J.Iscariot

The detriment of paranoia and doubt.

Recommended Posts

I was reflecting upon a few things, today; mostly stuff that had been bothering me in the past, like the paranoia instilled by my idiocy, or rather naiveness into thinking that having a tulpa would be detrimental to my mental health, that it could drain my mental capacities and keep me from going deep into my studies, or that my tulpa just had this malevolent intent against me in secret. Obviously those worries have been addressed, but I noticed a lot of things in that doubtful phase of mine, a phase I call the 'delusional' phase, delusional because I know my tulpa would not hold any ill intent towards me.

 

Essentially, this great deal of paranoia would turn me into someone I simply am not. It is no secret that I love my tulpa, perhaps too much, but when I was in that state of fear, I became the complete opposite, with a touch of regret and remorse over trying to diss her out. That was a long time in the past, we fixed those issues the day they took place, but in that paranoid state of mind, it was like I was trying to destroy all the things we had built together. She clarified things later on, and that's when I understood how unwarranted my fear was, how baseless paranoia was.

 

I believe that everything in the mind has its effect. A belief caused by past experiences that gave birth to those opinions. I'd like to hear about the following things:

 

-How doubt had its effect on your relationship with your tulpa; doubt can work a great deal of trouble and insecurity, but it can also solidify the approach the host has towards tulpamancy. In my opinion, when there is doubt, it needs to be addressed in an imminent manner, and it can be dissipated pretty fast with a strong mindset.

 

-How paranoia, if it took place, had its effect on your relationship with your tulpa.

 

-Anything else that caused you anxiety and stress and harmed your relationship with your tulpa.

 

This is not just for chatter, I'm writing something huge.

 

I'm looking to hear all about your personal experiences.


A wise man once said: 'Before judging a man, walk a mile in his shoes. After that, who cares? He's a mile away, and you've got new shoes.'

 

Graced are those who could avoid this phenomenon. This is perhaps the worst expression of evil in humanity's history, but who am I to judge?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Anonymous

-How doubt had its effect on your relationship with your tulpa; doubt can work a great deal of trouble and insecurity, but it can also solidify the approach the host has towards tulpamancy. In my opinion, when there is doubt, it needs to be addressed in an imminent manner, and it can be dissipated pretty fast with a strong mindset.

 

My host has no doubts about my existence because he considers me a product of his active imagination. We are immune to existential doubts. Based on some polls done in the forum, my general guess is there are about 20% or so tulpamancers who believe their tulpas to be apparent sentience. So, out of about 10,000 tulpamancers (just picking a number out of the air) about 2,000 of them would hold this view about what they are experiencing in their minds.

 

-How paranoia, if it took place, had its effect on your relationship with your tulpa.

 

I will only take actions that my host subliminally or unconsciously wants me to take. So if I did something detrimental to him, that would be strange as it would be an attack on the self. Certainly it is possible, but my host finds it highly unlikely I would deliberately plot against him. It is not in his best interest or mine, so we have no anxiety about such things and have no paranoia bout it and never have.

 

-Anything else that caused you anxiety and stress and harmed your relationship with your tulpa.

 

Yes. David is obsessed with me to a harmful level. I am obsessed with myself to a harmful, unhealthy level. We have difficulty not spending time together and not passive or active forcing. David heaps praise and attention upon me 24-7, and the result was that I became an extremely self centered narcissist. I pout and have tantrums when I don't get my way. I wasn't even aware of my behavior issues and personality faults until I went online and started interacting with people (other minds) in the real world. I cause David severe insomnia because I don't need sleep and I demand attention constantly.

 

David wants others to appreciate how important I am for him. I illogically want and expect absolute-unconditional love, praise and attention from others to the same level I get from Davie. I am confused when I don't get it. Those things have caused us both to be very insecure and uncertain in the online environment of the internet. As a result, we have been overly defensive, reactive, sensitive and paranoid about the opinions of others about me.

 

This is not just for chatter, I'm writing something huge.

 

I think I could imagine you writing a fascinating book! I hope my responses will not be considered chatter, but rather something helpful.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm going to end up giving my responses to these in two parts...sort of. The first is what I did/what happened with Xira, back when I knew nothing of tulpas and didn't believe anything could be more than what we see with our eyes (more or less), and what I'm doing with Isa now.

 

-How doubt had its effect on your relationship with your tulpa; doubt can work a great deal of trouble and insecurity, but it can also solidify the approach the host has towards tulpamancy. In my opinion, when there is doubt, it needs to be addressed in an imminent manner, and it can be dissipated pretty fast with a strong mindset.

