Problems with hearing and wonderland/imagination/intrusive thoughts

[Hopkirk]

[align=justify]It's my first post here so I have to say: hello!

 

I have a trouble with describe my situation in native language but I try to explain my problem. (my English is terrible but I try my best. If you find any mistake and you have time, go ahead and correct me if you want.)

 

I have two tulpae more than six months. I still have problem with listening them. I hear them only when I want to and only short sentence/few words. What I hear 'now' is similar to my situation before I found this topic. When I played sometimes I talked what I did in the game or talked to myself when I rode train etc. In those situations sometimes I heard simple answers.

 

What's the difference between these situations and tulpae. Where's difference with talking to herself for example like when we imagine situation when we practicing hard conversation with parents? I had a few tulpae in the past? I don't know. I know only one, I can't hear them now. Like a said: I hear them only when I want to and only short sentence/few words and I have problem with find difrence between my thoughts and thoughts my tulpae.

 

Secondly. I can't see difference between my imagination (and intrusive thoughts) and wonderland.

When I imagine something it happens in wonderland. When I see something in wonderladn I don't know it realy happend or it's just my imagination. Sometimes I see terrible situations - I do not want to describe this situations - with Aisling and Eris. They can't control herself - like we watch movie; we was spectators in own body. I have feelings it was me. I have feelings that I controlled them - my fear controlled them.

 

This hard to explain. Sometimes I think I jump to other place - copy of my wonderland with this bad vision. Its like I'm in two place - one with the view from the third-person and this vision and second with first-person view in wonderladn.

 

How can I finaly hear them when they want to say something ? How can I separate them from me and how to get rid of these problems?[/align]

[Laurora]

From what I've read in other threads, I'm pretty sure Wonderland is just a fancy word for imagination, so your imagining problem is probably nothing to worry about. I dunno about the other issues your having, though, but I'm having the same "only hearing them when you want to" problem. I just assumed it was normal, but we'd have to see what other members have to say.

[waffles]

The answer to both "What's the difference" questions would be your own expectation or designation. If you talk to something believing that you will make a tulpa, then that's what happens. Meanwhile, you can do the same process expecting something different (or nothing) and therefore not get a tulpa.

For your wonderland, the same thing applies. It's essentially your imagination, with the difference that you tell yourself that it's a place for you and your tulpa. Also, many people choose to remember their wonderland and come back to 'the same place', so to speak.

That means that you can easily control things that go on. It's true that a lot of people have trouble with a third-person viewpoint, but just remember that everything that goes on is controllable by you.

 

And for your tulpa problems; I don't know about the quality of Russian/Polish (that's a guess) advice, but there are a couple of differentiation exercises on this site to try.

Otherwise, I'd recommend being patient. Talk to your tulpas more, and try not to worry too much about whether it's you or them. This kind of thing always improves eventually, if you put the time and effort into it.

[Hopkirk]

I'll try to do with this problems. Thank you for your answers.

[Chupi]

Regarding imagination vs. wonderland: It's all basically imagination plus expectation and assumption, though I do seem to have a few different levels of it.

 

First, there's a vague idea of an action. That's either in words or just an idea. This is really just a seed of an action, not even thinking about doing it, so it obviously doesn't affect the wonderland.

 

Second, there's planning/thinking. I think about, plan or consider an action. This is very brief, happens really fast, and doesn't affect the wonderland. It happens nearly effortlessly when I think about doing something. I can think about an action without doing it, just like IRL. Useful for pathfinding or thinking how to construct something.

 

Third, there's doing. This plays in approximately real time, feels more distinct and 'forced' than planning, and does affect the wonderland. It takes more effort to do this, as it's more detailed than planning.

 

Intrusive thoughts appear to be a mix of planning and doing. Most are merely images of an unwanted actions, are planning imagination, and don't affect anything. There's also what I class more as visualization derps, like an object spinning when it should hold still. These feel as real as the wonderland, but don't affect it; I'm merely incorrectly visualizing what's there. Most of these go away if I focus on reality for a moment and then return to the wonderland.

 

But then there's physics errors and misbehaving/stuck objects. One physics error I've had was friction not working properly on some objects; if I made a roughly spherical plush doll and tried to hug it, it would slip upward and out of my arms really fast. (Solution: made less spherical plushie, and the friction issues seems to have resolved itself with time.) An example of a stuck object is when I replaced the front door on my wonderland house and the new one wouldn't open. The knob either wouldn't turn, or it would turn but not open. Basically it acted locked. I could forcefully visualize it opening, but that only made an illusory copy of it and the real one still blocked my way. (Solution: every time it did this, I ripped it off its hinges, tore it apart and put back the door that worked. After a few repetitions of this it stayed fixed.) All of these *do* affect the wonderland, and seem to be glitches in whatever in the brain is running it. These go on existing even if I leave the wonderland and come back.

 

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Planning vs. doing, and puppeting:

 

If I think about a tulpa doing something or briefly imaging it like planning, they often do it. Lyra says it's definitely her doing the thing. I'm merely suggesting the action. They don't always do what I suggest, either. This happens a lot by accident if I just think about them doing something, but doesn't really matter.

 

If I imagine them doing something in greater detail, like doing, I can puppet them. This feels to me almost like mentally grabbing their limbs and moving them myself. I just asked Lyra and she said it feels like I'm in her, almost. This really only happens when I try to do it, or if I'm really struggling to visualize and try too hand.

 

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NOTE: I have no idea how universal what I said is. It could all just be from my particular set of beliefs about how my wonderland and my imagination works.

[Guest kingfisher]

Planning vs. doing, and puppeting

 

[iNT + 1]

That's a great interpretation there.

[Chupi]

[iNT + 1]

That's a great interpretation there.

 

That came from talking to Lyra about it one day. I "planning" imagined her doing something, she did it, and I asked her if I puppeted her. She said it was her. I then "doing" imagined her doing something else, and before I could even ask I got a sort of "WTF man, why'd you do that" sort of emotional response. She then confirmed that I had just puppeted, forcing her to do something with no real choice.