. I am very grateful that there is this forum, where I could express my worries and people answering. So thank you, tulpa001, Lucylin, Breach. :-) I think I have kind of answered my question "what to do? where to go??" - I don't need to go anywhere. I may not be completely happy with where I am, but I do not know that it would be much better for me elsewhere. Hm, of course, my headmates "exist". But my fantasy worlds also exist, as do my musical works. All of these could be said to have some life and independence in them, but I don't consider them persons... However I do feel responsibility towards my creative work, and I think I will hold myself responsible in a similar manner for my headmates. Ah. It took me a while to understand what you said here... I think there could be invasive thoughts that don't belong to anyone specifically, but rather to the system as a whole. But yes, people saying stuff they didn't mean to say can also be conceptualized as just being very extroverted. (And one of Graihos defining character traits is to be very random and very extroverted, so saying pretty much anything is in-character... which is probably the reason why I have difficulty deciding if a particular sentence comes from her.) No, sadly I don't speak french at all. I do speak german though.^^ "écriture automatique" is a fixed term in surrealism (which, of course, originated largely in France) I don't know... I am looking forward to more people studying this. Even many trans issues are not well-understood, let alone tulpas, let alone the intersection between both. ;-) I know that dissoctiation or depersonalisation are symptoms of gender dysphoria. So I wonder if: - I just was trans all along, and didn't realize, but expressed some of those hidden feelings in the form of tulpas. or - I was *not* trans before, and only got gender dysphoria after integrating a large part of Nailann (and possibly others) The most ridiculous thing that's going on is that Graiho isn't sure whether she is entire female - so it's possibly that there is a transmasculine tulpa inside a transfemine host. XD I won't be able to answer those question definitively, problably never will. I'm ... okay with that. Let there be science to figure it all out.^^ I as a host have sometimes doubted of being real.^^ The way I see it, the whole concept of personal identity might just not be anything more than a social construction - that is, I am who I present myself in interaction with others. Following that, my tulpas do have more personal identity, the more people they interact with - mostly each other, and me... Yeah. I was considering doing a full month of intense forcing... but no, I don't think I have the time and motivation, and I'm not certain I even want separation. I'm asking myself: What would I gain from separation? Instead of building a mental wall between me and my headmates, I would rather explore the vast regions of subconciousness-land - possibly together, possibly alone. I think in dreams and fantasies there are possibly hundreds of lesser thoughtforms that one can interact with. I do still wish to have a companion when I explore my dreams... but dreaming of/with my headmates turned out to be reeeaaaally hard and frustrating, which is why I gave that up and just talked to them during the day. (I've been lucid dreaming for a decade, but my skills are nowhere near that which I would require.) Very true. I feel a bit bad about it, but my statement was just about being able to do something or not - that I don't think I can invest much energy in regularly socialising with my headmates. Regularly doing anything does not come naturally to me. It's possibly related to ADHD... So forcing would look more like the way I approach everything else: Many month of ignoring, then a few days or weeks of very intense interest, then back to nothing. That's how my mind functions, apparently... I don't quite understand that... how does possession enable a tulpa to force themselves? What does that even mean? Automatic writing - in the most rigorous form - results in me writing whatever thought pops up in my head. The result is usually nonsensical, but sometimes there are hidden ideas, more like shadows of thoughts I had. I tried something similar to possession - playing a piano piece while instructing one of my headmates to take control over how I play. This has resulted in some very interesting interpretations. However, the last few times I tried that, I didn't feel like it worked. I am easily frustrated, so I'm anxious of trying it again. :-/ Hm... I think I don't believe in any separate "willpower" thing. It's more like: Different desires or needs have different strengths. Wanting to contradictory things results in loss of motivation, wanting two very easily aligned things boosts it. The strength of a desire might be measured in "willpower"? ^^ Well, as you said, it's complicated. Not something I have to understand in the next five minutes. ;-)
  5. Thanks for the answer. I appreciate the effort even though at the moment, I think I need to find my own specific solutions. Yeah, I made the mistake to try to explain the situation to my therapist today... I don't blame them, but they have a particular mindset (integrative gestalt therapy) that runs exactly in the opposite direction. "Integrative" meaning they would obviously prefer me to integrate my tulpas back into my personality. Which is... not what I want, currently. I think I cannot support a being that requires constant reinforcing, even if it is just socialising. But maybe I'll work out a schedule that is more like "once a month, plus whenever we feel like it". As I'm thinking a lot about tulpas right now, I obviously will talk to them more. I don't understand willing something - even as host personality. All I can see is needs, desires, pain, and other emotions. "Will" seems to be some sort of meta-construct that is crucial to forming identities, usually, but seems to be somewhat useless to me. I'd rather just feel the emotions directly. This may or may not make any sense. My mind is running wild with finding new ideas to cling to.
