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[Switching] Guide to Tulpa Control
#21
Uh as far as I know, possession is them controlling the body (I believe you made a typo there) like their own. That's what possession is about. Giving up control so someone else in that head can take it instead.
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#22
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(03-07-2013, 10:37 PM)makogeddon Wrote: Ok, ok... so. My consciousness goes into the tulpa body, and I myself am supposed to see out of it, like that science experiment they did where they made test subjects believe they were on the other side of the room from where their actual bodies were?

Sorry if I keep asking the same questions over and over again, but you haven't really told me how to actually accomplish that if that's what we're talking about. I can put my personality and mindvoice into it just fine, but I have no idea how to transfer my actual self into the tulpa body. The most I could do would be to imagine myself seeing out of it, but that still doesn't put me into it; even if my mind's eye is seeing out of it, my ACTUAL vision is still coming from the physical body's eyes.

Also, what do you mean sharing sight isn't recommended for beginners? That's what we've been doing this entire time, because I don't know how to see out of my temporary body.


Yeah, this is what it's like for me. Still cemented to the real body. It doesn't feel like I'm being pushed out while someone else is being pushed in, it just feels like my personality is being altered.
I just thought of a good visual, if you have watched Avatar the movie, how he enters his N'avi body its similar to it, hes disconnected from his own physical body and thrown in another
Its fine, thats what the comments are for :> <3 Its hard to describe but you just imagine yourself flowing into the body or jumping consciousnesses if you can, and the next thing you know your tulpa is looking at a temporary body and youre looking at your irl body. You just disconnect from it and have your tulpa see with your body instead of you i guess. Imagine yourself entering the body and the tulpa staying in the body, thats the easiest to describe way so far that ive considered in plain english

(03-07-2013, 11:11 PM)Sands Wrote: Uh as far as I know, possession is them controlling the body (I believe you made a typo there) like their own. That's what possession is about. Giving up control so someone else in that head can take it instead.
As i believe switching is defined as a possession style where the tulpa and the host fully switch body type, so it is, but it is not only possessing, it is more than that :|

(03-07-2013, 10:47 PM)Sands Wrote: While ignoring your senses will eventually lead into sort of getting "disconnected" with the body and you will be able to achieve a switch, this guide just has so much mumbo jumbo I don't see necessary. I guess everyone got their own methods, but there's nothing really that special when it comes to switching. Just get possession down very well and once you're comfortable enough, you'll be able to move your senses from the physical body to an imaginary one. You'll probably first learn to block them which might lead into funky things if you're getting caught with your pants down so to say.

I guess I could repost my MS Paint image based on my experiences and how I see the whole switching thing. Not a guide and not helpful, but a way to put my words into an image or something.
[Image: cb88992636de96173b3b5f716b9a0407.PNG]
Realize first that this has possession done first, where the methods here goes into that step and past it in a not hard fashion. The point of the guide is to do it easily and effectively. keyword easily without learning possession first and then maximize it into a switching tactic
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#23
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(03-07-2013, 11:13 PM)testing Wrote: I just thought of a good visual, if you have watched Avatar the movie, how he enters his N'avi body its similar to it, hes disconnected from his own physical body and thrown in another
Its fine, thats what the comments are for :> <3 Its hard to describe but you just imagine yourself flowing into the body or jumping consciousnesses if you can, and the next thing you know your tulpa is looking at a temporary body and youre looking at your irl body. You just disconnect from it and have your tulpa see with your body instead of you i guess. Imagine yourself entering the body and the tulpa staying in the body, thats the easiest to describe way so far that ive considered in plain english

Ok, that clears things up, and I know what I need to do now, but... like I said, there's a difference between imagining myself in an imaginary body and actually BEING in that body. I know intuition is required with tulpaforcing, but I don't even know how to begin doing that. That's like trying to impose her onto the real world simply by visualizing hard enough. I just physically cannot do either of those things, and I don't understand how anyone else could.

And actually, I just realized a bit of a catch-22. It goes like this: Sarah becomes dominant, my consciousness is still in the body, and then I'm supposed to transfer it into the temp body. But... I have to USE my consciousness to transfer it, and Sarah is the one that is using my consciousness while we're merged. If I try to use it, I'll just end up taking over again.
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#24
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(03-07-2013, 11:36 PM)makogeddon Wrote: Ok, that clears things up, and I know what I need to do now, but... like I said, there's a difference between imagining myself in an imaginary body and actually BEING in that body. I know intuition is required with tulpaforcing, but I don't even know how to begin doing that. That's like trying to impose her onto the real world simply by visualizing hard enough. I just physically cannot do either of those things, and I don't understand how anyone else could.