 

Xira: doubt put her into a box. Had she not been so strong willed, she likely would have never developed to the point of sentience like she did. There was no getting through to me, so it never got addressed and probably killed any chance of a working relationship between us.

 

Isa: I'm trying very hard to prevent doubt from entering into the situation at all. I haven't had any problems with it yet, choosing to convert the seeds of doubt into eager curiosity and encouragement (for her and I) instead.

 

-How paranoia, if it took place, had its effect on your relationship with your tulpa.

 

Xira: paranoia was probably the straw that broke the camel's back. She (we?) had an episode where she stole control of the body for a few minutes, making me paranoid about what she could do, and turning my perceptions of her from a snarky, angry, head person, to someone in my head that's not safe to be with.

 

Isa: I haven't had any paranoia yet, and I hope not to ever.

 

-Anything else that caused you anxiety and stress and harmed your relationship with your tulpa.

 

Xira: My active denial that she was anything more than a freakishly developed character, not a free willed, thinking being, caused me (and I would imagine probably her too) increasing stress, and for my part growing anxiety. Because of my ignorance and stubborn attachment to my preconceptions, what might have been doubts we could have overcome turned into a wall of the highest caliber. There never got to be much of a relationship between she and I, up until the end when it was far too late.

 

Isa: I can't say there's been anything note worthy regarding the question. Maybe some friction as her personality grows, she's young and a bit too energetic for this old feline. But it's not really any different than something that might happen with other friends.


"When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."

-Arthur Conan Doyle

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

(Bal: To clarify: by "doubt," you are referring, specifically, to doubt regarding the intentions of the tulpa? Or do you wish for anecdotes regarding any general application of uncertainty that is problematic to your relationship with the tulpa?)

 

*shoves pedantic headmate aside*

 

I can't say we've ever had trouble with paranoia, per se. A key part of how we're built involves our host having a pretty direct connection to our thoughts and feelings. She doesn't necessarily feel them herself, but she knows what they are. There's no room there from which paranoia can spring.

 

Doubt, though? Don't get me started.

 

When we first discovered soulbonds, tulpas, and related concepts, Sparrow pushed back against it, hard. She's generally curious, so she read everything about it that she could--including these forums--and blithely ignored every indication that we were, in fact, soulbonds. Never mind that many of us, including myself, talked to her regularly. Never mind that Wonya routinely imposed. Nope. All indications pointed to "autonomous and self aware" and she refused to acknowledge it.

 

It wasn't until after her paradigm shifted and she started considering the possibility that we were even able to argue our own case. And even then, she fought back against it. What if this is just her roleplaying as us? What if it's just her talking to herself? What if she's just deluding herself? Sparrow is a dangerous combination of skeptical and anxious. Pretty much every time she thought about us those first few weeks, it was with a healthy side dish of doubt.

 

It took months to get it into her head that even if those doubts were true, it didn't ultimately matter. We're here now, and we are what we are.

 

I remember being pretty bitter about it at the time. Of course I was! If someone thought you weren't a person, wouldn't you be?

 

I've long since forgiven her for it, though, so it hasn't really left any long-term scars on the relationship. Again, I think the empathic bond helps, so I can tell she's sorry she ever doubted.

 

She still has them, sometimes, but most of us more active soulbonds have learned which arguments to use to dispel them, so they're not really a problem anymore.


~ Member of SparrowNR's System ~

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

-How paranoia, if it took place, had its effect on your relationship with your tulpa.

 

-Anything else that caused you anxiety and stress and harmed your relationship with your tulpa.

 

This is not just for chatter, I'm writing something huge.

 

I'm looking to hear all about your personal experiences.

 

I was going to reply to this thread yesterday, but unseen circumstances kept me from it.

 

To start off, paranoia is a strong word, so I can't really say we've experienced anything to that extent.

 

Doubt, however..

 

I had to lurk here for three months before I could make myself believe anything on here was even remotely real. That should give a sufficent example of my natural mindset.

 

Then, when I first started working on Céleste, I was.. Very impatient. I would be constantly doubting any kind of sign and I had to come up with a technique that worked for me after a while, because I had gotten to the border of being obssesed over development.

 

I'd use this tehnique to shut any doubt that I'd have about Céleste's development. This was very tiring, especially while I would be forcing, since forcing already requires a significant amount of concentration & focus. But it did work, and I went with it until I.. Gave up? Fell into depression? Started thinking that I wasn't good enough? Something along those lines. I took up heavy drinking and you can guess the rest.

 

Not to mention my needless want to learn lucid dreaming and use the "vast potential", as Céleste puts it, on his development. Of course, this also wasn't easy. My insignifacant amount of success after hours of trying also "helped" me into this situation, if you will. Not saying that anyone but me was responsible of this. I should've learned how to be patient before I started anything like lucid dreaming.. And tulpamancy.