  6. Hey, I'm constantly drifting between doubting everything tulpa-related, ignoring it for a few months, then coming back, trying again, feeling frustrated... at this point I simply don't know what to do anymore, or even what I want. :-( - My system (if it is one) started way back in 2010, or even 2009, or 2005 (very early vaguely-related experimenting). I did not know anything about tulpas back then (I think the tulpa community didn't even exist, right?). What I did was driven by several different motivations: 1) I met some very interesting dream characters while lucid dreaming, and I desperately wanted to see them again. I may have spoken out loud to them occasionally during the day with the intention of increasing the chance of dreaming of them. 2) I accidentally wrote some characters in a way that gave them a lot of autonomy. This interested me and encouraged me to talk to them as if they were real persons. 3) I practiced automatic writing (écriture automatique) due to a huge interest in surrealism and the possibility to explore my own unconscious. Some of these experiments also turned up some very shallow pseudo-characters (all of which have vanished shortly after). These experiences lead me to the writing techniques described above. 4) I was lonely and started talking to a character from a story I wrote, pretending he was there. He eventually felt somewhat real to me, but I did not assume that he was an autonomous being, rather a very clever simulation (Remember, I did not know about tulpas at all) that was extremely helpful for therapeutic functions, coaching me. All of these culminated in 2010, as I started regularly writing chats with the characters I had at this time. By this point I was curious to see how real they could become. (My main concept behind this was still "dream characters" which would be autonomous to a certain point since they "represented" a part of my subconscious.) Dreaming of them turned out to be really hard, so I eventually got used to mostly communicating to them via chat. I would write it like this: A: Hey there ;-) B: Hi. A: I don't really feel well today. B: Hm, what exactly do you feel? ... and so on. On the one hand, this style of communication worked really well for us. So well that I came to think of them as individual people... sort of. I was reluctant to go that far. As I said, dreaming was hard, so I only managed to meet a few of them for very short times (where we usually just hugged and then I woke up). In 2011, another dream character left such a strong impression on me that I added them to the team - she felt just as independent as the others from the beginning. But how independent was that? Well, on some level I felt it was still basically a pretense. By 2012 I had become a skeptic and renounced a lot of my older esoteric beliefs. I told myself it didn't matter if it was pretense, if it worked well as a form of self-therapy and a source of fun. - But then I found the tulpa-community, and it completely crushed all my concepts. I was excited that I had found something - that there seemed to be a way to continue my exploration, making my characters more independent even. But also the community introduced me to a lot of doubts that I didn't have before: The concept of tulpas as full persons, ethical questions, the crippling fear that parroting would harm them... it was all too much. Also, I couldn't live up to the high ideals that I saw in the community: Visualization? Forcing every day? My depression and executive dysfunction made that completely impossible. The more I read in the forums, the more I saw that I couldn't possibly be a tulpamancer by these standards. But I also couldn't just do what I had done before... writing my chat logs with my headmates didn't feel right anymore, because I had read such amazing stories about what tulpas could be. I tried talking to them during walks, which worked a few times and was a source of endless frustration and worries of parroting other times. Things have gotten even more complicated since then. I now also have to deal with gender dysphoria... I probably always was slightly trans, but I also have the suspicion that at least in part it is related to one of my female headmates, Nailann. It feels like I have integrated her pretty much entirely into my core personality. Resulting in me being bigender, and Nailann no longer an