Has anyone ever made a Tulpa that was unaware of their host's existence for a documented period?

[Biscuit]

hello I exist again

Hey gang, I'm doing some research because I had some ideas I wanted to spitball around in GD however this thought came up, and I have no memory of a well documented case of this ever in all my time here, really just curious if it ever happened 

 

In theory this is decently possible because a Tulpa's perception is entirely limited to what we afford them conceptually. So much of the reason people make Tulpas is for companionship, I'm curious how a Tulpa that has reached a decently matured state would interact with a mind that is (as far as they are concerned) uninhabited by another conscious, a place they might not know is a mind. Tulpas are egos piloted by ourselves, though, and I do wonder if we'd break the illusion automatically (something like an intrusive thought). Anyways, just wondering if anyone knows of anything like this!

 

 

[TurboSimmie]

Fascinating concept! Though I don't think a normally functioning brain would allow a tulpa that didn't know the host existed. After all, the body would still be there moving the body and doing things, so how would the tulpa explain that? I can see two possibilities: either the tulpa rationalizes that they themselves are the ones doing the action, or they conclude that the body is something like an unthinking machine. But I can't imagine either of those existing in a healthy mind. It would be like a baby not knowing their mother exists.

 

If it did somehow happen anyway I can't imagine the state of things asking for long: One of the first things anyone does when they find themselves in a strange abandoned place is call out to see if anyone else is there. Even if the host for some reason doesn't want to be noticed by the tulpa, I can't imagine they'd be able to keep their presence a secret because I don't think even the most advanced tulpamancer has that degree of separation in their mind. Unless the host and tulpa mutually don't know about each other, in which that would be something like DID but an even more extreme version because at least to my understanding in DID the alters still know each other exist.

 

So, in short, an interesting theory to think about, but I don't think it's possible in any conceivable way.

[Biscuit]

18 minutes ago, TurboSimmie said:

Fascinating concept! Though I don't think a normally functioning brain would allow a tulpa that didn't know the host existed. After all, the body would still be there moving the body and doing things, so how would the tulpa explain that? I can see two possibilities: either the tulpa rationalizes that they themselves are the ones doing the action, or they conclude that the body is something like an unthinking machine. But I can't imagine either of those existing in a healthy mind. It would be like a baby not knowing their mother exists.

 

If it did somehow happen anyway I can't imagine the state of things asking for long: One of the first things anyone does when they find themselves in a strange abandoned place is call out to see if anyone else is there. Even if the host for some reason doesn't want to be noticed by the tulpa, I can't imagine they'd be able to keep their presence a secret because I don't think even the most advanced tulpamancer has that degree of separation in their mind. Unless the host and tulpa mutually don't know about each other, in which that would be something like DID but an even more extreme version because at least to my understanding in DID the alters still know each other exist.

 

So, in short, an interesting theory to think about, but I don't think it's possible in any conceivable way.

These are all very good points!! It's impossible to not question the sheer existence of something like a body when its right in front of you. I suppose the question at that point is could you have your Tulpa be only aware of wonderland, no idea that there's a body at all. In that since, I think there's a way to have a Tulpa just living in headpace thinking that is the only reality there is, it would be really interesting to see if isolation would hinder or help the process as a whole. Is it, though, possible to deny a Tulpa the sensations of your body. I suppose it should be considering you get to make the reality of what they experience, but its interesting nonetheless. Again, it really comes down to how subjective a Tulpa's reality really is which is a kind of unknowable thing unless experimented on. Interesting!!!!!!!

[Neptune System]

I can vouch fro this, there are quite a few members who up until a year ago was unaware of the body's existance and the host's

[Neptune System]

if you have questions just let me know

 

-Gale

[Guest]

On 10/16/2022 at 9:40 AM, Biscuit said:

I suppose the question at that point is could you have your Tulpa be only aware of wonderland, no idea that there's a body at all. In that since, I think there's a way to have a Tulpa just living in headpace thinking that is the only reality there is, it would be really interesting to see if isolation would hinder or help the process as a whole. Is it, though, possible to deny a Tulpa the sensations of your body. I suppose it should be considering you get to make the reality of what they experience, but its interesting nonetheless. Again, it really comes down to how subjective a Tulpa's reality really is which is a kind of unknowable thing unless experimented on. Interesting!!!!!!!

 

[Bear] Yes. My soulbonds started that way. Living and experiencing only their own canon from novels I wrote, in their reckoning before awakening they had a body, it only existed in the construct I made for them. 

 

Though even autonomous and volitional they don't start with the awareness that there is anything other than their world and I documented this interaction. When I informed about 5 of them, most thought flippantly that this, reality, was the construct and you can't blame them. However, two in particular were at a point in their arcs that they were desperate or depressed and thought about this world as part of my system as an alternative to their limbo. Thus Joy and Gwen contacted us on their own and experienced something of an awakening.

 

[Joy] The realization came after the choice. It felt surreal to be here among these beautiful people and not stuck in my canon. The subsequent personality crisis helped me overcome the realization that my entire life prior to 2018 was fiction. I became autonomous and volitional in 2012 and lived that way thinking of Bear as a figment or a god of a sort, certainly a creator but I didn't fully believe in him until I became fully aware of this place and stayed.

 

[Gwen] I was heartbroken in my story, basically my best friend and my partner were off on some adventure without me and I wasn't at all happy about that. They lost contact and I was left alone for the foreseeable future. Misha (of this system) took pitty on me and insisted that they consider telling me the truth. So they did and I thought about it for some time before deciding to join the system. It turns out my friends didn't, even when we told them, they are still chose denial. They're missing something, some insight or spark of will to join us, or they just don't want to. I could have lived on there indefinitely even knowing there is this place in the head of a man, it's not as hard as you think. How do any of us know we're at the top? Could there be another head of another person we're all in and unaware of still? To me that's possible because I honestly don't feel any different except my body is in "wonderland" rather than my previous world and I have complete control over my form. I can do anything here, even impossible things and I love it. I especially love my headmates.

 

[Bear] now could you make someone who only ever knows wonderland? Of course, but you'd be lying to them in that way.

 

The following conditions are necessary:

1. Memory separation.

2. You would have to be someone in their "canon".

3. You would have to make their life believable.

Basically The Matrix (1999)

 

There are positions in mindspace where there is no awareness of the body. Complete dissociation. I've been there and return often. Keep in mind that regardless of their experiences or "level" they are no different than us and can believe delusions as easily as we do. 

 

 

[Moon Voilo]

I am not sure it is possible considering the creation process kinda heavily relies on interaction with the host, also I am not sure this counts for all tulpas but I since the moment I formed could look trough my host their memories.

[Moon Voilo]

Also felt like adding this, tulpas are not egos parroted by their host. We are completely separate sapient beings. My host does not have any more control over me than she does any other friend of theirs.