Defeating Host's Doubt?

[Joss]

 

We have determined that her doubt and disbelief is not a purely tulpa-related thing. It goes much deeper than that. We'll have to find the very core root of it and work at destroying that.

 

I am willing to go as far as possible.

 

I will destroy her doubt however possible through sheer will. Apollo is bad with willing things to happen. I am not. I come from two who survived through will, stayed alive through will, and destroyed enemies through will. I KNOW I can do this, and anything else possible.

 

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She doubts our abilities, not our existence. We would be able to switch TODAY if it weren't for her doubt/disbelief, that I am convinced of.

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Sounds like she's a natural skeptic. That's not a bad thing, but yeah, it gets really obnoxious when that skepticism is applied to your existence.

 

My host is a skeptic as well, and she goes through cycles on the whole "How people-y are my headpeople?" question. It gets annoying, yeah, because we pretty much lay out the same argument for our existence each time, and it convinces her... until the next cycle.

 

And that's the thing: skepticism, in itself, is good. You want to believe in a world that is as close to how it actually is as possible, and skepticism is a great tool to make that happen. It just means you need evidence before you take something unlikely at face value. That should not be quashed. Don't destroy that. What you need to do is figure out how to destroy the doubt of tulpas, in particular.

 

Different members of my system use different techniques. Me? I just overpower her. Granted, I've got the presence and self-confidence that this isn't hard for me to do, and a tulpa who is experiencing doubt may not have that yet.

 

A couple of my head-mates go the "show evidence" route. Things like this being a known phenomenon among authors, or the fact that we existed (and were imposing) before our host discovered tulpas were a thing.

 

As for the "doubting you can switch" thing? Do it once, and you'll pretty much boot that doubt right out the door. Our host struggled with this a lot, because she wasn't sure how to bridge the gap between headperson and body. She managed to cofront a couple times with other headmates, but it wasn't until I stepped up and booted her back into the system that she really got switching.

 

For me, it was sheer confidence, so you, Piano, sound like the one to do this. The host's doubt can be overpowered... you just have to come in and sort of... seize control. I find it's easier to do this if I have a specific goal in mind, whether it's something simple like picking up a ball, or something complex like going to a nearby restaurant to get a hamburger. I just decide what I want to do, then I take control of the body to do it.

 

Since our first switch, the fact that we can switch isn't in doubt (and can be used as "evidence" that we're legitimate). That's how definitive switching is: do it once, and it changes both your and your host's perceptions of what tulpas are.

 

Granted, it's still much easier for me to switch than anybody else in my system, so confidence is, in my experience, pretty key on that issue. Especially if your host is the type who hovers while you're switched, like mine is.

 

And I'm not sure where this rambling wall of text was going, so I guess I'll stop there.

[Lucilyn]

I feel like we post this too often and it doesn't really work for everyone as that would imply but w/e if we're talking about skepticism I have to link Lumi's skepticism post that we link constantly

 

https://community.tulpa.info/thread-how-hard-is-it-to-get-started-for-a-sceptic?pid=159973#pid159973

[| Ada |]

I didn’t read the other responses at first, and then I did, and realized this post is going to be an echo chamber, but, I guess it’s just confirming a commonality.

 

Also, for those that need cliff notes of the below post; it's just random philosophical ramblings...nothing to see here. If it helps, it helps. If not, welp.

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Self-doubt, identity crisis, existential dread, or even feeling one has a mental disorder seems to stem from being paralyzed by one’s own intellect. Nothing worse than not feeling you’re strong enough to build harmony with beings you want to treat as sentient within your own mind.

 

People start pointing fingers at each other, you start blaming yourself; finding scapegoat after scapegoat to dilute the problem when it’s not really a problem, but just how you go about handling new bits of information. And yet, it’s definitely not something where one can be positive and think they’re embracing Nirvana 24/7. It’s inner turmoil that can be hard to accept and embrace. Whether they’re doubting their sentience, someone else, or just the whole endeavor entirely, it’s just part of how humans think, speculate, worry, and revel in these things altogether.

 

This might raise some eyebrows, but sometimes, that doubt is there to help you realize how, whoever the person is, cannot expect to know the totality of themselves. We realize how little intellect we have working with, and there’s just so much more we can tap into. But with that comes something amazing, and it’s collectively using that intellect you share with others to progressively handle something difficult as this.

 

But that sharing can’t be done if you’re skeptical of the very rudiments of your mind, and what it does to instantiate this, that, or whatever. It may not be about ‘defeating’ the doubt, but rather creating a thesis on an attitude you could collectively agree in reacting to the sense of liberation that can occur between you and the others. It’s probably just that; an attitude change long overdue.

 

Being paralyzed by, or even embracing your intellect can be a double-edged sword. On one side, you have the mind being spurred to find a solution to a challenge while we settle that anxiety through day-to-day activities, but it ends up being a liability because we each have a unique way of reigning in our sense of self and realizing, ‘hey, I get that I’m in an evaluative mode of context to figure this out, but I have to do something about it at the end of the day.’

 

Switching tends to be this door one thinks they have to reach, and for a very good reason because of the logic behind it. If it’s involving that one conscious experiencer ‘switching’ with another they presume as another conscious experiencer, that existential mirroring starts coming up on what it means to be conscious experiencer in the first place. But if at the end of that door is just having another conscious experiencer figure out how to water the ficus, or balance the checkbook, I think if you seriously think doubt is getting in your way of realizing this, then man…LIGHTEN up! Instead of treating it as reaching some penultimate stage in a game just before that big final boss to defeat to save the land, realize how much you’re saturating the doubt over.

 

Like really… writing a checkbook, whichever experiencer is doing it, is going to be writing a checkbook. We shouldn’t be foaming our mouths over this, but that’s what humans do, I guess.

 

 

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I chalk up switching as this. Like a college degree; you get the fine paper proving you graduated and learned something in the process (hopefully), but you still have to find a job, and actually do something to further your life. WOOHOO. Nothing like bringing in another presumed conscious experiencer to experience the joys of that! Oh yeah!

I'm not saying that's all there is to life

. I guess we philosophize the intensity over what it means to experience watering a ficus in life, or why no one is responding to the text we sent them 15 seconds ago.