active headmate.. - Now I don't know where to go. Based on what I read on this forums, my headmates probably don't qualify as fully formed tulpas. Graiho is the most vocal - she can feel somewhat independent when I sit down and chat with her, but there is only a very small amount of individual thoughts - I can feel her thoughts forming, and very often we just think exactly the same thing and then only decide on a whim who's going to say it "officially". There is an element of pretense in it, even while I think that she is a thoughtform of some kind, and I care a lot about her... I worry that I simply am not able to make her any more independent or fully-formed-tulpesque than she is now. She rarely has her own opinion, and when we talk about what she *wants*, I feel nothing and she also doesn't know what to say - or isn't capable of wanting something? I'm not sure... I had chats with her, in which she said that she wanted to become a tulpa fully, ... but even then, it didn't quite feel right. I have the suspicion now that it is basically just me projecting what I want at a given moment, and she sensing that and saying it. She's exactly as clever as I am, because she uses my thoughts for thinking - which I fear will prevent any further development. But even if I decided to actively force her in a way that is more consistent with the tulpa-community, instead of my heavy-parroted chats... I don't feel capable of doing so. I have an abysmal visual imagination, and I do have ADHD, so focusing on a thing for longer than a few minutes is only possibly if I have a structure to follow. (Like in writing) If Graiho is already sentient - then I don't need to force her more (since apparently, she is fine with me ignoring her for a month occasionally) If Graiho is not sentient - then there is no one to worry about. I wouldn't need to force her, I simply should give up tulpamancy altogether, since I am not really capable of it anyway... If, however, she is somewhere in the middle - then I feel obligated to do something about it. And I'd feel terrible for having been a very unkind host for the longest time. (Even though all my headmates tell me it's okay - maybe that was parroting, and they're actually NOT okay with how I tend to ignore them most of the time.) :-( Gnrnaaahh... I appreciate any advice - I didn't intend to produce quite that much text, but this has been bugging me for years and I feel like I need to dump those thoughts somewhere.
  7. We had to deal with intrusive thoughts a while ago... so I can relate to your situation a bit, though we had the advantage that the situation was not directly tulpa-related (but it did affect forcing negatively). As others have already stated, the first thing that comes to mind is to argue your way out of it, using the belief that it is simply impossible for a tulpa to jump to someone elses mind. But for that, obviously, you need to have a worldview that makes it impossible. If your concern is mainly about self-fulfilling prophecies - then I see two potential ways to combat that. The first would be to cut yourself off from the source of the intrusive thoughts - whether through some action in the physical world (talking to your friend about it) or just the mental decision to stay away from stuff that will feed into your intrusive thoughts. Allow yourself to have any bad emotions if they are real. The second option would be to try to fight back the "self-fulfilling prophecy" with its own weapons; basically creating a competing prophecy and investing energy into that. I don't know how to express this... I've been through a lot of shitty places, and whenever I actually made the effort to speak with my tulpas I found that they were pretty much the best support I could imagine. The idea that a tulpa would leave their host because they don't like their host feels kind of ... unrealistic or even absurd to me. I assume that you have some positive ideas about their personality - and I don't think intrusive thoughts can override that so easily. So maybe you need to wait until those thoughts get "recycled out" of your system, and then start fresh - you don't need to beat yourself up for not continuing forcing all the time. It is totally possible to just make a break. (This has been me imagining myself in your situation. Take my words with caution as I'm not you and things might work out differently.)
