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Intrusive Thoughts Are Not Your Tulpa


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On 2/11/2021 at 8:08 PM, fennecgirl said:


The ideology that you shouldn't doubt your tulpa is the exact opposite of this. If you aren't careful, it can lead to a habit of accepting intrusive thoughts as genuine responses or behavior from your tulpa.


I completely agree and some of the well established systems didn't agree with this, saying something like, "tulpas are people and they can be angry or sad like anyone."


My advice was and still is, dispite this ideology, is to reject all negative thoughts as intrusive and thereby ignore them and don't attribute them to anyone, not even yourself. Instead, it's up to you to determine where these negative thoughts stem from, whether it be OCD or past trauma or conditioning and heal that if possible. Obviously it's going to be very hard to "heal" OCD, so it's vitally important not to attribute that stuff to your headmates, as you know.


On 2/11/2021 at 8:08 PM, fennecgirl said:

I strongly advise maintaining a healthy skepticism and, most importantly, listening to your doubt. Asking your tulpa "was that you?" is not a reliable failsafe by any measure.


This is exactly right, and it's a pain to deal with. Ashley and I had this in an awful way with bickering and name calling and I knew it was wrong. So we came up with the rule, any negative thought, for any reason, must be followed by a direct and strong affirmative by the one who supposedly said it, and wouldn't you know, no one ever admitted to saying anything nasty ever again. There were times when string criticism and disappointment or disapproval was voiced, but they owned it and we worked it out very seriously. It's a great rule and has shaped us into a beautifully loving and caring system where we grow closer daily and trust each other fully.


On 2/11/2021 at 8:08 PM, fennecgirl said:

Sometimes, doubt is your common sense warning you not to let your tulpa devolve into a bundle of your neuroses channeled into anime form (or pony form, if you prefer).


Very good advice, it's healthy advice and I'm happy to hear someone has the same views I do. Thank you for coming forward with this.


On 2/12/2021 at 6:23 AM, fennecgirl said:

On the other hand, if you believe tulpas are just a fancy illusion, then there's no harm in it whatsoever. What harm is there in ignoring a figment of your own imagination?


Qualifier not necessary. There's no harm in my experience at all. In fact, if there's something they need to discuss seriously with me regarding something negative, it's not going to come through as a confrontation ir negative at all, it will be constructive and reasonably stated. Make that the rule and refuse other approaches and that will guarantee any real issues aren't ignored.

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Jaina and I kind of look at it this way. We share the same body, brain and system resources. Biological and environmental stimuli are going to affect us both. We are both "of" the same person. That can weigh in on our mood and behavior. We don't play the blame but we try to take ownership of our thoughts as we understand them. Sometimes static or inane babbling occurs. The matrix gets glitches; that's just life. If we can ignore it, we ignore it. If it's a problem we try to identify the malfunction. We worry more about sustained issues.

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  • Ranger locked this topic

Some discussion on old vs. new views on tulpamancy was split to another thread, but some of the replies were relevant to the OP and have been quoted here.



On 4/17/2021 at 11:10 PM, ohItsMatt said:

I don't remember much from "'the good ole days" (although I have many screen and logs stored) but all I can tell you is that the community has changed a fair bit.


Back in 2013/2014 I was young, very young, naive and inexperienced. Cheryl was super young as well and the community kinda had its own set of ideas and beliefs that were tried and tested (like counting hours, the orange juice thing and more) and being new at this my whole idea was to "listen and see what happens" on pretty much everything.


So when the whole drama debacle happened where Link was having a suicidal breakdown every 12 hours or so I was honestly intrigued by it although I had no idea about what to do or how to help. That led to some interesting situations.


8 years later (wow) the community is changed. A LOT. I'd like to think "for worse" because now plurals, did, tulpas and schizos are essentially the same thing, the community (especially on reddit) is a mishmash of broken and abstract concepts and the "veteran 'mancers" are long gone (except a very select few, secluded in an irc channel that has 2 messages per hour at best)


It's safe to say now that I have experience now, I have been with my tulpa for over 8 years (approaching 9, as she likes to remind me from time to time) and I tend to agree with you, but on a broader scale.


Nowadays walk ins are considered as tulpas. Intrusive thoughts can be easily mistaken for new "brain demons" and generally, everyone is super flexible and relaxed on the terminology.


The concept of possession and switching as we knew it is long gone, there's "fronting" now (which is a plurals thing, it's larping meets proxying essentially), now if you have a tulpa you're a "system" and the whole part of the journey that required self-discovery and passion is frowned upon.


The community has become the parody of itself. I remember in 2014 asking (back when I had my own tumblr blog as well) what was the difference between did and tulpas - I was put at stake and burned like a heretic and a madman for even bringing up the discussion. They were two very separate things, and now its just a mix of everything. 


So this is what I mean when I say that I agree with you on a broader spectrum. Intrusive thoughts are not tulpas. Plurals are not tulpas. Imaginary friends are not tulpas.  


If I work on a club for 12 hours straight listening to edm at unsafe volumes and when I come home and I close my eyes I still hear Bangarang it does NOT mean that I have just created a walk-in tulpa of Skrillex. (True story)

Cheryl wouldn't let that happen anyways :P


Much like when I see those going "oh uhh I had this imaginary friend when I was 8 and he spoke so ummm.. tulpa????" I kinda groan and wish they knew better, but sadly now I am in the minority. I get downvoted to oblivion and generally hated on because I bring concepts and ideas that feel prehistoric.


