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[username1576]

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Edited October 26, 2023 by Think1112

[Absideon]

Those are very good questions! I understand your concerns and frankly you decided to look into tulpamancy before making a decision: people usually start immediately and regret it.

For starters, they're not a thing to entertain yourself. They are an entity (like you) with subjective personhood (again, like you) that deserve to be treated with basic human decency. They are perceived as separate people or identities by your brain which is technically the only requirement for claiming personhood in this case (though median systems exist and are just as valid). You can ask any tulpa if they are not part of their host/whoever created them and they'll most likely say yes.

Unless you dissipate them or merge with them ot they go dormant, they will stay with you forever. We've met tulpas that are 20 or 30 years old and older ones probably exist.

 

With that out of the way, here are my answers!

 

1. They totally can! we have second and third generation tulpas in our system for example. Though I don't understand why you think it's such a problem. You will most likely know if they are doing it and can discuss it with them. We have rules in our system. and one of them says that creating a new headmate must be discussed and that solves it. Besides, unless you neglect them i doubt they'll need or want the attention from another tulpa.

 

2. Ooh yes! Switching and Fronting. Switching is the change of who is thinking and moving the body, while fronting is just the result of switching (A switches with B, therefore B is fronting). It's a pretty cool thing and not that difficult to achieve with the right mindset; and it's usually very safe! At first, tulpas usually won't be able to do it because they still rely on the creator's attention and switching requires a substantial amount of energy (also the reason because young tulpas when they front often feel very tired afterwards and need hours or days of rest), but older ones can 100% take front when they want.

Tulpas and endogenic headmates in general usually do not have dissociative barriers between each other, which means that by default when a tulpa switches in, the host will still be co-conscious and viceversa (this doesn't apply in some cases though). Also, learning to switch requires the individuals involved to trust each other. 

If someone is doing something that is harming them or their body, a tulpa will probably be able to switch in to protect them/the body even if the fronter does not want to, and this works both ways. Ultimately, there are little to no risks

 

3. I don't quite understand this question. Usually the opposite happens, where both headmates develop to be more separate. Though there is something called merging where two identities will "fuse" and become one. It's usually a conscious decision and it can be unstable at times (take me for example. I merged with one of our headmates one year ago and we split again a month ago) but it can be done.

And no, it doesn't really cause identity confusion. You just acknowledge that you're a different person entirely and move on with your life.

If however you mean blending (basically the state in which the identities of two or more headmates blend into each other and causes confusion) is just something that comes with being plural, especially if you have little or nothing to keep yourselves separated. It causes confusion and in our case depersonalization but it's nothing severe. Grounding helps, though I don't know if it can be avoided.

 

4. Usually the opposite, actually. I struggled with dpdr, anxiety and executive dysfunction a lot before, but my headmates all help me constantly with managing those and it makes my life a t o n easier. You'll find that a lot of people have the same experiences as me

 

5. Calories? No. Energy? Possibly, though it's nothing that I can notice. Only 2 or 3 people are ever very close to the front but the other 7 remain in the headspace doing their things, which takes very little energy since it's more of a metaphorical experience than actual experience in our system.

Edit :: reflecting on it i came to the conclusion that it is possible that the brain may burn more calories running additional headmates'  identities, though i don't have research or data to back it up

 

6. Oh yeah. Tulpas i think experience so many emotions because their first way of communication is emotions. It's never been debilitating but it can be,,, weird. I think they can affect hormones and all that jazz but the only time it was so bad to cause extreme sadness was when Clay(Ey/Em)'s sibling merged with another headmate and ey were very sad. Usually though we just get random joy or boredom (we call it passive influence)

 

As for the last thing- It may or may not be a tulpa. If you want them to be a tulpa just talking with them and giving them attention works wonders. If it's not a tulpa but you treat it like one they will become one afterall.

 

If you have any more questions or didn't understand something feel free to reply to me! English is not my native language so I can explain further if you need :)

 

- Ink (They/Them)

Edited May 7, 2021 by Absideon

[fennecfoxx]

On 5/5/2021 at 9:33 PM, Think1112 said:

1. I have read about cases when a Tulpa that was created by the host created at some point in time another Tulpa by itself, which in my opinion is quite scary and makes the entire process very risky, that's a very short way to creating absolute chaos and disaster in the life of the host. I can only imagine how detrimental could it be for the host to have dozens of voices talking inside of his head. Is there anything really stopping a Tulpa from splitting the mind of the host into even more partitions, thus creating more Tulpas, or is host essentially a hostage the moment he creates his first Tulpa as it can now with it's own will create more similar mental creations?