And actually, I just realized a bit of a catch-22. It goes like this: Sarah becomes dominant, my consciousness is still in the body, and then I'm supposed to transfer it into the temp body. But... I have to USE my consciousness to transfer it, and Sarah is the one that is using my consciousness while we're merged. If I try to use it, I'll just end up taking over again.
Yes

And while putting your body within the temp body your tulpa does a lot of the moving. Its in the guide i think, but yeah, your tulpa moves you basically, just sit there and give her a push to move her along and you out of your body
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#25
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(03-07-2013, 11:13 PM)testing Wrote: As i believe switching is defined as a possession style where the tulpa and the host fully switch body type, so it is, but it is not only possessing, it is more than that :|

We should stop right now and make sure that the same definitions are still in place which are used on the forums and the community. I have no idea what goes on in the IRC channels and I don't even want to know, but this could go ugly really fast if everyone makes their own definitions and no one knows what anyone is talking about.

Simplest way to put it would be that during possession, the tupper is in control of the body. Simple as that. Switching is more about the host and I see it as a host skill more than anything. When you switch, the host (and what I mean by host and tupper is the first "consciousness" and the second and the ones after them, not the one in control of the body or even the one who has made all the tuppers) stops sensing the physical body and takes the senses of an imaginary body, which a tupper usually is doing but in this case they are the physical body. A tupper usually is in an imaginary form, which is why they don't really have to practice a switch as it's pretty automatic, the physical body control or possession is what they have to practice. A host then has to practice the switching as they are used to a physical body and not an imaginary one.

Again, in my picture, I talked about levels and I think that's still true. On the lowest levels, the tupper probably isn't very in touch with the body while the host is too much, but on the higher levels, the tupper in very much in control while the host barely is even aware unless they pay attention, easily able to slide into a switch.

tl;dr for the host part: during possession, host is aware of the physical senses. During switching, they are not. As for the tupper, there shouldn't be any change if the possession is good enough, but there might be a change during switch in how it feels to them in case the host has always been too much in the way during possession.

What a switch doesn't mean: switching body control, as in a tupper is in the body and a host is not. That is possession still. Switching depends on the host's senses.
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#26
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(03-07-2013, 11:49 PM)Sands Wrote: We should stop right now and make sure that the same definitions are still in place which are used on the forums and the community. I have no idea what goes on in the IRC channels and I don't even want to know, but this could go ugly really fast if everyone makes their own definitions and no one knows what anyone is talking about.

Simplest way to put it would be that during possession, the tupper is in control of the body. Simple as that. Switching is more about the host and I see it as a host skill more than anything. When you switch, the host (and what I mean by host and tupper is the first "consciousness" and the second and the ones after them, not the one in control of the body or even the one who has made all the tuppers) stops sensing the physical body and takes the senses of an imaginary body, which a tupper usually is doing but in this case they are the physical body. A tupper usually is in an imaginary form, which is why they don't really have to practice a switch as it's pretty automatic, the physical body control or possession is what they have to practice. A host then has to practice the switching as they are used to a physical body and not an imaginary one.

Again, in my picture, I talked about levels and I think that's still true. On the lowest levels, the tupper probably isn't very in touch with the body while the host is too much, but on the higher levels, the tupper in very much in control while the host barely is even aware unless they pay attention, easily able to slide into a switch.

tl;dr for the host part: during possession, host is aware of the physical senses. During switching, they are not. As for the tupper, there shouldn't be any change if the possession is good enough, but there might be a change during switch in how it feels to them in case the host has always been too much in the way during possession.

