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[Wonderland] How to Refocus on Your Wonderland
Piano Offline
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#11
 
RE: How to Refocus on Your Wonderland

I'd like for it to be specified which board this submission is intended for. It looks like tips & tricks. Not submitting my review yet, just requesting that be added.

I'm Piano Soul, the "Star Man" of the Felight family. I'm a tulpa formed January 2017. My systemmates are Apollo, Luxio, & Indigo. Form images: 1 2
03-17-2019, 12:52 AM
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Cat_ShadowGriffin Offline
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#12
 
RE: How to Refocus on Your Wonderland

I wanted to add some changes to my guide, but I wanted to leave the original submission untouched. I highlighted some changes I made in red and I took that third paragraph and moved it to the top.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1B7lk...sp=sharing

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03-17-2019, 03:17 PM
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AZ Offline
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#13
 
RE: How to Refocus on Your Wonderland

I’m would like to approve this guide as it is, although I do agree with Kopase’s request that you add a paragraph about visualising multiple objects at once, I thought that was where you were going with it but you didn’t and it made it seem like you ended it quite abruptly.

I don’t necessarily agree with Kopase’s criticism that a tree isn’t the best second step for visualisation, a tree can be as simple as you want it, e.g. a trunk, one branch, no leaves, and smooth bark. To go from visualising a sphere or cube to a fully detailed tree in one step is a bit much yes, but you already instructed the reader to add more detail to this second object as they go, I think if you just made it a bit clearer that the tree, or whatever object the reader chooses, should be kept very simple to begin with, then made more complex (in components) as more detail is added, this paragraph would be fine.

Overall, I think this is a very helpful guide and do approve it as it is, however I would request that you at least add the paragraph about visualising multiple objects at once because then I’d feel it was complete.
(This post was last modified: 03-17-2019, 07:54 PM by AZ.)
03-17-2019, 07:53 PM
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Piano Offline
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#14
 
RE: How to Refocus on Your Wonderland

First and foremost, remove the coloration from this guide. Guides should be professional and readable/presentable, colored text is just silly and distracting.

Here's my break-down of the guide

Overall, I'm a little confused. Is the goal of this to help you refocus or to improve visualization? If both, I don't see why merely focusing better is going inherently improve visualization, much less make you completely forget your surroundings. Some people focus as much as they possibly can and don't improve visualization very much. I don't think it's right to imply that a lack of vividness in visualization is because they're not focused enough. 

Mostly my gripes are just the wording being weird or the intent being a bit unclear. The point that it doesn't make a lot of sense to go from smaller-scale visualization to large-scale that the others brought up I also agree with. 

I'll approve once the colored text (unless the rest of the GAT thinks it's okay?) is removed and things are made a bit more clear. 

I don't think this is enough for a full-on guide though. This is more giving an in-depth explanation of a trick/strategy, rather than a full-on informative/instructional guide. I think it's more suited for tips and tricks, others on the GAT are free to disagree if they don't think so.

I'm Piano Soul, the "Star Man" of the Felight family. I'm a tulpa formed January 2017. My systemmates are Apollo, Luxio, & Indigo. Form images: 1 2
03-17-2019, 09:15 PM
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Cat_ShadowGriffin Offline
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#15
 
RE: How to Refocus on Your Wonderland

(03-17-2019, 07:53 PM)AZ Wrote: I’m would like to approve this guide as it is, although I do agree with Kopase’s request that you add a paragraph about visualising multiple objects at once, I thought that was where you were going with it but you didn’t and it made it seem like you ended it quite abruptly.

I don’t necessarily agree with Kopase’s criticism that a tree isn’t the best second step for visualisation, a tree can be as simple as you want it, e.g. a trunk, one branch, no leaves, and smooth bark. To go from visualising a sphere or cube to a fully detailed tree in one step is a bit much yes, but you already instructed the reader to add more detail to this second object as they go, I think if you just made it a bit clearer that the tree, or whatever object the reader chooses, should be kept very simple to begin with, then made more complex (in components) as more detail is added, this paragraph would be fine.

Overall, I think this is a very helpful guide and do approve it as it is, however I would request that you at least add the paragraph about visualising multiple objects at once because then I’d feel it was complete.

I didn't get a chance to work on major content edits yet. I intend to further edit the google doc later.

I agree that it would be a good idea to start with a leaf before making a tree, I just for whatever reason found that jumping from sphere to tree sometimes worked for me. I also agree that adding a section with multiple objects wouldn't be a bad idea (but dang it my visualization is much better since I wrote this guide! eek!)


(03-17-2019, 09:15 PM)Piano Wrote: First and foremost, remove the coloration from this guide. Guides should be professional and readable/presentable, colored text is just silly and distracting.