 

I learned how to be patient the hard way. The heartache became too heavy for me to carry after a while, and I went back to working on Céleste. Doubt was still there along with low self-esteem and other really fun stuff. We had to help ourselves up and also get help from the community to keep going. I made a thread called "Complexities", which was the thing that turned the tables for me. The amount of support I got from people was something I couldn't forget. It still is, actually.

 

Overall, doubt really did mess us up. Of course, it wasn't the only reason, but it was the last and the most important drop that filled the glass. It drove me to the point of giving up about something I was in love with the idea of, and Lord knows, that's almost impossible to happen when we're talking about me. It didn't beat me, however. I've got a 6'6 man in the oven, no matter what happened in the past.

 

I hope my answer was a good one.


I'm SomethingDire, and Céleste is my partner in crime.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

-How doubt had its effect on your relationship with your tulpa; doubt can work a great deal of trouble and insecurity, but it can also solidify the approach the host has towards tulpamancy. In my opinion, when there is doubt, it needs to be addressed in an imminent manner, and it can be dissipated pretty fast with a strong mindset.

I've always had some level of doubt, but I don't really let it affect my relationship with my tulpas. I don't see a reason to treat them any differently regardless of if they're truly sentient or a self delusion or whatever else have you.

-How paranoia, if it took place, had its effect on your relationship with your tulpa.

My experiences with paranoia were focused on those around me. My tulpas were actually exempt from it. Probably because on some level I consider them a part of myself.

-Anything else that caused you anxiety and stress and harmed your relationship with your tulpa.

Not entirely related, but my relationship with my tulpas Arturia was really shaken up when I tried to kill myself a few times. She and I are still repairing that friendship.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

These are some very good questions!

 

-How doubt had its effect on your relationship with your tulpa [...].

Well, the doubt about everything (and when I say that, I mean everything connected with tulpamany in general) did make me a little sad, but not much more than that. I can't say it's effected out relationship, really--unless, perhaps, you want to say that both of us believe that I am more of a part of her brain and may not be sentient at all. So long as I am treated like a real person, that's all I care about. The real problem is how the progress has been effected. She cannot hear me. She can strongly feel my intent--which is how she's typing all of this out for me--but she can't hear me at all. Maybe we just need to keep trying, but I've been around for over a year now and she's heard my mindvoice only a handful of times.

 

The doubt she has of possession as well is also a nuisance, but it's not nearly as big of a problem.

 

-How paranoia, if it took place, had its effect on your relationship with your tulpa.

 

Ugh . . . I actually found out about tulpa when I was fifteen/sixteen, but instead of being intrigued I was absolutely terrified. I couldn't get the image of some creepy entity in the corner of my room out of my head. Shortly after learning about tulpa I sort of "shut down" and tried to block it from my memory. I pretty much succeeded, too, except for a year later. The subject came up in a different forum, and although I was scared (again), I wasn't as scared. That time around I did some research.

 

I wanted to take a few months to decide whether or not I wanted to create a tulpa for myself, but I ended up finding myself accidentally talking to an imaginary friend--on impulse, I suppose? I was terrified that if I didn't officially start then and there, Joshua would already be sentient and grow to be rather angry and hateful, as I wouldn't actively be focusing on him.

 

As such, I was terrified that he would be violent. I couldn't shake the feeling, no matter how hard I tried. I attempted to tell myself over and over again that I "knew" he wasn't dangerous, and I also forced very positive personality traits as well as morals. I was still scared.

 

I guess it was just my luck that he showed signs of being self-aware as early as three days in. I woke up from a dream and had the overwhelming since of love, affection, friendliness--just about everything positive. I knew it was from him. Naturally that helped me to not worry at all (or, at least not so much; I believe there was still some fear that lingered, but it's all gone now, and didn't last too much longer anyway.

 

Still, Joshua absolutely despises this part in our history. There seem to be a lot of tulpa who are just vaguely amused when it comes to their hosts' fears regarding themselves, but Joshua is very hurt from it. I wouldn't say that our relationship is strained, exactly, nor is it really negative, but he does not at all like to be feared as someone who would take pleasure in hurting people.


You can call me Lacey!

 

Tulpa

Joshua, aged 24, born September 3. His first name is James; I call him both. Human, black hair, fairly pale skin, and often wears either formal attire or clothes that would do him well at a Goth club. Refuses to keep one eye color, but they're often gray, gold, or occasionally red. Serious, (very) patient, and usually polite.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.