What a switch doesn't mean: switching body control, as in a tupper is in the body and a host is not. That is possession still. Switching depends on the host's senses.
I go by the common definitions i have compiled from the guides thread and irc
Also you should remember that what words for you and what you said doesnt work for everyone, and your definitions arent always the standard ones
Possession is when a tulpa takes control of the body correct
Switching is (commonly defined as) when the tulpa takes over as the host and the host becomes a tulpa, usually through possession or similar such as my guide.
Again not everyone including this guide uses your switching method, so definitions vary from guide to guide, this guides definitions are either above or in the section for them. Those are the definitions for this guide. Because this guide doesnt use desensitizing our definitions are different indeed.
Tl,dr. . .
As i can figure from what ive seen, and what ive heard works from those i
asked, the definition is exactly what you say isnt switching. The tulpa comes in the body and the host leaves the body. The tulpa also can feel with the bodys irl senses and the host cant, logically its more fitting to be the definition of switching because the host and tulpa really switch instead of the tulpa possessing the whole body while the host is in a daze
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#27
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(03-07-2013, 11:45 PM)testing Wrote: Yes

And while putting your body within the temp body your tulpa does a lot of the moving. Its in the guide i think, but yeah, your tulpa moves you basically, just sit there and give her a push to move her along and you out of your body

You... still haven't really told me how to abandon my physical body's senses. I know what I'm supposed to be doing now, but I still don't know how to actually do it without desensitization.

Speaking of that:

(03-08-2013, 12:21 AM)testing Wrote: this guide doesnt use desensitizing

(03-08-2013, 12:21 AM)testing Wrote: The tulpa also can feel with the bodys irl senses and the host cant

Isn't "desensitizing" defined as the process wherein the host stops feeling things with their IRL body? Because I think you just contradicted yourself. It seems like this guide doesn't use desensitizing, but it also seems like desensitization is actually required in order for the host to become a tulpa. If your guide allows the host to do that without desensitization, then... how?
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#28
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(03-08-2013, 12:32 AM)makogeddon Wrote: You... still haven't really told me how to abandon my physical body's senses. I know what I'm supposed to be doing now, but I still don't know how to actually do it without desensitization.

Speaking of that:



Isn't "desensitizing" defined as the process wherein the host stops feeling things with their IRL body? Because I think you just contradicted yourself. It seems like this guide doesn't use desensitizing, but it also seems like desensitization is actually required in order for the host to become a tulpa. If your guide allows the host to do that without desensitization, then... how?
Let me rephrase, it can use desensitizing styles if you want to use them but you dont need to use them. You dont need to desensitize your body as putting your consciousness in your temp body will do that already and easily
This is because your consciousness and thoughts are not connected to your irl body with your senses so its desensitized automatically, also you can "abandon your physical senses" by jumping consciousnesses, again like Avatar the movie, or by imagining yourself flowing into it, that is the method, just imagine yourself jumping into the tempbody thats it
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#29
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(03-08-2013, 12:21 AM)testing Wrote: I go by the common definitions i have compiled from the guides thread and irc

There are standard definitions. They're still in use here, if the IRC is switching them around like Koomer and Oguigi (they have used "switch" to mean just full body possession with the host still very aware of their physical senses and actually being unable to take on imaginary ones) then there's not much I can do about that other than to tell you that that's not what people usually mean. This was the updated glossary that has been suggested and let's take a look at what it says about possession and switching:

Possession: the practice of willingly allowing a tulpa to control the body (or individual body parts, such as the hands or vocal chords) of its host

Switching: a total transfer of bodily control from host to tulpa, such that the host no longer must consciously observe or mediate the actions their tulpa takes while in control of their body

I agree with those and that is what majority of the people I have met also agree to.

(03-08-2013, 12:21 AM)testing Wrote: Also you should remember that what words for you and what you said doesnt work for everyone, and your definitions arent always the standard ones
Possession is when a tulpa takes control of the body correct
Switching is (commonly defined as) when the tulpa takes over as the host and the host becomes a tulpa, usually through possession or similar such as my guide.

Mine does seem to be the standard however. And no, only the silly new people use the word host to mean the one in control of the body and speak of these "tulpa-like" bodies. You never become a host or a tupper unless you were like that. Sure, a tupper means thoughtform, but isn't the creation also a big part of it? The host never was created even if they have an imaginary form. If both can take on an imaginary form and take control of the physical body, if you keep switching the terms tupper and host around willy nilly, no one will ever know which one you are. Doesn't really matter, but it does to some. That is why the words host and tupper are there, to make it simple to understand your origin.

The term "front" has been suggested as a word for the one in the body, borrowing it from the multiple or whatever community, another community with people who share a body with someone else. I tend to just use "the body", but I guess front could work. No one's yet to make a good word for the ones not in control, though. As long as it's got nothing "tulpa-like" in it, I'm almost fine with anything. Why don't you and your IRC buddies try to come up with a good one?

(03-08-2013, 12:21 AM)testing Wrote: Again not everyone including this guide uses your switching method, so definitions vary from guide to guide, this guides definitions are either above or in the section for them. Those are the definitions for this guide. Because this guide doesnt use desensitizing our definitions are different indeed.