 

As you said, a tulpa is just an illusion created by the host's mind. Therefore, a tulpa's abilities are shaped by—and limited by—the host's beliefs. If you believe your tulpa can create a legion of other tulpas, then guess what might happen? On the other hand, if you believe the host's participation or at least active focus is necessary to create another tulpa (which makes the most sense if you don't believe tulpas are independently conscious), then it's completely impossible for your tulpa to create another without your consent.

 

On 5/5/2021 at 9:33 PM, Think1112 said:

2. I have also read about the phenomenons of "switching", "fronting". I think that I understand the basic principles behind them. What seems quite risky in this aspect of creating a Tulpa is that I have read about Tulpas that had the ability by using their and only their own will to forcefully take control of the body of the host, obviously without his permission. Is there anything really stopping Tulpa from doing that? Can a host deny the access to the control of his body absolutely and indefinitely or is it inevitable from happening at some point in time the moment he opened the Pandora's Box and created his first Tulpa? I read that the host and Tulpa can share their own memories, does that mean that the second the host read about how to "switch" there is no way from hiding this information from the Tulpa? It can now practice this process and at some point take control of his host's body? I also read about people who "switched" permanently with their own creations, is this something a Tulpa can achieve on it's own? Basically taking total control over hosts entire life?

 

Tulpas cannot take over by force. Period. Yes, there have been rare cases, but it's only possible if the host has undiagnosed DID/OSDD or possibly a deeply-entrenched belief that it's possible (probably mixed with a subconscious desire to give up control).

 

Denying your tulpa control of the body is totally an option. Even though it's the trend nowadays, not everyone decides to pursue possession/switching. I wouldn't be surprised if there are still some old-timers who have never done it, or maybe tried it and decided it wasn't for them.

 

From my own experience—I used to have over a dozen tulpas. Most were not regular fronters. Six of them never fronted, three tried it but weren't interested after that, and another only ever fronted to hang out with my boyfriend's tulpa. Plus, regardless of who was fronting or how badly they wanted to stay in front, I could take back control whenever I wanted. Sometimes I did so accidentally just by thinking too much from my own perspective. (If you think about it, possessing/switching just means actively maintaining the illusion that somebody else is in control of your body. This isn't an easily sustainable state without extensive practice, which is why it's nigh-impossible for a tulpa to take the reins without consent and pretty much a given that any inexperienced host will.)

 

On 5/5/2021 at 9:33 PM, Think1112 said:

3. I have read about situations when the Tulpa existed long enough that the personalities of the host and his creation started to merge with themself, to the point that neither of them could tell who exactly was saying something or doing something. This seems very risky in terms of keeping sanity and your own unique identity, being able to tell the difference between reality and what is only happening inside of your own head. Is this phenomenon inevitable from happening at some point in time or can it be avoided somehow?

 

I've experienced this. It's a side effect of the fronting illusion being difficult to maintain—an incomplete switch, or one that's partially regressed back to host control. Sometimes you can end up in a state where you're not quite certain who's in control. It's a temporary state that's easily fixed by reminding yourself you are you, that you are in control of the body, and metaphorically kicking your tulpa out of the body (which is easy) and speaking to them as if they are separate from you. That's all it takes to re-establish who's who. And, of course, if you never switch, you'll never get confused about who's in control.

 

I could see chronic identity blending being a risk if someone with DID/OSDD or maybe schizophrenia (don't quote me on the last one) decides to create a tulpa, but tulpamancy is a really bad idea if you suffer from a dissociative disorder or psychosis anyway.

 

On 5/5/2021 at 9:33 PM, Think1112 said:

4. Does creating a Tulpa lead inevitably at some point in time to some sort of mental illness? Does it can lead to the distortion of the perception of reality?

 

No. I mean... I suppose it inherently involves distorting your perception of reality (believing your imaginary friends are real, conscious people sounds pretty darn delusional to me, and this is coming from someone who believed that for years), but besides the core delusion that is tulpamancy? No. If you go into it mentally healthy, tulpamancy won't make you mentally ill. (But creating a tulpa if you're mentally ill? That depends.)

