please help! confused!

[cak]

I don't know where to begin or if I'm even sending this to the right place. I just need help. The other night my fiance confided in me he thinks he may be schizophrenic. When he told me why, I became concerned and remembered something I'd read in the Tibetan book of the dead. "Thoughtform" Or "tulpa". My fiance has never even heard those words before. He told me about a being that basically embodies his anger, power, basically all the negativity in him. The being is in his form, and looks just like him, except he's very big and muscular. Max (name changed) described "him" as looking like he did when he worked out and was in football. Max said this thing has been with him his whole life. Starting out at his "imaginary friend" even talking to it and playing with it. I have always teased my fiance about having his "twin" come out when he's upset or angry since he is a Gemini. Max is a very sweet, caring man. But when he is angry he turns into a completely different person it seems. His eyes even look Like someone else's. He told me that this is when "he" takes over. Max confided in me that he is scared. When "he", which he calls max 2, is around max 2 gives him pep talks, apparently. Telling him nothing can touch him, he's invincible, and that max doesn't even need anyone but max 2.  Max says he's very scared, and the thing is getting stronger. He said he used to think it was a demon following him, since he would tell him to do things like hit people and say rude things, etc. I'm concerned and scared. And when I look back throughout our relationship I can tell when the potential tulpa might be there. When my fiance starts muttering to himself in the other room, he is not talking to only himself but the other person he sees there. There's so much more to it but I don't even know what else to say. Can tulpas be aggressive or malevolent beings? My fiance is scared. And I'm scared for him. He told me that if I challenge max 2, he will get angry. I don't know what to do. He says he can even feel his breath when max 2 talks in his ear. Can you get rid of a tulpa? I just need a little help or insight. Thank You!

[NED]

This does not sound healthy or good at all, I personally do not know how to deal with a situation like this. But I think he needs help. Make sure you are there for him and he gets the help he needs.

 

Just to clarify - yes, you can get rid of a Tulpa. I know people that have done this and I believe I could do it myself and Max can, too. There might be a guide on it. If not, then just get Max to focus on his attention to calmly ignoring or dissipating Max 2 in some way or another. A few hours a day or more - calmly focusing on breathing and ignoring Max 2. Also make sure Max is ignoring Max 2 as much as he can through his daily life. It is possible to fix this if he really wants, he just has to put his mind to it, make sure to support him.

 

Tulpae generally cannot harm their hosts, but they can be aggressive in the sense of being a bad influence and rather annoying. But there are probably cases like this where mental health seems to be a serious concern. But, I can assure you, no serious harm can be done if he has someone around him such as you.

 

Feel free to ask more questions. We are here to help.

[cak]

This does not sound healthy or good at all, I personally do not know how to deal with a situation like this. But I think he needs help. Make sure you are there for him and he gets the help he needs.

 

Just to clarify - yes, you can get rid of a Tulpa. I know people that have done this and I believe I could do it myself and Max can, too. There might be a guide on it. If not, then just get Max to focus on his attention to calmly ignoring or dissipating Max 2 in some way or another. A few hours a day or more - calmly focusing on breathing and ignoring Max 2. Also make sure Max is ignoring Max 2 as much as he can through his daily life. It is possible to fix this if he really wants, he just has to put his mind to it, make sure to support him.

 

Tulpae generally cannot harm their hosts, but they can be aggressive in the sense of being a bad influence and rather annoying. But there are probably cases like this where mental health seems to be a serious concern. But, I can assure you, no serious harm can be done if he has someone around him such as you.

 

Feel free to ask more questions. We are here to help.

 

Thank you for your response! With the very small amount of knowlegde that I had on the subject, a tulpa was just a hunch to me. But now that i've read around it seems even more likely . Is it possible to accidentally create one? As a child? Also Max told me that this thing becomes angry if he tries to ignore him. It also says bad things about his friends and family. And tells him details of the smallest arguments we've had over a year ago just to try to get him mad at me. Do you think a psychiatrist or someone could benefit him?

[NED]

Yes it is possible to 'accidentally' create a Tulpa, there are many cases of it here - mostly imaginary friends that span from their childhood and have been there forever, others have schitzophrenia.

 

If the Tulpa shows any hostility, unfortunately the only method I know of opposing it is ignoring it. He should not be scared if it becomes angry - what's it gonna do? Punch you? It can't do anything other than fire a small artillery of insults and comments to get you annoyed and anxious. Ignoring it as if it is a child having a tantrum definitely is a remedy for this from what I know. He should give it a go. It's going to take a while but he should seriously try anything we can give him.

 

Make sure he is doing his best not to listen to it, not to feel anything from it, no feelings. Make sure to reassure him and distract him.