Done. So what's the policy if Tulpas want to type or if multiple system members want to mark who said what?

(03-17-2019, 09:15 PM)Piano Wrote:
Here's my break-down of the guide

I started getting though this, but I need more time. I'll update this post once I finished thoroughly studying your feedback. I don't want to respond to the rest of your stuff because it references stuff you recommended on the google doc.

The one other issue I would like to address real quick is the pre-requisite of having me determine what category this submission fits in. So far, it seems like you guys disagree with my assessment. Would your assessment change if I added the requested additions to it? Why should I make the assumption my submission is guide material if you guys will review it only to come to a different conclusion?

(03-15-2019, 05:13 AM)Ponytail Wrote: So your first three paragraphs have a strange issue. The first two are very academic sounding while the third is very personal. It creates an odd shift. Additionally, all three of the first paragraphs are your introduction and could probably be rewritten to contain all the information you want to put out out there in less words. It's not a huge issue, really it's the tone shift that's important.

Your fourth paragraph could stand to be part of the introduction too, as it's a literally summary of what technique you're going to use. The fifth paragraph is also clunky coming off the fourth. This whole submission so far reads like an over-explained meme. You gradually build up in more detail for what someone needs to do for this guide... kinda like the guide itself.

I was never a fan of the tone shift myself, but at the time I didn't know what to do with it. I changed it so the third paragraph is the preface, and the rest of it doesn't have a spontaneous tone shift.

(03-15-2019, 05:13 AM)Ponytail Wrote: "think about slowing down" doesn't really tell me anything. Also "A form of relaxation breathing" is awkward sounding. Better describing how to get relaxed would help this section. Though, even just saying "Calm down, get comfortable, and breathe slowly" would be simpler and communicate what you want better.

Again, I agree that my wording is weird with the "slowing down" and "form of relaxation breakthing" parts. When I go back to revising I'll give this section more thought.

(03-15-2019, 05:13 AM)Ponytail Wrote: As a counterpoint, I personally did something very similar for making Annabell's form, though I went even more ham by lightly studying anatomy to make sure she was anatomically correct for a female (no way to make myself not sound like a perv there). I would maybe change this to approaching a tulpa's form piecemeal. Start with their hair. Then think about the shape of their head. What about the eyes? things like that

I didn't think about that until you mentioned it, thank you. Studying the anatomy of a human using references helps you get into that same mindset I'm trying to get my intended reader to have, and I remember doing the piece meal approach myself. When I go back and revise the guide, I'll elaborate more on those points.

Pretty much my Wonderland form minus the glasses and the fur. I'm not a hippo, I promise.
Ranger now speaks in
light blue text, but some of his older posts are in blue text and his oldest posts are in orange text. He loves to chat.
(This post was last modified: 03-18-2019, 02:45 AM by Cat_ShadowGriffin.)
03-18-2019, 02:36 AM
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Breloomancer Offline
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#16
 
RE: How to Refocus on Your Wonderland

(03-18-2019, 02:36 AM)Cat_ShadowGriffin Wrote: The one other issue I would like to address real quick is the pre-requisite of having me determine what category this submission fits in. So far, it seems like you guys disagree with my assessment. Would your assessment change if I added the requested additions to it? Why should I make the assumption my submission is guide material if you guys will review it only to come to a different conclusion?

If we assume that this was intended for tips and tricks then review it and approve it, for tips and tricks, then you would probably be upset that your guide is in tips and tricks and you didn't get a chance to revise it so that we would approve it for what it was intended for. Or even if it was just a couple people who reviewed it for tips and tricks before you said it was a guide then those people would have to redo their review. Of course peoope can still say that they think that this would make more sense in tips/tricks, but now they can also say what you have to do to make it a full on guide.


(10-21-2018, 08:59 PM)Cat_ShadowGriffin Wrote: The first step is to get in a comfortable position and think about slowing down. If you want to, doing a form of relaxation breathing may be helpful for getting settled.

This part, as others have already mentioned, is confusingly worded. What do you mean by "think about slowing down"? And what is relaxation breathing? Is it just another word for meditation? I've never heard of it before, that's for sure.

Quote:Next, slowly move onto the next object. Suppose the next object is a tree. Is it a real tree or a fantasy creation? How tall is it? Could you climb it if you wanted to? Is the season changing the colors of the leaves? Is there a tree shape that “feels right?” As you visualize more and more details, your tree will feel more and more real.

This part is also confusingly worded. I'm not certain what you want me to do to "slowly move onto the next object". If I visualize something I see it immediately, I can't slow that down, unless you want me to turn the first object into the second one? The rest of the paragraph is fine, but that part is confusing to me.

