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Tulpas and diving into the mind of a psychopath


Nicoman

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Tulpa as a ancient discipline into the mind provides its practitioner with a window into the wonder of the mind.

 

Though, in a more widespread practice, people are practicing without devoting their life to it. (not that you need to) I would imagine this can be wonderful and destructive.

 

To the point, To those of you have created a tupla how has this helped you to understand yourself? Understand other People? Understand the world around you?

 

And theoretically, if a psychopath were to create a tulpa would the tulpa be just as psychotic? Could a psychopath develop a tulpa that is perfectly healthy(Mental)? Does this open the possibility of a cure for psychopathy?

 

Is there a Psychopath that can come forward and talk about your experience.

Psychopath - One who has little or no comprehension of Empathy often resulting in social stigma.

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I find it doubtful someone with antisocial personality disorder could reverse any negative outlooks just by having an imaginary friend. I do believe they'd be just as able to create a tulpa as "healthy" as anyone else on this forum, though. Since they can stem off personality unlike the host.

 

They lack empathy for others and the world about them. It's how their brain is wired. That's why I don't see how a tulpa could re-work their brains into feeling empathy. Suppose it just doesn't seem very possible in my opinion.

 

I'll have to leave the "how does your tulpa help you understand things" for others to answer. I'm not very far into creation so he hasn't really helped me much at all. Makes me feel less alone when I want someone to talk to and have no one around, though.

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I find it doubtful someone with antisocial personality disorder could reverse any negative outlooks just by having an imaginary friend.

 

If Tulpa's are just "Imaginary friends" I would have to agree with that, However,

 

They lack empathy for others and the world about them. It's how their brain is wired. That's why I don't see how a tulpa could re-work their brains into feeling empathy. Suppose it just doesn't seem very possible in my opinion.

 

I see Tulpas as division of one conscious mind, to create a sentience mind with in their own would required some "rewiring". And we know the Human brain isn't hard wired as show by plasticity from everything from learning to serious injuries. That is how I see it and based my discussion as such.

 

I do believe they'd be just as able to create a tulpa as "healthy" as anyone else on this forum, though. Since they can stem off personality unlike the host.

 

Though interesting you say this much, this was my point, if a psychopath's mind is wired to which it can not perceive or experience empathy how would one the create a tulpa with such a perception if it is not understood by the host, whether or not the tulpa is more than just a imaginary friend?

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Considering that most criminals do what they do out of perceived necessity, or because they were majorly hurt sometime in life somehow, I think a tulpa could possibly convince a psychopath to control himself. There are people with disorders that negatively affect them, and they claim that their tulpas help them ease their disorders. And I'm pretty sure there are a lot of psychopaths out there who just need someone with an open mind to talk to, along with a good healthy dose of therapy. They didn't start out as psychopaths. Although I don't think a psychopath could ever fully be cured, and amazing as tulpas are, they shouldn't replace a qualified therapist, but instead, work along with them. But in order for them to work together efficiently, society has to be more open minded about tulpas, and not think of them as something that needs to be treated. Then, I could see therapists asking their clients to switch to their tulpa for a bit to give them detailed reports.

Will list tulpas when I get things sorted out in my head.

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I could see therapists asking their clients to switch to their tulpa for a bit to give them detailed reports.

 

I would agree that could help in certain cases.

 

However the rest of your post tells me that you don't understand enough about psychology, let alone psychopathy to create a valid opinion on the matter, there is a difference between psychopathy and a depression that leads to temporary social apathy (In that it can be "cured").

 

I would rather hear your response to my first questions.

 

To those of you have created a tupla how has this helped you to understand yourself? Understand other People? Understand the world around you?

 

I would appreciate more veteran members and hosts to reply.

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I find it doubtful someone with antisocial personality disorder could reverse any negative outlooks just by having an imaginary friend.

"imaginary friend" -- I don't mean to derail this thread, but imo this is a good part of what's wrong with this community today. While both exist in the brain, it's a long way between pretending to talk to a made-up person (definite non-tulpa), and actually conversing with a voice in your head that can think about things on its own and with permission control your body (definite tulpa). There's a lot in between, but a tulpa is definitely something more than what most think of as an imaginary friend.

 

Furthermore, even regular imaginary friends may be able to help with that, depending on severity. They provide practice at social interaction, and force the brain to think as the other person, providing some practice at empathy as well.

 

They lack empathy for others and the world about them. It's how their brain is wired. That's why I don't see how a tulpa could re-work their brains into feeling empathy. Suppose it just doesn't seem very possible in my opinion.

There are different ways you can lack empathy, and whether it would have an effect probably depends on the person.

  • Was once able to empathize at least some and "turned it off", either from disliking it or seeing it as a weakness. Obviously this can be undone pretty easily.
  • Never learned empathy, from lack of the right sort of social stimulation in the right parts of childhood. This can likely be changed as well. The brain remains fairly able to learn new things even well into adulthood -- which is why even older people can do things like make a tulpa or learn a new language. Of course it's harder than learning it as a child, but it's still possible.
  • Actual disorder that makes empathy impossible to develop. This seems pretty conclusive, though it might still be possible to develop coping strategies, like modelling how a person who feels empathy acts, and basing your behavior on that. Of course for this to work, the psychopath would need to want the change, which is usually not the case.