It's not exactly a method, just something I found out by accident. As in, people who got trouble with all these switching methods could really be working on that possession and find out that the switch will come automatically once they are ready. I don't see any reason why people would force this to happen when the tupper might not be ready to face the world alone in a strange body unless they have had enough practice with it already. You really need to be able to trust them to not hurt themselves.

(03-08-2013, 12:21 AM)testing Wrote: As i can figure from what ive seen, and what ive heard works from those i
asked, the definition is exactly what you say isnt switching. The tulpa comes in the body and the host leaves the body. The tulpa also can feel with the bodys irl senses and the host cant, logically its more fitting to be the definition of switching because the host and tulpa really switch instead of the tulpa possessing the whole body while the host is in a daze

You must've misread, misunderstood or put words into my mouth. Where did I say something about a daze? I am talking about an imaginary body with imaginary senses, like what a tupper usually is when not in the body. Going on wonderland adventures, feeling it like it is real. The other shit you wrote there was what I said.

Other things I've noticed: as you possess and you have to pay less and less attention to the body as all the needs are taken care of by your tulpa, you build trust. When you build trust, you don't need to watch over them in case something happen, as you're comfortable with them taking care of it themselves. So, you don't need to feel it. You don't need to smell it, you don't need to hear it or see it. So you don't. Now, if you truly leave it at that, yes, you are basically unconscious. You will wake up later and have no idea what happened. Technically, that too is a switch as the host isn't in control of the body or feeling the physical senses. But that's not what you usually want and I'd call this stage more like something between possession and a true switch. It's not too difficult to start feeling something after that, so just get yourself a nice imaginary body and feel that instead. It's your body now as you're not feeling the other and that's pretty nice. Go do whatever.

Basically, there is a lot of same between what we have noticed, but I just think there's a lot more useless symbolism in your method. Symbolism is tricky, it can work either really well or not at all if the person using it doesn't agree to it. I'm not too big on symbolism so I don't use it.

I am worried if people start forcing too young tuppers in control of a strange body, however. Remember to practice somewhere safe and make sure they can use the body well before giving up control and not being there to make sure they will be alright. A physical body takes some time to get used to. Going the possession route is safe even if it takes time, but there is no rush. Just know that possession and switching aren't so different that you have to practice them both and that time spent on one thing is wasted if you want the other. You'll get both if you are willing to practice.
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#30
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(03-08-2013, 12:43 AM)testing Wrote: Let me rephrase, it can use desensitizing styles if you want to use them but you dont need to use them. You dont need to desensitize your body as putting your consciousness in your temp body will do that already and easily
This is because your consciousness and thoughts are not connected to your irl body with your senses so its desensitized automatically, also you can "abandon your physical senses" by jumping consciousnesses, again like Avatar the movie, or by imagining yourself flowing into it, that is the method, just imagine yourself jumping into the tempbody thats it

But like I said: There's a difference between imagining myself going into the temp body and ACTUALLY going into the temp body. What you're telling me to do is the equivalent of telling me to physically see something with my eyes just by visualizing it. We're talking about two totally different levels here, and I don't know how to get to the second one.

(03-08-2013, 01:02 AM)Sands Wrote: Other things I've noticed: as you possess and you have to pay less and less attention to the body as all the needs are taken care of by your tulpa, you build trust. When you build trust, you don't need to watch over them in case something happen, as you're comfortable with them taking care of it themselves. So, you don't need to feel it. You don't need to smell it, you don't need to hear it or see it. So you don't. Now, if you truly leave it at that, yes, you are basically unconscious. You will wake up later and have no idea what happened. Technically, that too is a switch as the host isn't in control of the body or feeling the physical senses. But that's not what you usually want and I'd call this stage more like something between possession and a true switch. It's not too difficult to start feeling something after that, so just get yourself a nice imaginary body and feel that instead. It's your body now as you're not feeling the other and that's pretty nice. Go do whatever.

Ok, so that's another thing that has me confused about whether or not we're doing things right. During possession, if she tries to raise my arm, I have to help her; if I just relax, it falls back down. The same goes for switching, I can't just give my body to her. It feels more like she's the one influencing it, but I'm the one that's actually moving it. If I relax, the body relaxes. Is that something that will be fixed once I can get into the imaginary body and everything you described happens, or am I just doing this completely wrong?
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