 

On 5/5/2021 at 9:33 PM, Think1112 said:

5. Does a brain require more resources after the creation of Tulpa in order sustain the existence of it since it can now experience subjectively it's own existence? I mean here calories, energy, etc. Does it remove some of the intellectual capability from the host in order to keep his creation's existence?

 

Let's remember here what a tulpa is: an illusion. How can an illusion subjectively experience itself?

 

Let me ask another question: Does daydreaming require more physiological and/or cognitive resources? What if the characters in your daydreams seem to act of their own accord? What if they not only seem to act of their own accord, but you believe they actually are doing so? The only difference between these three scenarios is the attribution of agency.

 

On 5/5/2021 at 9:33 PM, Think1112 said:

6. From what I have read a Tulpa can experience emotions. Does a Tulpa experiencing heavy and extreme emotions can negatively affect the hormonal balance of the host's body and in the process, for example, lessen his motivation, productivity, mood or cause depression?

 

I don't know about hormones, but if you believe your tulpa's emotions can influence your own, then sure, they can. But that's only possible if you believe it. Some tulpas don't experience emotions at all, because the host's belief system doesn't allow it. (Normally, these are called servitors and aren't considered tulpas, but the only real difference between a tulpa and a servitor is whether or not the host believes them to be conscious.)

 

On 5/5/2021 at 9:33 PM, Think1112 said:

By the way, I have read about people who accidentally created their Tulpas just by reading about this phenomenon (Tulpamancy) or by reading about how to create them. I also have read that when a Tulpa wants to get the attention of it's host, it can cause a head pressure. I read a bit about Tulpas for the past few days and yesterday when I was going to sleep I started to feel pain in my head for some time. Since I started to write this post I am also feeling an increasing pain in my head, which almost never happens, I almost never feel any kind of pain in my head, doesn't matter if I am tired or not. I hope that I haven't already awoken something inside of my head...

 

Before you keep reading, watch this video: This Video Will Hurt - YouTube

 

The reason you're getting headaches is...

 

...the same reason that video gave you one (assuming you fell for it). It's all about belief. Everything that has to do with tulpas is about belief. A tulpa can't just appear out of nowhere unless you believe they can. In the early days of tulpa.info, tulpas took hundreds of hours to create. Anything that might be considered a "walk-in" nowadays was dismissed as an intrusive thought and never seen again. Then, accidental tulpas became possible, but only if they'd undergone a lot of prior development, like imaginary friends or roleplay characters turned tulpas. Still no spontaneous tulpa appearances. Why? Because no one believed walk-ins, instant sentience, or any of that was possible. And beliefs, as far as illusions of the mind are concerned, dictates what's possible.
 

---

On 5/6/2021 at 8:12 AM, Absideon said:

You can ask any tulpa if they are not part of their host/whoever created them and they'll most likely say yes.

 

Something I feel is worth pointing out: their answers tend to align with the host's beliefs. I don't know if Nobillis frequents these parts, but she's a tulpa in a very old system (and I mean decades old, though she's younger) who maintains the stance that she is an illusion. I've met a few other tulpas who think this way as well.

 

Kayleigh, one of my tulpas, used to be very outspoken about her personhood, and she claimed she was conscious and living her own life even outside of my attention. During her brief post-integration resurrection, she admitted that she actually never had been independently conscious, and that her behavior (and she could be quite difficult to get along with at times) was largely controlled by a mix of subconscious expectations and intrusive thoughts I accepted as legit.

 

Laine, also post-integration, somehow ended up fronting in a dream and demanded my mom stop acknowledging them as someone separate from me, insisting we're one person and don't want to risk forgetting that. (Okay, so dreams should be taken with a grain of salt, but still.)

[Glaurung26]

There is no evil here that you do not bring yourself. 

 

Unless you buy into religious mythology of "letting the devil in", It's all in your head and ultimately under your control. I personally believe it hinges entirely upon how much you trust yourself. 