  8. IIRC, Luhrmann talks about it in a similar fashion in her book. (I'm still only about 50% into it, but my impression is that she is very nice to believers and doesn't make statements about god itself, only about the experiences.) Those questions would interest me as well, but I think it could be hard to come up with widely-accepted definitions of all the different terms. Maybe you, ford, could make a video about those sometime in the future? Or maybe interview (off-air) people using the different words to describe their system, and sum it up or something? - or ask Luhrmann if she has found different types in her research, and what those would be. Good luck with the next interview! You've done an awesome job so far. :-)
  9. I'm currently in the middle of Luhrmann's book, so I was very pleased to see (hear) this today. You seemed to get along well. :-) Very cool to hear that there are more people interested in research on these topics. I hope they will eventually come up with things that are helpful in practice, but of course just generally destigmatizing and getting the idea out to psychologists in general already helps. (edit: Something seems to be broken with the layout of your post... o_0 )
  10. This thread fits somewhat into my current thoughts. I have been a parroting-heavy-host for pretty much the entire time. Whenever a tulpa got silent (because I didn't pay attention for months) my approach to bring them back was to *try* to parrot until I recognize some automatic response. Sometimes this worked, sometimes it didn't and I ended up parroting a few lines and gave up. So right now pretty much all my headmates are silent, because I had other stuff in my mind the last few months. For some reason I don't want to parrot - this time. I was able to get some contact in a few lucid dreams (not direct, but indirect communication, ie, a letter). This way it felt much more real, that is, much less "forced", arbitrary, whatever. Like even if I don't know who exactly I am contacting, at least there is a part of my subconscious that does respond. I kind of assume that my headmates are down there somewhere, when I forget about them, so... Uh-oh. I don't think I'm able to do that. No pun intended. But I also think it's not technically correct. I do not want to stop my brain thinking - because my headmates use the same facilities, so to speak, as me. They would just stop thinking as well. There is a specific type of thinking that needs to stop, however. The type of thinking that is closely associated with "I think this, I do that" - so maybe something along the lines of "dream logic", "dream thinking" or "automatic thinking" is more what I'm looking for. Hmm. So, my personal step goes "Encourage dream logic thinking" instead of "Stop thinking". Sorry, I'm obviously just thinking aloud in this thread. ;-)
  11. I'd formulate it "For a certain type of believer, God is a thoughtform similar to a tulpa." (Not all theistic people pray on regular basis or even at all)
  12. When I feel like I'm parroting, I usually ask my headmate if I am. Quite often, the answer is something like "yeah, you kinda were, but you said exactly what I wanted to say, so it doesn't matter". Other times, when I feel I'm not getting a clear response from one of my headmates, I just talk to someone else... I have to learn to respect that not everyone is always in the mood to talk, anyway.
  13. When I think of a pink elephant, I do not see a pink elephant. Yet, the image of a pink elephant-nose* lingers somewhere in the back of my mind. If I was trying to draw an elephant, I would try to use that. It is not a real picture for me, as I absolutely suck at visualisation. So I would encourage you to not draw conclusions too early. While it is possible that you don't see a mental image at all, it might be just that you are bad at it - like me.^^ Try out as many different senses as possible. Seeing is not for everyone. Imagine the sound of a voice, imagine the way your hand feels when you touch the bark of a tree, stuff like that; imagine the taste of soup, of salt, ... I don't do visual imposition with my headmates (and honestly, the idea didn't even occur to me before I found this forums) so it is not something that is required for tulpas or other thoughtforms. * If some native speaker wants to tell me what the elephant's long nose is called, I'd appreciate it. It's not exactly an easy thing to google, as I just found out. :-D
  14. I never got into Jung. I've picked up a book by him in the library at least four times, but every time I sneak-peek into it I get immediately turned off by the overall vagueness of his language... and I think to myself that there is probably no reason to read something as outdated with modern psychology. The concept of "anima/animus" however, I used to like to some degree. A lot of my early soulbonding/tulpamancy was playing with the idea of exploring my female sides. In the last few years though, I read a lot about transgender issues and gender identity... and now the "anima"-thing doesn't really fit well into that. Yes, there is some kind of idea of female-ness in my head. We all have that, otherwise we wouldn't even have gender roles out there - but it's just that, it's a construct that we learned early on from our surrounding society, and not something that is in-built much. Which lead to the confusing situation that every single of my headmates does have a very strong idea of his/her gender, but I don't. As host I'm either agender, cis-by-default or bigender, depending on my mood.^^ It hinges on the question whether my headmates can be (in part) considered to be representing different aspects of me. I know that tulpas are usually very clear about not being aspects, but different people. That's why I'm trying to use the term "tulpa" less for us... the thing is, we are kind of in-between. Lūna and Nailann are both their own relative personalities and representations of aspects of my own character. I also learn from them, so even if in the beginning Graiho was much much more extroverted than me, I adopted much of that for myself (since it is a lot of fun!) and our speech and personalities have become more similar. It feels like by giving Graiho the opportunity to behave how she wants, the part of myself that also wants to be like that is freed. (This sounds kind of like the shamanic idea of "finding your lost soul-parts" - which is yet another way to think about it^^)
  15. There is not a single option in the poll that I can check. :-( I'm going with my new belief that "sentience" is not a term that can be applied to either tulpas or hosts, or any thought-forms, personas, whatever. -> My body is sentient. <- My headmates are sometimes somewhat independent, but that has nothing to do with sentience.