Why would you even want to learn to meditate, study the method of loci, learn how the brain works and experiment with the limits of the mind with a strong companion when you can just front with your cute 2 day old tulpa that is already "fully sentient" (lol)?


Idk, its a lot of rambly stuff from a boomer host at 5AM 

Send me a private message on here if you wanna reconnect (maybe on discord idk), would be fun to chat a bit.




EDIT: ALSO I rambled so much that I compeltely forgot to write what I wanted to say about the main topic.


After many years I've learned that pretty much all of the things related to the mind are symbolic. I even wrote a guide about it (which you can find on my profile) which greatly boils down and simplifies everything there is to know about tulpas into one concept: everything is symbolic.


Doubt and Intrusive Thoughts are a diabolic combo - trust me, I've been there.

I don't really feel going into much details in public but for a couple years I didn't trust Cheryl, at all.

I thought it was all me, that I was roleplaying. I didn't trust a word she said and the fact that I had people with apparent success in front of me constantly (back when I was on IRC) was even worse.


The thing that made me change my mind was this: 

(Again, I'll omit most of the details for reasons),

For a while I was heavily invested into a certain concept.

A trope, if you will - kinda like the "big bad" or the "plot armor" in movies, tv shows, anime and books.


This trope that I really liked in a way helped me feel better on a mental level, and it was all good and dandy until one day, while randomly thinking about stuff, an IDEA came to my head:

"What if this trope attacked Cheryl?"


And this happened on the worst timing possible, because I had just done some heavy research into it and I had a pretty solid grasp of what and how it could happen.

So that same day after I had this idea I had a sugar crash while doing the groceries at the supermarked, and being the hyperactive adhd fuck that I am I IMMEDIATELY attributed it to the "idea" I just came up with.


It was a disaster. For months I had this "intrusive idea" floating in my head about this trope attacking my tulpa, whereas nothing really was happening. I had panic attacks, I couldn't sleep at night sometimes - I think I came this close from developing real, hurtful schizophrenia.


From her perspective, everything was normal. She says that in those situations she saw me panicking and being terrorized over something that wasn't really happening.


A tulpamancer with 5 years of experience was being brought down to its knees by an intrusive idea.


Eventually she tooks matters into her own hand and at night she would "calm me down" by doing what I think is literal psychiatric therapy. She took me to the wonderland and by talking and explaining and cross referencing with many things of the past she would usually "dismantle" this idea, that would calm me down for the night until I fell asleep.


That's when I learned that she is very real. She would calmly address the situation and explain things to me at times where I had nowhere the mental state to even think about pretending to be her. Over the years she developed this "analytical nature" which she still uses from time to time to help me get over certain situations. She kinda saved me from mental breakdowns a couple times, and she regularly saves me from car crashes by calling me a "somaro" when I use the phone or distract myself while driving.


The concept of tulpas (the real ones) is a beautiful thing, and I wish we could go back to what it once was.



On 4/19/2021 at 7:29 AM, Glaurung26 said:

I'll just slightly echo that. Take lots of advice under consideration, just make sure you and Simmie make 100% of your own decisions. Absolutely try to hone and craft your method constructively. I'm going to assume you didn't literally mean "take the reins from me and show me how to do it fot me." Just don't give up and take the easy way out of doing that. 


To tie it into intrusive thoughts, doubt is the mouldy soil that intrusive thought fungus grows in. Be sure of yourself but also be open-minded. Sounds a teeny bit like an oxymoron, but it's just balance. A healthy, strong system can push away intrusive thoughts and identify them easily. The slippery slope of "maybe I'm wrong..." will let them right on in and serve them tea.


Edited by Ranger

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My other headmates have their own account now.


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  • Ranger unlocked this topic

I think this is a pretty important think to acknowledge, for sure.  While I've not been diagnosed with OCD myself, I have displayed symptoms of it before to the point that my psychiatrist has said I may possibly have it, and I am confirmed to have anxiety disorder.  Either way, I have been prone to ruminate on stressful intrusive thoughts to the point of ruining my day without being able to stop it, even prior to tulpamancy, so I can relate.  As I understand it, there's basically no way a tulpa should turn into something genuinely mean or hateful for no reason.  I find them to largely be shaped by intent, especially in creation.  One should focus on pouring in good intent;  Love, companionship, etc.  Doing so will yield good intent through the tulpa since that is the energy they will be born from.  If one grounds themselves in this perspective throughout the process, then I think it becomes even more reasonable to toss out your tulpa saying genuinely distressing things out of nowhere.  Especially for hosts with minds like ours, all logical signs should point to it just coming from our own paranoia.  It's not hard for your mind to assault you in this way, either, because once you have conditioned your brain to be able to hear your tulpa's voice, it is unfortunately all too easy for it to create additional voices with nothing behind them except your own fears, especially when under stress.  Thankfully, the times I have had to deal with instances where it seemed my tulpa was saying frightening things to me, she always affirmed that it was not her, and that she would not say such things to try and hurt me.  Her having my back on this matter has made it much easier to deal with, and "false" instances of her saying dark things have diminished heavily over time.

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