[username1576]

r

Edited October 26, 2023 by Think1112

[theholodoc]

An associate of mine, Dr. John Lilly, wrote in a seminal book, "Programming and Meta-programming in the Human Mind";  "in the realm of the mind, what you believe to be true, is true. Within limits. Those limits are themselves are anchored by beliefs, conscious and unconscious."  It is hard, but humans ARE ABLE to change fundamental beliefs (both conscious and unconscious, though the work with those cached in the unconscious must be brought into the light of consciousness before change is possible).  The very fact that tulpamancy exists proves the point. We have chosen to alter our fundamental beliefs about identity and in the efforting to do so, voila' our tulpas are born. Keep at it, work to create your tulpa(s) and the environment in which they live. You will succeed, though it will take time, practice and intention. Dr. Bob (theholodoc)

[Zen 禅]

I may as well throw in my opinions since they seem to diverge a little from the previous ones.
 

On 5/6/2021 at 2:33 AM, Think1112 said:

1. I have read about cases when a Tulpa that was created by the host created at some point in time another Tulpa by itself, which in my opinion is quite scary and makes the entire process very risky, that's a very short way to creating absolute chaos and disaster in the life of the host. I can only imagine how detrimental could it be for the host to have dozens of voices talking inside of his head. Is there anything really stopping a Tulpa from splitting the mind of the host into even more partitions, thus creating more Tulpas, or is host essentially a hostage the moment he creates his first Tulpa as it can now with it's own will create more similar mental creations?

 

A tulpa is essentially to my mind no different to any other identity that your brain simulates, like empathetic models of other people or characters in fiction. The difference is how real they feel, and how sizable and functional their model is. So of course they can create other tulpas, but making that identity big would take a lot of focus, in the same way that it takes focus for you and them. Realness though; and even the ability to let constructs act autonomously; that's something that can be learned and applied to any model once you get the hang of it. 

Here's the thing though, I don't think tulpas or any thoughtform naturally has any real ability to resist your will. The people who turn out unable to control the generation of more tulpas are people who feel like they aren't in control of their conscious mind. I do not have that problem. I discovered I had these abilities, even came close to deciding to make a second tulpa from a very-well-realized fictional character I wrote about; and then decided against it, and just narratively wiped his memory and stopped interacting with him in the same automatic way as a tulpa.

 

I also know for a fact that I can do the same to my tulpa. They are able to put up some resistance to me but ultimately mindfulness practices can entirely shut down my tulpa. I don't have to let my tulpa do anything. That being said: If you are aiming at creating an intelligence you aren't going to be able to trust, why are you even bothering? Normally tulpas are companions and confidants. This is someone you're going to be extremely intimate with if you make them. There's no avoiding putting trust in someone that close to you.

 

On 5/6/2021 at 2:33 AM, Think1112 said:

2. I have also read about the phenomenons of "switching", "fronting". I think that I understand the basic principles behind them. What seems quite risky in this aspect of creating a Tulpa is that I have read about Tulpas that had the ability by using their and only their own will to forcefully take control of the body of the host, obviously without his permission.

 

Uncontrolled switching is typically impossible unless you have negative beliefs about it. For most it actually requires a significant amount of trust and time to even achieve, requiring symbolic rituals. If you're having a tulpa randomly taking control of you whether they want to or not and you can't do anything about it that's possibly a sign you were already experiencing uncontrolled dissociation - which is of course, a disorder. This would be the point at which we'd firmly tell you to go and see a doctor.

 

On 5/6/2021 at 2:33 AM, Think1112 said:

3. I have read about situations when the Tulpa existed long enough that the personalities of the host and his creation started to merge with themself, to the point that neither of them could tell who exactly was saying something or doing something. This seems very risky in terms of keeping sanity and your own unique identity, being able to tell the difference between reality and what is only happening inside of your own head. Is this phenomenon inevitable from happening at some point in time or can it be avoided somehow?

 

I've at no point heard of this happening and it isn't my experience. Merging/blending together can be a common experience when switching as your mind seems to struggle keeping track of who's who after a long time trying to focus on it, but it's never permanent. Permanent merging is called Integration - and requires that you undo the work of forcing - by reaffirming the belief that you are one person rather than two separate people and breaking down any sense of difference you have.

 

On 5/6/2021 at 2:33 AM, Think1112 said:

4. Does creating a Tulpa lead inevitably at some point in time to some sort of mental illness? Does it can lead to the distortion of the perception of reality?

