wonderlands as real places...

[solarchariot]

Speaking of synchronicity, in my continued pondering of this subject, I have discovered a new book I feel compelled to read, "Passport to the Cosmos," by John E Mack, which may add fuel to my smoldering fire of wanting to know more about this thing we visit daily...

[Guest]

We expect a full report on your findings.

[Zia]

Zia (host) here.

 

Vādin's wonderland is a place he "created" himself because I can't visualize very well. To help him we agreed on a few pictures of Thailand's rainforest and a thai wooden house.( I like Thailand but know very few about that country, I've never been to Thailand either.)

[align=justify]

Then he wished the place into existence, and Testimonia (as he calls her) was there.[/align]

 

As I can't really go there, I ask Vādin questions about his life in his wonderland, and, strangely enough, Testimonia seems somewhat connected to actual Thailand. I checked about random stuff he had told me that I found surprising, and they happened to be real facts :

 

- there is a rain season there that matches the rain season in actual Thailand. (the word rainforest should have made me suspect it, but I really thought it would be sunny all the time there)

 

- even in summer, night falls at the same hour all year long (18 h). I didn't know about that at all, it did surprise me. Sun rises at about the same hour as well (6h30 - 7h).  (N.B. : Testimonia time is not Thailand time, but is aligned with host's country : when it's 18 PM irl in my country, it's sunset in V's home)

 

- V told me about gibbons, apes dwelling in the forest he lives in. As I had already seen gibbons in captivity when I was younger, I was very surprised to hear that, according to Vādin, they never go on the firm ground unless they're dead! The gibbons I used to see in captivity were often sitting or walking on the ground, even drinking in the small artificial stream that has been built there, so I was skeptical. It proves to be correct : free gibbons never quit the canopy, they drink water left on tree leaves by rain or mist.

 

- random small facts (the few I can remember) : he told me about a bunch of green butterflies that gathered on the wet ground, and they're common in Thailand (yes, they're green, and they actually feed on minerals when they do that) ; recently he has noticed a lot more orchids in the forest, and some he hasn't seen in other periods of the year - well, bingo, the flowering period for orchids in Thailand has its peak in december ; he had a strange encounter in the forest with a tiger that transformed into an old fierce man, and this matches really well the description of the  mythical tiger-head hermit "Ruesi SerMingPraï", well known and praised in Thailand, etc...

 

Of course Testimonia is not Thailand, there are also differences, but the similarities have surprised me enough to share them here. There seem to be more in that place than just random dreamlike fantasy.

 

I find this great, it invites me to stay humble and keep my mind open. Plus I learn a lot on actual Thailand.

[solarchariot]

That is very interesting, Zia. I spent quite a bit of time in Thailand. My son's mother was born there and her family is still there. I am familiar with the tiger monk. :)

[solarchariot]

I found this and it fits here in this thread and I don't want to forget it... 'Imaginal Realms' have been around for a moment, and I wonder if there is a correlation with wonderlands. This is the same thing that Jung came up against which caused him to speculate on the collective unconscious...

 

"While some aspects of the imagination are clearly contrived, these texts suggested that there is also a place in our imaginations where things are "real," in the sense that they are not being "imagined" by someone but are images that have some kind of integrity or existence on their own. Thus, the imagination appears to have two aspects: one is intentionally fabricated; the other presents itself to us intact. Corbin used the term mundus imaginalis (imaginary realm) to differentiate between the "imaginary"(i.e., something equated with the unreal or with fantasy) and the "imaginal" (i.e., a world that is ontologically as real as the things we see or touch or know intellectually). Something imaginary is "made up" and comes from us, whereas the imaginal comes to us from another realm. It's the difference, for example, between conjuring an image of a man with a blue nose and green hair (imaginary) and having a dream image of a man with a blue nose and green hair (from the imaginal realm)."

