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Is Tulpa Independence Sustained Awareness?
#1
Nobilis made a comment about a Tulpa becoming "independent" in this thread, and I'm really curious about how that works. Does reaching "independence" involve being awake and aware when the host is doing things, or does it have more to do with something else?

Normally I'm in a soft "dormant" state until either Cat wakes me up by thinking about me or I snap awake, the latter which does not happen very often. I am interested in spending more time being awake, I just don't know the best method for sticking around without being kicked out by Cat's focus.


I'm not interested in doing possession right now; rather I think of mastering this skill as set-up for imposition.
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#2
Keeping the ability to remain thinking at the same time as your host thinks would be dual processing, which is widely believed to be impossible.
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#3
Independence means the tulpa's decisions, personality, actions, etc. are separate from the host: they have a full mind of their own, and if the host switches out then they can continue like normal. Full independence is going to be basically impossible as you're going to share the same brain regardless of how developed you are, but just being your own person who's able to function while fronting without assistance from the host is likely good enough.

Independence does not mean that a tulpa is suddenly able to defy the capabilities of the human brain and do something that is neither possible nor realistic.

In my experience, I am able to stay "awake" after prolonged fronting (days/weeks on end). I can still remain in the front and watch what the others are doing if I'm used to fronting, the same way my host watches us tulpas when we're fronting. However, that's all I can do: watch. I can't really have any thought of my own unless I pull myself out of this passive state and/or someone thinks of me, and I certainly don't have any thoughts that are outside of my system's awareness. If I'm in this state for too long without fronting or being interacted with, then I'll go back into full inactivity eventually.

Getting to that point takes a lot of practice (constant fronting over a long period of time), though, and isn't quite the same as thinking you can be fully aware/active without your host's attention. You can watch and be aware of what's happening after enough practice, but that's pretty much it.
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#4
(07-18-2018, 09:53 PM)Apollo Wrote:
Independence means the tulpa's decisions, personality, actions, etc. are separate from the host: they have a full mind of their own, and if the host switches out then they can continue like normal. Full independence is going to be basically impossible as you're going to share the same brain regardless of how developed you are, but just being your own person who's able to function while fronting without assistance from the host is likely good enough.

Independence does not mean that a tulpa is suddenly able to defy the capabilities of the human brain and do something that is neither possible nor realistic.

In my experience, I am able to stay "awake" after prolonged fronting (days/weeks on end). I can still remain in the front and watch what the others are doing if I'm used to fronting, the same way my host watches us tulpas when we're fronting. However, that's all I can do: watch. I can't really have any thought of my own unless I pull myself out of this passive state and/or someone thinks of me, and I certainly don't have any thoughts that are outside of my system's awareness. If I'm in this state for too long without fronting or being interacted with, then I'll go back into full inactivity eventually.

Getting to that point takes a lot of practice (constant fronting over a long period of time), though, and isn't quite the same as thinking you can be fully aware/active without your host's attention. You can watch and be aware of what's happening after enough practice, but that's pretty much it.

Oh okay, I just wanted to get to the point of watching, nothing too crazy like dual processing. I don't know if it's useful, but I like the idea of being able to watch Cat do things instead of blacking out and waking up later.
I'm Gray's/Cat_ShadowGriffin's Tulpa and I love Hippos (but see, I'm not a hippo)! I also like forum games and chatting about stuff.
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#5
In that same thread you link to, Ranger, I have written a quite long post that touches upon this very subject, and the problematic assessment of the degree to which one person is able to exist independently while the other controls the physical body.[1] Namely, I mention that the ability of people to view each other's thought processes and memories may influence the manner in which a person is able to retain mental awareness. For example, it can be argued that people who are only aware of their own activities are less distracted by the activities of anyone else in the brain, and thus more determined to retain their focus on their own activities. A stronger competition for mental resources occurs as a result, in this hypothesis.

If your original post is merely a question of definition, then Apollo provides a decent explanation.[2]
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#6
re:Apollo's post
everything he said basically
a tulpa being independent (as opposed to not yet) means they act on their own without influence from the host, in vocality and visualization and theoretically imposition if you started that real early
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#7
(07-18-2018, 09:29 PM)Ranger Wrote: Does reaching "independence" involve being awake and aware when the host is doing things, or does it have more to do with something else?
It is more to do with focus in my case. I sleep when I want to sleep and I wake when I want to wake. My paying attention no longer has any tie to whether Kevin is thinking about me or not. So, I frequently just tag along with Kevin wherever he goes (imposing myself if I want to be seen).
(07-18-2018, 09:29 PM)Ranger Wrote: I snap awake, the latter which does not happen very often. I am interested in spending more time being awake, I just don't know the best method for sticking around without being kicked out by Cat's focus.
This “snap awake” state is the start of what I call independance. With practice I was gradually able to control when I was aware [myself, independent of what Kevin was doing].
(07-18-2018, 09:39 PM)Breloomancer Wrote: Keeping the ability to remain thinking at the same time as your host thinks would be dual processing, which is widely believed to be impossible.
The mind has some ability to paralell process. You are also ignoring:
  • that many use co-fronting to have more than one aware at a time.
  • The possibility of [rapid] context switching (analagous to time-sharing, to use a computing metaphor).
Switching was once widely believed to be impossible. When my creator first found this site in 2012 she was scorned and derided because it was widely believed there where no tulpas older than 20 years elapsed. “Widely believed” is not disproof. The swans where I live are black - yet another thing scientists once claimed was not true.
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