[split] The Product of Imagination

[Floh]

The point is not to convince you. You have your own beliefs, and that is a good thing.

My problem is how you express these beliefs by "dissing" others. You talked about religion ; let's say we were a group of christians.. You would be in our church, yelling "LOL YOUR GOD DOESN'T EXIST YOU FOOLZ". Respectful people don't do this.

 

"Our brains imagine that our tulpas get annoyed, because that is what we expect them to do.  Sometimes they seem to do something surprising because unconsciously we want them to do something surprising.  "

 

Here, you litterally spit on the idea of tulpas and on their independance.

 

I'm glad you say "It is not skepticism done just to insult people", and I'm glad you are expressing this skepticism. But, even if it's not the point of this, you ARE insulting. I feel offended by the way you express your doubts. Cora is too, Tulpa is too, and I'm pretty sure we aren't the only ones.

You actually aren't expressing doubts or skepticism, you are expressing a certitude that tulpas are daydreaming entities imagined, pupetted and parotted by the brain, with no independence, sentience or even existence. You still use "real" instead of "physical" for example.

 

Please realize that your right of expressing yourself doesn't allow you to poop on others freely.

I have the right to express myself, but I am not allowed to go in the street and yell things at people that would offend them. Or at least they would respond to me as we are right now.

 

Saying like    Buhuhu you are a bunch of religious extremists and you don't let me express myself    doesn't work anymore on me. Ain't no victim here, we are just asking for a bit of consideration, respect, empathy sympathy and choosing your words thoughtfully. We are NOT asking you to " have only the same opinion and only restate/repeat the same opinion as the consensus of tulpamancers." NEVER. (Well at least I'm not)

[Guest Anonymous]

Mistgod is taking a break for the rest of the day and feels hungry for fruitcake for some reason.

 

@Floh,

 

Mistgod really isn't trying to deliberately insult or hurt you or anyone else personally. He's just being Mistgod.

[Floh]

Yup I realised that as he said he wasn't. I'd just love him to weigh his words and respect people more..

[Guest Anonymous]

I apologize to Melian, but I couldn't just let this go.  This actually ticks me off a bit.  

 

The point is not to convince you. You have your own beliefs, and that is a good thing.

My problem is how you express these beliefs by "dissing" others. You talked about religion ; let's say we were a group of christians.. You would be in our church, yelling "LOL YOUR GOD DOESN'T EXIST YOU FOOLZ". Respectful people don't do this.

 

I am not dissing anyone.  This isn't a church or a religion.  (or is it?)  

 

"Our brains imagine that our tulpas get annoyed, because that is what we expect them to do.  Sometimes they seem to do something surprising because unconsciously we want them to do something surprising.  "

 

Here, you litterally spit on the idea of tulpas and on their independance.

 

Not true!  That would be true if there were no tulpamancers who believed that their tulpas, and probably all tulpas, are an illusion.  But there are other tulpamancers who feel the same way I do about it.  The falsehood is to imply that there is a single block of unanimous belief on that.  There isn't.  There is a strong consensus for sentience, that I admit.  But it is NOT unanimous.  It isn't just me.  Some who have reported successfully creating tulpas do not believe they are real and they would probably agree with my statement that you quoted.  

 

I'm glad you say "It is not skepticism done just to insult people", and I'm glad you are expressing this skepticism. But, even if it's not the point of this, you ARE insulting. I feel offended by the way you express your doubts. Cora is too, Tulpa is too, and I'm pretty sure we aren't the only ones.

 

You are insulted because I want to make sure new people are presented with more than one idea of how tulpas work.  I disagree with telling new visitors explicitly, or even implying, that it is beyond question that tulpas are independently sentient.  I resent it because that is not true.  That disenfranchises and insults me. It has not been established by anyone scientifically that tulpas are independent sentient entitities.  So why tell them such things are fact?  I think we need to emphasize that tulpas seem to be real and are apparently sentient.  We need to emphasize that it seems to be autonomous behavior.  We need to explain that no one really know yet for sure what the truth of it is.  

 

I just happen to be on the other side of the fence with the minority of people who believe tulpas are illusory.  I am not insulting anyone by simply having that view point and expressing it.  If you are insulted you are being unreasonable and have a false assumption that there is a single block of agreement among tulpamancers.  

 

You actually aren't expressing doubts or skepticism, you are expressing a certitude that tulpas are daydreaming entities imagined, pupetted and parotted by the brain, with no independence, sentience or even existence. You still use "real" instead of "physical" for example.

 

Just as you guys constantly express certitude that tulpas are real and everyone better follow it or else.  I do admit I could be wrong and have done so many times.  I just feel I am probably not wrong.  

 

Please realize that your right of expressing yourself doesn't allow you to poop on others freely.

I have the right to express myself, but I am not allowed to go in the street and yell things at people that would offend them. Or at least they would respond to me as we are right now.

 

I am sorry if not believing is offensive but I am not going to just hide and be quiet to make everyone else feel comfortable by not being challenged.  

 

Saying like    Buhuhu you are a bunch of religious extremists and you don't let me express myself    doesn't work anymore on me. Ain't no victim here, we are just asking for a bit of consideration, respect, empathy sympathy and choosing your words thoughtfully.

 

I do have consideration and sympathy.  I just don't believe that tulpas are real.  It seems all you want me to do is shut up and go away so you are free to have a single block of agreement and consensus.  I am a problem because I see things differently and actually say it.  The way I see it, that is what a discussion forum is for, especially one that expounds that it is "For Science!"  

 

We are NOT asking you to " have only the same opinion and only restate/repeat the same opinion as the consensus of tulpamancers." NEVER. (Well at least I'm not)

 

You could have fooled me!

 

Well Mistgod is back. Until a good scientific study is done or we invent a camera that is capable of seeing an imposed Tulpa, there's nothing to argue against his position.

 

Thank you.

[Luminesce]

The worst part is you all present tulpa sentience to new people as if it is established fact, when it is far from the truth.

 

"The truth" being that we can't know. Not that we don't know, but that we can't. Anyways, we've been over the belief thing a billion times. An awful lot of people are not strong enough to overcome their "unscientific lack-of-belief", which creates an imbalance if it's not met with unscientific belief. This is true, period. We cannot know the truth, and yet many are unscientific in their choice to not believe in tulpas because they aren't proven. This is.. some sort of fallacy that scientists are aware of. If something cannot be proven false, then you cannot let the lack of evidence convince you it is. That's unscientific.

 

We're barely practicing science anyways though. Point is, people most often come here because they want to make a tulpa. To achieve that goal it's better to unscientifically believe than to unscientifically not. For those simply seeking knowledge, or willing to pursue the "truth" as they can know it behind tulpamancy, if they do more research they'll definitely run into the frequent ", but we don't know for sure || but that's just what I think || what you believe creates your reality, and is "true" to you (hey that one's me!)". We definitely give off the impression that tulpas are sentient. But just because we discuss them on that assumption doesn't mean we claim it as true. When it comes to discussing "truth", you will almost always get one of those aforementioned answers. I never see anyone say "Yes, tulpas are sentient."

 

 

Anyways, you're absolutely not doing what you said you would at any of the occasions you claimed to be leaving or restricting your posting. Just FYI.