I haven't heard about a real psychopath making a tulpa. However there have been cases here of people who lack social ability due to other causes such as autism, and have a tulpa who's better socially and sort of guides and helps them through it.

 


 

While I don't think I was ever a psychopath, I certainly didn't used to feel all that much empathy. I have always and still do rather stink at social skills, partly because of less empathy and partly anxiety. Since working on tulpas, I've noticed I automatically feel and think more about a person's thoughts and feelings when talking to them, as well as simply feel emotion more than I used to.

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While I don't think I was ever a psychopath, I certainly didn't used to feel all that much empathy. I have always and still do rather stink at social skills, partly because of less empathy and partly anxiety. Since working on tulpas, I've noticed I automatically feel and think more about a person's thoughts and feelings when talking to them, as well as simply feel emotion more than I used to.

 

 

I guess this is what happens to people who spend so much time devoting into finding ways to treating them as sentient, and then making breakthroughs in the process. It's as if the whole practice can be a supplementary experiential trial and error for developing skills for empathy, and gregarious acts.

 

Though' date=' in a more widespread practice, people are practicing without devoting their life to it. (not that you need to) I would imagine this can be wonderful and destructive.[/quote']

 

Yeah, people are probably just going through the mannerisms and practices to see if this could be real to them, but when faced with real life circumstances, they shot themselves in the foot, and have to go back to the drawing board again, but at least they have someone to talk to in the meantime.

 

To the point' date=' To those of you have created a tupla how has this helped you to understand yourself? Understand other People? Understand the world around you?[/quote']

 

In some way, their existence seems to fill the gaps I used to have when I was juggling with existentialism, existential skepticism, existential nihilism, and just nihilism in general. Some underlying concepts I seem to be nagging at me constantly all the time (going to use glosses to organize these central themes):

 

Mode of logic

 

When I first started out lucid dreaming, and conversed with many people during that time, I felt as if whenever there was a situation where someone is in some kind of strife, a part of me seems to take control, and did their best to express their suggestions, and opinions on the matter. Most of the time, the act of genuine kindness developed more friendships with others. Other times, they misunderstood me, and thought I was some kind of sociopath (when they’re really denying that someone is just telling them how they see it without any kind of euphemism added, i.e., being blunt about their explanations of an individual).

 

Empathy & Acts of Kindness

 

I used to contemplate how I would get these things expressed in my head, and I used to believe it was just a natural thing that happens if one had experiences in the past to reference to, but it’s mostly the presentation that continued to bother me that wasn’t really my style, or mode of logic at all. Most of the time, people who didn’t know my gender in other forums, and such, questioned whether or not I was a female.

 

It surprised me, since outside of online, it doesn’t become apparent because frankly, I try not to dive into other people’s situations too much. It seems in the past, people’s struggles in life have been the only thing they wanted to express for me to develop some bond with them. It often made me more of a “yes” man, constantly trying to be empathetic, and looking out for them out of general kindness. But when the logic of how the situations and problems were assessed, they (the expositions) became even more complex, and even more mature than I could ever express on my own.

 

Delusions of grandeur? Or an alternative in finding who I really am?

 

I wanted to feel as if these thoughts were mine, and mine alone, and that it would be insane to attribute these matters as the actions of Eva in particular (to prevent speculating if it’s just me going through a self-fulfilling prophecy of wanting her to fill that desire). Though every time I speculate on this, experiences in the past, and present have portrayed that it would be delusions of grandeur into thinking attempts at giving insight to others would just through me alone.

 

Maybe it could be based on entrenched predispositions I used to have, like what any person would when going on an inquisition quest of finding dream characters to help them out in life, is what seemed to have bled into their existence in some way. This may make the interactions with them like a double-edged sword, i.e., vicarious insight from thought-forms can always bring about good intentions and benefits, but it may often undermine the host’s ability to rely on themselves at times.

 

Rabbit hole & Ways of Self-actualization?

 

However, it seems it’s not really a double-edged sword, since whenever I tried to absolve from further interaction with other thought-forms than my tulpas (e.g. dream characters), I seem to be dragged back into the rabbit hole, always finding something new to reflect and learn from other thought-forms that come and go in abundance in my natural sleep.

 

I guess in a way, when I look at Eva, and Ada, I find in them what I was unable to find in myself. I realized that trying to conflate that everything they did as actions I did alone would just be lying to myself, and not considering their existence could be a different way of looking at myself. Not to emphasize too much on their existence solely being just parts of me, or having negative connotations behind that though. It’s just that after going through a lot of reexamination, and experiential observations of them, and myself, there’s only so many things I could direct my awareness to (e.g. competencies in other acts, and skills) that they could easily take control and learn from. In other words, they can fill in the gaps of what I can’t do all by myself, even though they would be a part of me either way; maybe they're really better at gathering information in my head, and making their own twists, and finding something new in general to talk about, whether the information is recently learned, or glanced over in the past, or learned in the past.