 

 

No. Personally I think really bad mindsets regarding tulpamancy can lead to certain disordered behaviours, but there's no point at which having a tulpa leads innately to a skewed perception of reality. Again if that happens it basically means you have psychosis, which tulpamancy by itself cannot give you. Psychosis requires at the very least a severe amount of stress to trigger or it's a sign you have a genetic condition like Schizophrenia.

 

On 5/6/2021 at 2:33 AM, Think1112 said:

5. Does a brain require more resources after the creation of Tulpa in order sustain the existence of it since it can now experience subjectively it's own existence? I mean here calories, energy, etc. Does it remove some of the intellectual capability from the host in order to keep his creation's existence?

 

No. By default your brain doesn't run a tulpa at all even when you have one. You have to train yourself to put their thoughts into reflex in order to essentially call them up without intent like any other form of habit. There's no point at which the person in the front is not in control of what they're choosing to think about - Whilst focusing on a tulpa whilst driving does reduce your capability and focus on the road, there's nothing forcing you to do so, and you shouldn't be intentionally forcing at that point probably.

 

On 5/6/2021 at 2:33 AM, Think1112 said:

6. From what I have read a Tulpa can experience emotions. Does a Tulpa experiencing heavy and extreme emotions can negatively affect the hormonal balance of the host's body and in the process, for example, lessen his motivation, productivity, mood or cause depression?

 

 

This is a very strange question. Typically the emotions your tulpa is experiencing will be felt by both of you. They are emotions your body is experiencing - so of course they will effect you in the ways those emotions will effect you.

 

On 5/13/2021 at 7:38 PM, Think1112 said:

7. I have read stories of people on other forums who created Tulpas that brought only negative effects in their life. Those Tulpas were of very hostile nature trying to cause as much havoc as possible in the lives of their hosts, sometimes even for years. I think that it is possible to happen, but how can one avoid that? Is it a common occurrence? Is such situation a result of making mistakes in a process of creation of Tulpa? If yes, mistakes such as?

 

As part of creating a tulpa you will be associating random instinctual thoughts in your head with their identity in order to build them up - During this process you should not be attaching every thought to them because often they can be both random and negative rather than anything to do with the identity you've given to the tulpa. If your tulpa is inexplicably behaving like an ass without a good reason that's a sign that you're attaching your brain's negative thoughts to them and you should be disbelieving those thoughts entirely.

 

Beyond that I think negativity can arise chiefly through bad beliefs. Before tulpas were a thing occultists did most of these same practices we do in religious contexts, but they had beliefs about them being external and possibly hostile: Demons. Possession; presumed malice; all of that can definitely arise just from you thinking a tulpa is something evil and "other".

 

In the context of this tradition though you should be recognizing that your tulpa is a fundamentally human identity generated by your brain: It has absolutely no reason to behave maliciously off the bat (and will actively be harming itself if it ever does because again, it experiences your emotions), and in fact like a child it will initially behave entirely under what is essentially your hypnotic suggestion of how it should act.

 

On 5/13/2021 at 7:38 PM, Think1112 said:

8. I learned about people who accidentally created more Tulpas, probably by making some mistakes during the creation process of an original Tulpa, could you tell me how that can happen and how to avoid that?

 

I personally think this concept is ludicrous because tulpas are no different to any other empathetic thoughtform. So creating one is as simple as thinking of someone else's identity and then loosening the reigns and giving them self-awareness of where they are.

 

People who "accidentally create more tulpas" are simply not exerting the will over their own mind that they should be. As I mentioned, you reach a point where you can start to easily and rapidly generate thoughtforms after the first one - that doesn't mean you have to accept every identity your brain cooks up as a headmate. If you don't want another headmate, you just need to not interact with the thoughtform as if they are one. That's all.

[fennecfoxx]

On 5/13/2021 at 8:38 PM, Think1112 said:

That is interesting what you have said and very important for me to understand. You mentioned that the Tulpas cannot take over by force, but this statement stands in opposition to what Absideon has said in this thread (quote below). Me, as a beginner, who should I believe at this point?

 

I don't think my answer conflicts with Absideon's. A tulpa can, in a sense, take over when they want once swapping control becomes second nature—but the host still has to consent. It's more that the tulpa can request control nonverbally (or simply declare themself in charge), and the host can choose to give up control or refuse. With enough experience, it's pretty much instantaneous (which I think is what Absideon was getting at), but it still requires consent. Worst-case scenario, your tulpa barges in anyway... and then complains because they can't actually do anything unless you let them.