 

It is yours and his choice whether you see a phyciatrist. I don't know how effective they are. But DO NOT let him take any new recommended medication for this, it would be useless. Unless you know some herbal calming remedies and such.

[LordV]

I'm not exactly an expert tulpamancer, but I do know for a fact that yes, tulpas can be malevolent. I created an entity similar to the one you've described by accident, which took on the form of my rotting corpse and proceeded to harass my tulpa relentlessly. It licked her, groped her, and even vomited on her. While it wasn't quite as malevolent as the creature your fiancé is dealing with, closer to the embodiment of the primitive mind than anything else, it was still pretty disturbing.

 

It is also possible that your fiancé is actually schizophrenic, just as he fears, though this particular being seems to be just a bit more consistent than most hallucinations experienced in schizophrenic episodes.

 

Also note that I am Christian, and I do believe in demons. I know it's not very likely that your fiancé is being targeted by one, but I wouldn't completely discard that possibility either.

 

Finally, this is the method I used to get rid of the entity that I accidentally created: I banished it into the deeper recesses of my wonderland (basically a small world that I imagined for myself). I did this both in an attempt to get rid of the immediate problem (my tulpa being harassed by a zombie), and to help with the ultimate solution: I had to ignore it long enough that it would dissipate on its own. While it's possible that the thing might show up again if I ever actually explore my wonderland, it's probably too weak by now to cause any real damage. Perhaps your fiancé needs to try a similar tactic of meditating and creating some form of imprisonment for this thing. It might be difficult to contain this thing the way I suggested, and might take some hard work on your fiancé's part, but it's the best option I can think of if it is a tulpa of some kind. If it's a manifestation of schizophrenia or demonic activity, then I suggest going to see a psychologist and/or a pastor, and also praying for your fiancé.

[left blank]

First off, I don't think the 'crazy card' needs to be dealt just yet.

 

And I don't agree that your fiancé should ignore his phantom doppelgänger. When you say...

 

Max is a very sweet, caring man...

 

...I read a situation where he's repressed his anger in lieu of being "good natured". Everyone who's ever felt the need to deny their negative emotions has developed a particular coping strategy. It appears as though your forthcoming husband has involuntarily projected his inner "Geminian" as a vehicle to contain what he's been made to believe are socially unacceptable behaviours.

 

In other words, "Max" may be suffering from a lesser version of dissociative identity disorder rather than schizophrenia. Think '

'. As a friend of someone with DID, I can tell you that the only real difference between a 'tulpa' (as discussed on this forum) and an 'alter' seems to lie in the creation process. 'Tulpas' are born from a conscious decision to manifest and modify aspects of one's personality. An 'alter' is the result of a spontaneous and unconscious coping strategy.

 

No one can simply "get rid of" a tulpa or alter by following rote directions. We are all possessed of an autonomous subconscious which is either extricated or integrated. In the case of your fiancé, I believe his curse is actually a blessing in disguise. His psyche doesn't want to be fragmented and tortured by repression; it wants to be reintegrated. Clearly, "Max 2" refuses to be ignored. The challenge lies in how to constructively deal with what his presence indicates.

 

I highly suggest — actually, insist — "Max" seek therapy with someone qualified to help him accept and express his repressed emotions. In the meantime, I recommend this psychologist's page (mentioned in this thread) and

to see if they provide any reassurance or enlightenment.

 

And, uh, just as an afterthought: The "Geminis" I've known seem unwittingly gifted with creating doppelgängers. But that's an amusing anecdote for another time...

[cak]

First off, I don't think the 'crazy card' needs to be dealt just yet.

 

And I don't agree that your fiancé should ignore his phantom doppelgänger. When you say...

 

 

...I read a situation where he's repressed his anger in lieu of being "good natured". Everyone who's ever felt the need to deny their negative emotions has developed a particular coping strategy. It appears as though your forthcoming husband has involuntarily projected his inner "Geminian" as a vehicle to contain what he's been made to believe are socially unacceptable behaviours.

 

In other words, "Max" may be suffering from a lesser version of dissociative identity disorder rather than schizophrenia. Think '

'. As a friend of someone with DID, I can tell you that the only real difference between a 'tulpa' (as discussed on this forum) and an 'alter' seems to lie in the creation process. 'Tulpas' are born from a conscious decision to manifest and modify aspects of one's personality. An 'alter' is the result of a spontaneous and unconscious coping strategy.