[YukariTelepath]

I've been reading about out-of-body experiences/astral projection, and one thing William Buhlman says, is that some areas of the non-physical universe are highly thought responsive, that is, you can create whatever you want just by thinking about it. If such a thing were true, you could create your wonderland while out of body, or perhaps for some (all?) people the wonderlands they create exist in a non-physical dimension. I'm reserving judgement on those claims, but it would be very cool if your wonderland is actually real somewhere. I'm at least convinced it can be experienced as if it were real by going through out-of-body techniques.

 

Actually, without getting meta*, you can say wonderlands exist in a non-physical dimension, since they are made of thoughts. Where do your thoughts exist? What are they made of? What is your "real" field of vision made of? We live with the illusion that we're looking at the real world, but it's just an immersive non-physical image (not even 3 dimensional) created by the brain.

 

*edit: When we talk about meta, I assume we don't count thoughts, perception, imagination, as meta. Even though those things are not physical.

[solarchariot]

William Buhlman is one the authors on our shelves. We've read many of his works, watched his youtube videos. He worked with Bob Monroe, and it's interesting seeing comparisons of their work... and the work of others who have been through the Monroe Institute. I am less partial to Thomas Campbell's stuff, "My Big Toe." (Just the title irritates me for some reason, though I know it means my theory of everything, which we all have... maybe I don't like toes in general. Or, more specifically my big toe, though it's done nothing particular to offend me. I have stubbed it...)

 

I am being called back to task... Loxy and I love your Avatar.

 

Back to Bulhman, Monroe... I took a local Monroe course, and was introduced to the 'levels' What is interesting is when guided to these different 'levels' of focus is that people reports consistent artifacts... Consistent enough that they have a consensus of artifacts that seem to be there, where ever there is. Bulhman's reports on islands on 'consensus realities' mirror Monroe's... Which I either agree with because I have read so much of work from Monroe institute that I am bias, and my wonderland experiences reflect that, or there is something here... I would like to think we can discuss this whether it evolves into meta or a continuum of less meta to not meta... because there is a level of consistency that seems to be greater than chance... (I suspect that, but have not did a statistical measure.)

 

Whether it's Fred Alan Wold writing about it in 'Matter Into Feeling: A New Alchemy of Science and Spirit' or Carl Jung, who is a credible scientist, even though his work is denigrated by the term 'soft science' we all seem to be engaging in something.

 

Your edit reminded me of something my Anatomy and physiology professor said. "All cells do one of two things, they secrete something, or they move something. That's it." To which I responded, "So, does that make thoughts brain secretions?" I bet we're more than that. :)

[YukariTelepath]

"My Big TOE" annoys me to, ha ha. It took me too long to figure out TOE meant Theory of Everything. I'm always fascinated by the experiences and theories people have about metaphyscial things like astral projection. I read/watched a lot about it, and in the past got quite swept up in believing stuff because it made sense and made the pattern detecting part of my brain go crazy fitting difference claims and theories together. But I realized there wasn't much good accepted evidence, so I learned to take a big step back. If I succeed in 'astral projecting' maybe I can figure a thing or two out myself, though of course even my own experiences need to be taken with a big grain of salt. At least then I could determine for myself whether claims about astral projection are accurate on an experiential level. And I'll get to visit my wonderland like it's real. And "like it's real" is way more than I expected from wonderland when I started tulpamancy.

 

I believe something can be real even if there is no scientific explanation for it. The Earth revolved around the sun before humans figured it out. Bacteria caused illnesses before humans discovered cell biology. People can come up with all sorts of theories for how thought/consciousness works in humans, but even the best sounding theories can be wrong, because we're just human. Right now science takes a very reductionist approach to consciousness... yet there's clearly something beyond neurons firing. We just don't actually know what it is. 

 

And thanks! My avatar picture is by Ilya Kuvshinov https://www.deviantart.com/kuvshinov-ilya

[solarchariot]

 

And thanks! My avatar picture is by Ilya Kuvshinov https://www.deviantart.com/kuvshinov-ilya

 

I love it! I see Loxy in that everywhere... Ahh, to create art so well...