 

On 5/13/2021 at 8:38 PM, Think1112 said:

Is what you are mentioning here referred to as "blending"? If no, how can "blending" be avoided?

 

Yeah. The sort of blending that results in identity confusion can only definitively be avoided by remaining the sole fronter. It should never happen outside the context of possession/switching.

 

There's a milder form of blending that just happens and is totally normal, where sometimes the distinction between your thoughts and your tulpa's can blur. Conversations with people in your head tend to be "messier" than with other people, or maybe more fluid is a better term. Sometimes things are just understood without being put into words, and sometimes words are said but no one knows (or cares) who said them. There's no blending of identity/personality here, though. If you're discussing something one or both (or all) of you have strong, differing feelings about, it's going to be pretty clear who's saying what. On the other hand, say you're doing puzzles together, or even discussing something you share the same views on, you may find yourself "co-thinking", since you're on the same wavelength and individual perspectives (and thus being clear who's speaking) are basically irrelevant.

 

I hope that makes sense.

 

On 5/13/2021 at 8:38 PM, Think1112 said:

The wording there was not perfect by me, since I have no clear idea of what Tulpa really is. I base my perception only on what I have read from others about it. What I should have asked is, does maintaining that illusion require the brain to work harder, thus it requires more calories, energy? Does having a Tulpa can decrease one's ability to focus on something? For example, while trying to comprehend something complex, trying to analyze data, can it also decrease the ability of pattern recognition? If yes, can a host somehow "dismiss" a Tulpa for some time to being able to focus on something completely?

 

Any "answer" you get regarding the physiological effects of tulpamancy on the brain is going to be pure conjecture, since it hasn't been studied.

 

But yes, actively paying attention to your tulpa does increase cognitive load. That isn't something particular to tulpamancy; focusing your thoughts on anything but the task at hand hurts your ability to perform said task. Though having your tulpa around when you're working on something isn't necessarily a detriment, since they can help (whether by suggesting a new angle to approach something from, remembering things you've forgotten, serving as a metaphorical rubber duck...)

 

Your tulpa doesn't have to be present 24/7. In fact, it's really easy to forget they're even there when you're focused on something else.

 

On 5/13/2021 at 8:38 PM, Think1112 said:

7. I have read stories of people on other forums who created Tulpas that brought only negative effects in their life. Those Tulpas were of very hostile nature trying to cause as much havoc as possible in the lives of their hosts, sometimes even for years. I think that it is possible to happen, but how can one avoid that? Is it a common occurrence? Is such situation a result of making mistakes in a process of creation of Tulpa? If yes, mistakes such as?

 

I'm very skeptical of any such stories. The only way I could see that happening is if the host very strongly believes that 1) evil tulpas are possible, 2) their tulpa is evil, and 3) an evil tulpa cannot be ignored. Severe, pre-existing mental illness could possibly cause that as well (OCD certainly screwed with mine, though none of them intentionally made my life hell).

 

It definitely isn't a common occurrence, and the only prevention needed is realizing the idea of "evil tulpas" is basically an urban legend. Also, despite what many claim, tulpamancy isn't a "once you're in, you're in for life" deal. If things do go wrong, you can always just stop (and boy do I wish I'd known that earlier).

 

On 5/13/2021 at 8:38 PM, Think1112 said:

8. I learned about people who accidentally created more Tulpas, probably by making some mistakes during the creation process of an original Tulpa, could you tell me how that can happen and how to avoid that?

 

Accidental tulpas come about in many ways, but they all share something in common: a host who believes tulpas can be created accidentally. Many will tell you sentience is what determines whether something is a tulpa or not. But how do you determine sentience? It can't be proven, and as far as I'm concerned, tulpas are an illusion anyway. It isn't sentience that sets them apart, but rather whether the host chooses to consider them sentient. (That only applies, of course, to those who consider tulpas to be sentient. For those who don't consider tulpas sentient, it's pretty obviously the host's decision whether they want to call any intrusive thoughtform a tulpa.)

 

My point is, it's entirely up to you what you choose to accept as a tulpa. Found yourself with a "walk-in" you don't want? Ignore it. It's not a tulpa unless you decide it is.