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How "human" are tulpas, tulpa rights, and more.
Ayaze Offline
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#1
 
How "human" are tulpas, tulpa rights, and more.

How much like you and I are tulpas?
Can tulpas go to heaven?
Should tulpas have citizenship?
What do you think?
09-08-2014, 09:03 PM
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amber5885
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#2
 
RE: How "human" are tulpas, tulpa rights, and more.

1) quite a lot. They have wants, desires, morals, goals an feelings. They have thought and viewpoints individual to them.

2) no one can answer this.

3) are you serious?

I think you're a troll and/or you really have no idea what a tulpa actually is.
09-08-2014, 09:15 PM
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Ayaze Offline
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#3
 
RE: How "human" are tulpas, tulpa rights, and more.

(09-08-2014, 09:15 PM)amber5885 Wrote: 1) quite a lot. They have wants, desires, morals, goals an feelings. They have thought and viewpoints individual to them.

2) no one can answer this.

3) are you serious?

I think you're a troll and/or you really have no idea what a tulpa actually is.

isnt there respect rules?

anyway, i think that, in terms of my heaven, no

and for us citizenship? well, what about clones?

we can probably scan brains for signs of tulpas.

but this could get tricky

EDIT: this was meant for discussion, not my personal q/a, that would be in the q/a area. and with the first question, i know how human they are. it may have seemed in the wording i dont, but it was meant to be rhetorical.

sorry for confusion.
(This post was last modified: 09-08-2014, 09:20 PM by Ayaze.)
09-08-2014, 09:18 PM
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amber5885
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#4
 
RE: How "human" are tulpas, tulpa rights, and more.

Clones and tulpas are not the same thing. You're creating a seperate consciousness within yourself so whatever rights you have they have. They cannot act separately from you on the physical plane therefore rights, citizenship or anything like that doesn't even make sense.
09-08-2014, 09:20 PM
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Ayaze Offline
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#5
 
RE: How "human" are tulpas, tulpa rights, and more.

But what makes a person, their physical presence or mental one?
09-08-2014, 09:21 PM
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amber5885
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#6
 
RE: How "human" are tulpas, tulpa rights, and more.

Sorry if I seem snippy but there's been an influx of asinine questions and trolls here since that article came out about tulpas. It's tiresome

As far as citizenship? Their physical one. An astral body cannot be granted citizenship
09-08-2014, 09:22 PM
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Ayaze Offline
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#7
 
RE: How "human" are tulpas, tulpa rights, and more.

(09-08-2014, 09:22 PM)amber5885 Wrote: Sorry if I seem snippy but there's been an influx of asinine questions and trolls here since that article came out about tulpas. It's tiresome

As far as citizenship? Their physical one. An astral body cannot be granted citizenship

1. i could imagine that. sorry for my poor wording, i was sort of led in to this with kdhasudai's (dont remember his name) ultimate guide, and read a bit of faq man's too, so i have a good idea of this stuff.

2. i agree. but i think that killing a tulpa is as morally incorrect as killing a real person (as in a fully sentient and independent tulpa)
09-08-2014, 09:29 PM
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Leaf Offline
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#8
 
RE: How "human" are tulpas, tulpa rights, and more.

This is going to be borderline metaphysics soon.
1) We thought about this on several occasions and I like the simplicity of what Rhia once suggested. I think that I think and she is a thought that thinks. Hence, thoughtform.
2) Impossible to know, though probably closer to no.
3) Um good luck with that.
Quote:I think you're a troll and/or you really have no idea what a tulpa actually is.
Easy, they did just join this month though I kinda agree.

Unless you believe, you shall not understand.
(This post was last modified: 09-08-2014, 09:35 PM by Leaf.)
09-08-2014, 09:34 PM
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waffles Offline
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#9
 
RE: How "human" are tulpas, tulpa rights, and more.

To me these seem like good questions. I've had a few discussions on them before and the following has come out:


On tulpa rights and citizenship, if you suppose that a tulpa and a host are separate beings - tulpas are conscious, then - with separate rights and equal ethical values then you end up having to say that you should value one person with 100 tulpas more than 100 people with no tulpas. And likewise, that person should get 101 votes to cast. Perhaps that's just counterintuitive rather than actually wrong, but I'm not sure I could justify acting that way to myself.

You might say that you wouldn't have 100 tulpas active at once; maybe 3, 4, so your total ethical value is 4 or 5 non-hosts going by effective experience quantity/lifespan. Even so, this seems really difficult to swallow.

This is odd though, because it's also hard to justify a model of values where conscious experience isn't the base currency, I think. You end up either glorifying the meat in your skull as being ethically worthy, or else force through the view that tulpas aren't conscious - you could say that the host's conscious experiences are shared between them and the tulpa but I haven't heard or experienced anything to justify that. It's a problem I can't quite solve without giving on one of the two matters.


About an afterlife, I've mostly looked at Christian views. Your tulpa isn't really a separate person, because they don't have a separate soul - scripture says... you get one from God and that's it. Of course there's nothing in the Bible about tulpas but the alternative - 'splitting' souls or whatever seems a bit nonsensical - is that creating a tulpa is just like conception/birth in that your tulpa gains a soul then. And this alternative does lead you to the above ethical weirdness, so you judge.

Anyway, not being a separate person probably leads you along the lines of tulpas being an affliction of the body (brain) rather than something you'd take with you to Paradise. At best they are 'absorbed' into you, if you want to look at it that way, and at worst they are shed along with the flesh. So that's a no on that one, I think.

Incidentally if you are Christian then taking the 'no souls' view does solve the ethical problem I mentioned above. But it's pretty much equivalent to forcing the 'no consciousness' view, except this time religion is dictating the facts instead of ethics. So I don't think you'd have gained anything.
09-08-2014, 09:40 PM
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amber5885
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#10
 
RE: How "human" are tulpas, tulpa rights, and more.

I do want to apologize. I'm not an asshole lol i just reacted to your questioning wrong. That's my bad
09-08-2014, 09:43 PM
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