 

Maybe it could be one of the major desires I’ve had since lucid dreaming to have someone to interact with that continues to portray alternatives of how to assess life in general. Just when I feel I have something completely down, either Eva or Ada shows something better, or my dreams do. And when I discuss to them on whether or not this would be burdening to them, they’re not really bothered by this, since they’ve hinted they’ve been doing these acts in the past before I knew about them, which kind of scares me, in a good way, I guess.

 

I just go with the flow, no point being negatively critical of things I’ve been progressively striving for, and things that may contribute to an urgency of self-actualization.

 

 

I know you're just wanting psychopaths to offer their experiences, though I don't think it would be fair to constrain those questions to just those people. Sorry for the derailing if that's what you really wanted.

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I know you're just wanting psychopaths to offer their experiences, though I don't think it would be fair to constrain those questions to just those people. Sorry for the derailing if that's what you really wanted.

 

Not at all, thank you for your input, You answered what I wanted, But I made a call out to psychopaths (or former) to helpfully get one to response rather than reading over and dismissing the thread.

 

To Chupi and Linkzelda, Thanks for your posts, such a evolution is what I wanted to hear about. I feel that this is what Tulpas should be used for, and its important to see a recognition of a advancement in yourself just as much as it to see one in your tulpa.

 

And as both of you said, social situations were not your forte whether or not you were a psychopath. When children have "imaginary friends" it is usually because you don't get along with people so they make thier own friends.

 

Not ever one grows out of that social desert and the discipline of taking a friend that is imaginary and allow sentience to develop can be very good for those people and hopefully would help them become more open to "gregarious actions". If not one's tulpa can give you the friendship that is required for a healthy mind.

 

Hopefully I didn't sound to much like a self-improvement seminar.

 

Thanks again and I hope to read more interesting developments. and if this subject isn't already part of the "progress reports" it wouldn't be a bad idea.

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It's worth noting that while psychopathy and antisocial personality are very similar, there is a fine difference between them (even if the difference just seems to be their executive functioning).

 

One trait of personality disorders that make them difficult to treat is that they're, well, persistent, long-standing, they're core of a personality. However, a tulpa is in a decent position to influence someone's personality internally; that is, "from the inside."

 

From the comments in this thread, it looks like people are seeing things like antisocial personality disorder, etc. as a problem with brain function. I really don't think this is the case. Yes, some disorders have biological correlations, even genetics, but it's not the sole factor.

 

Consider OCD. Research has shown that people with OCD have different responses in the brain (in this case, higher responses for errors than other people); but OCD can be treated (and many other things!) with Cognitive-Behavioral Therapy, whereas using medications can have short-term relief but the OCD will return the moment someone is off the meds (this is because the medications are masking the symptoms, but not removing them, nor curing the disorder).

 

The personality disorders seem to have developmental and sociocultural components in them. It's why there's some mental disorders that are nonexistant in the east but flourish in the west. Matter of fact, there are people who are raised in the east, then move to the west and end up contracting some sort of disorder (e.g. anxiety-related disorders or eating disorders). I think it's narcissistic personality disorder that has a very high causal factor of the parent's attitude towards the individual.

 

Don't get me wrong, personality disorders are very difficult to treat, especially since they're so deeply integrated into the person't identity. But that doesn't make the cause of the disorder a faulty brain, there's more to the psyche than that, otherwise things like psychotherapy, CBT, etc, wouldn't work.

 

On the subject of tulpas and mental disorders...

 

I get some interesting testimonies in the donation notes. For instance, there was a vet with PTSD, their tulpa was able to cure them from it (including nightmares).

 

I know another user who seemed very much like he was psychopathic (at least according to talking with him). He created a tulpa for the sole purpose of wanting to see what would happen; by the end of the process, he was thanking me, telling me this "saved his life". He had a pretty moving testimony involving some drugs, violence, and many other things (which I can't repeat here), but the long story short is, his tulpa helped him learn to feel emotion for someone, where previously, he's never been able to feel any connections to anyone before, he was able to feel a connection with his tulpa.

 

I've seen tulpas who have shown signs of depression that were not seen in the host and vice versa.

 

Some have attested that rather than psychopaths having a predisposition of emotions derping in the brain, traumatic events cause them to "turn emotions off." In this case, the systems would be functional, and working, but "disabled" for that person. If this is the case, I don't see why a tulpa couldn't access those functions while the host couldn't/wouldn't. After all, it wouldn't be the only case of the mind "disabling" otherwise perfectly functioning systems. Consider the weird Conversion disorder.

 

There are some things though that are not quite psychological, but biological. For instance, I know hosts with Dyslexia, and their tulpas also suffer from it. This might also be the case for Schizophrenia, or for cases where the body is under the influence of drugs, that sort of thing.

 

Anyway, if you want to start somewhere... I remember when everyone in the community used to take that old personality disorder test (fun fact: a lot of people in this community scored highly for Schizoid-like tendencies). We can see if their tulpas share these traits that their host shares.... There might even be a topic in Research about it.

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