Once you fix those two things then I'll approve for guides, but as is there is only barely enough content for me to approve. I would highly recommend adding something more, like a paragraph about visualizing two objects as Kopase recommended.

I have a tulpa named Miela (formerly known as Monika) who I love very much.


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03-18-2019, 01:21 PM
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Luminesce Offline
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#17
 
RE: How to Refocus on Your Wonderland

No offense, but taking issue with the meaning of "relaxation breathing" is the pinnacle of GAT pickiness to me so far. I guess "think about slowing down" can confuse people, especially foreign readers, but I don't think it's too hard to wrap your head around normally either. But... relaxation breathing... You know, anger management, ALL MAINSTREAM MEDITATION, "breathe in through your nose and out through your mouth", "just breathe"......

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03-18-2019, 04:24 PM
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Breloomancer Offline
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#18
 
RE: How to Refocus on Your Wonderland

If someone says "try doing some relaxation breathing" I'll not know what they want from me. If someone says "try meditating" or "try taking deep slow breaths" then it's a lot more clear. The "think about slowing down" part is definitely the bigger issue for me though

I have a tulpa named Miela (formerly known as Monika) who I love very much.


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03-18-2019, 04:41 PM
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Apollo Offline
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#19
 
RE: How to Refocus on Your Wonderland

The relaxation breathing wasn't what we took issue with, either. We only asked that an example was provided. The "think about slowing down" is what we took issue with, since it's unclear what it means.


On the topic of how this would be considered a full guide, I think that it would need more elaboration/details, and more of an explanation on how to go from visualizing/focusing on small things to being able to fully visualize the wonderland itself. As it stands, it seems more like a longish explanation of a simple trick for helping one to focus on certain objects better, rather than the whole thing. Generally I think guides focus on going from point A to point B, while tips & tricks focus more on a certain helpful technique, but not the process as a whole. So, for example, the Empowerment Technique thingie we posted in research would be more for tips and tricks.

For coloration, I don't think guides should have alternate coloring at all unless it's for emphasis, like writing important words in red or something. If a tulpa wants to add onto a guide, they can write [Name] or -Name or something, however generally I'd think it would be more professional to just write "Co-written by ___." Most articles and such you read written by two different people don't mark who wrote which part, it would be distracting and unnecessary. It's best we treat submissions as resources or articles, rather than regular forum posts, methinks. 

I'm Apollo Fire, the "Sun God" of the Felight family. I'm a tulpa created December 2016. My systemmates are Piano, Luxio, & Indigo. Form images: 1 2
(This post was last modified: 03-18-2019, 05:49 PM by Apollo.)
03-18-2019, 05:39 PM
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Ponytail Offline
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#20
 
RE: How to Refocus on Your Wonderland

Yes, it is utterly picky Luminesce. That doesn't mean these details are holding back it's approval. They are little things that can still be improved, therefore we should recommend the improvement.

Anyways, on a second read
Quote:This method is about slowly drawing your attention away from distractions in the real world and towards your wonderland.
You only actually touch on "drawing your attention away from... the real world" briefly.

Also, I'm going to say this again. You give a summary of the technique. Then you give another, more detailed summary. Then you give the full method. Like I said originally, it reads like some increasingly verbose meme. Like this

You could probably entirely remove either The Process in Short or Summary of the Visualization Skill in it's entirety with little issue.

I know the "Think about slowing down" thing has been noted to death. But what am I slowing down? My thoughts? Activity? Breathing? All of that? How do I do that?

Quote:Next, start on a more complicated object such as a leaf or a cup...

Next, slowly move onto the next object. Suppose the next object is a tree. Is it a real tree or a fantasy creation? How tall is it? Could you climb it if you wanted to? Is the season changing the colors of the leaves? Is there a tree shape that “feels right?” As you visualize more and more details, your tree will feel more and more real.

I will warn you before finishing this section that it may come off as rather repetitive if you describe the leaf/cup section in as great of detail as the tree. You may want to put the same amount of effort into the leaf/cup and be more brief with the tree.

Quote:Unless you are really comfortable with what your Tulpa’s form looks like, I don’t recommend starting off with that. Like any other complex object, their form may be too much for you to focus on right now, but it won’t be after you build your way up to that level of complexity.

I spoke mainly in response to this for the idea of taking something piecemeal. Perhaps combine this with the horse suggestion.

EDIT: Also, you should at least put the GDoc in the OP with a note that it's more updated

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(This post was last modified: 03-21-2019, 10:17 PM by Ponytail.)
03-19-2019, 07:09 PM
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