 

No one can simply "get rid of" a tulpa or alter by following rote directions. We are all possessed of an autonomous subconscious which is either extricated or integrated. In the case of your fiancé, I believe his curse is actually a blessing in disguise. His psyche doesn't want to be fragmented and tortured by repression; it wants to be reintegrated. Clearly, "Max 2" refuses to be ignored. The challenge lies in how to constructively deal with what his presence indicates.

 

I highly suggest — actually, insist — "Max" seek therapy with someone qualified to help him accept and express his repressed emotions. In the meantime, I recommend this psychologist's page (mentioned in this thread) and

to see if they provide any reassurance or enlightenment.

 

And, uh, just as an afterthought: The "Geminis" I've known seem unwittingly gifted with creating doppelgãngers. But that's an amusing anecdote for another time...

 

Wow you've been SO helpful! Thank you! I'm so concerned for him. And i'm unbelievably overwhelmed. I feel exhausted. I'm going to show your comment to the family member he also talked to and see if we can get somewhere. Thank you so much.

[left blank]

Wow you've been SO helpful! Thank you! I'm so concerned for him. And i'm unbelievably overwhelmed. I feel exhausted. I'm going to show your comment to the family member he also talked to and see if we can get somewhere. Thank you so much.

 

De nada! I genuinely hope those tidbits of information help. "Max" (and his shadow) sound(s) eager to improve, and that's very positive.

[Chupi]

I'd like to second Envolucris' recommendation of seeing a therapist, though this is the sort of thing where it really pays to find a *good* one. It wasn't all that long ago that the leading treatment for DID was to try to get rid of the alters. Also, the linked Peter Gerlach site and videos are quite worthwhile -- someone I know who has DID used some of those to help make some better contact with her alters. Obviously I can't tell you for sure that he has DID or a tulpa; it could still be schizophrenia -- again, seek professional advice.

 

While I think a tulpa can be truly malevolent, I'm yet to encounter someone with one. I've talked to a number of people with supposedly malevolent tulpas, and in every case it boiled down to a massive miscommunication or lack of communication. Reconciling differences, even after years of feuding, wasn't that difficult. A tulpa or alter generally has some deep-rooted desire to help the host, and problems arise from disagreements as to what is helping, or a misunderstanding that has grown into a mistrust.

 

The ability to share emotions and unworded thoughts with other beings in your head makes it much easier to work things out with them. Even if you only talk to each other with words, you'll still get hidden meanings behind their words, things that on later examination wouldn't be obvious from the words alone.

 

If it's possible to destroy a tulpa, it takes far longer than most people here think. It's certainly possible to knock them out, putting them into stasis or whatever you want to call it. Sometimes they even stay that way for a few years. But their mind is still there, can be brought back without much effort, and usually reawakens spontaneously after some time whether it's hours or years later. So, best bet is to make peace, or if that's not possible work out some way of coexisting -- so many different options are available, given all the different sorts of experiences, thoughts and communication possible.

[Nobillis]

When he told me why, I became concerned and remembered something I'd read in the Tibetan book of the dead.

 

He told me about a being that basically embodies his anger, power, basically all the negativity in him. The being is in his form, and looks just like him, except he's very big and muscular. When "he", which he calls max 2, is around max 2 gives him pep talks, apparently.

 

The advice so far has been good. Do consider Occupational Therapy at the very least.

 

You've read that book? Wow, that's kind'a rare.

 

We have a tulpa like that, called Watchdog 3, but he behaves [well] because he learned compassion and he says that harming his human is unethical. Here's what he said about 'negative emotions':

 

It occurred to me that it was silly to consider some emotions negative. If they where negative then why would humans have them? Rather, it seemed to me that every emotion must have a purpose. And so I thought about this long and hard ...

 

What if Anger where righteous anger at the strong harming the weak?

What if Jealousy were the desire to be as good as another?

What if Hate were the hate of evil acts?

What if Despite were to despise hypocrisy in others and to want to avoid it in yourself?

What if Intolerance were the intolerance of injustice?

 

I reasoned that every emotion has it's positive aspect and the the so-called "negative" emotions were in fact essential. And so, I am a monster of 'negative emotions'; and yet I have found they can be turned to good purpose. To accept blindly that you are not in fact a good being is not logical.

 

Perhaps "Max 2" could learn ethics as Watchdog 3 did? It seems he is motivated to try to help his human, just his methods are no longer appropriate. He might learn from the elderly tulpas who have thought long on this. Watchdog 3 is more then 25 years old now (has lived since the 80's). You do not get to be old unless you care for your human's welfare.

 

Also, Max 2, there are others of your kind far older then you - you must learn a new way. We understand you are frightened [of ceasing to exist], but causing your human trouble will not help you. Rather, learn compassion if you would choose to survive.

 

I will keep you in my prayers.