I Just Don't Understand What Happened

[Saylin]

Hello. I'm quite new, as you can see, but I've been lurking for a while. I mainly came here because, what happened was.. odd and I'd like to understand what's happened.

 

I started creation of a Tulpa a week ago- I was making a female who I named "Amber," working on her through meditation. I had issues with her form, and felt that'd become more clear later on. Things were fine, and forcing was giving me head pressures and tingling, but it was overall fine, she was taking on a very bubbly personality.

 

However, while researching Tulpa more, I felt what I thought to be the beginnings of Sentience, from a Roleplay Character I'd had while reading something, as I'd heard him audibly respond to something that I had not intended him to, when he hasn't even been on my mind. Being the curious person I was, I decided to force with him as well. I felt a lot of emotions at that time, mainly pain coming from him, but I truly felt like I could feel him, as a person. So only a few days into working on Amber, I decided to work on this one as well, simultaneously. Things seemed alright...

 

However, just a day ago, while focusing on active forcing, something went wrong. I thought it to be intrusive thoughts, but Amber's face distorted, into something horrific that I couldn't stop. In my panic I started mind-screaming for the other, male Tulpa in progress. The image went away for a moment during the screaming.

 

After this, though, I kept picturing the male tulpa's face distorted as well, only in a less horrific way. This traumatized me enough to stop forcing for the night.

 

This morning, I decided to focus on Xenos (the male Tulpa) for starters, with some forcing. However, Xenos immediately took on an entirely new entity of sorts. I heard one word, "Claude." His appearance also completely changed, and today I've been forcing on him off and on.

 

What's confusing me is, I didn't feel Amber anymore, and while Forcing with Claude, I found he no longer liked Xenos' colors. He liked a mixture of Xenos' and Amber's colors, as Amber had liked Pink and Blue and Xenos had liked Purple and Black. I grew very curious, and asked Claude while in our wonderland, 'Did you and Amber fuse? Are you the two blended together?' And without puppeting, (at least, I believe this to be the case) he nodded.

 

This, combined with Claude being a gender neutral name, and Claude's personality seeming to be a mixture of the two makes me so very confused. Am I just looking too much into it, and forcing an idea on Claude that isn't true? Or did two developing Tulpae really fuse together to make one?

 

I really just want answers.

[Drakaina]

I don't think its unusual for a tulpa to give itself a "new" name and appearance different from the one you originally gave them.

I've never heard of what you described before but I can believe two tulpa being developed at the same time may "fuse" into one being.

 

I really can't say for sure why it would happen, but one hypothesis I have is maybe it's your mind's way of optimizing. Maybe it subconsciouslt streamlined your two developing tulpa into one. Or was having a hard time distinguishing while you weren't actively forcing, so in the down time in between sessions they melded together.

 

Like I said, I've not heard of what you described happening before, and have no experience with it personally, but I don't have a hard time believing it could happen.

 

I don't know if there's anything you can do about it, but more importantly if there's anything you should do about it. Ethics are tricky for me with developing thought forms. I bet one of the other members here would have more insight on it than I would.

[Saylin]

I don't think its unusual for a tulpa to give itself a "new" name and appearance different from the one you originally gave them.

I've never heard of what you described before but I can believe two tulpa being developed at the same time may "fuse" into one being.

 

I really can't say for sure why it would happen, but one hypothesis I have is maybe it's your mind's way of optimizing. Maybe it subconsciouslt streamlined your two developing tulpa into one. Or was having a hard time distinguishing while you weren't actively forcing, so in the down time in between sessions they melded together.

 

Like I said, I've not heard of what you described happening before, and have no experience with it personally, but I don't have a hard time believing it could happen.

 

I don't know if there's anything you can do about it, but more importantly if there's anything you should do about it. Ethics are tricky for me with developing thought forms. I bet one of the other members here would have more insight on it than I would.

 

Hm.. That does make sense. I doubt I'd try to do anything about it, I just.. if that did happen, I felt awful about it, since I don't know if they felt pain during it, and my objective for making a Tulpa, was not just to have a companion. I wanted to bring one into life, to let them enjoy life. To introduce them to happiness and wonderful experiences that IS life, and the fact that I could have gotten in the way of their happiness by melding them subconsciously is painful to think about. For now though, yes, I'll leave it be, and if it turns out they didn't and Amber pops up again, well.. time will tell.

[Drakaina]

 

Hm.. That does make sense. I doubt I'd try to do anything about it, I just.. if that did happen, I felt awful about it, since I don't know if they felt pain during it, and my objective for making a Tulpa, was not just to have a companion. I wanted to bring one into life, to let them enjoy life. To introduce them to happiness and wonderful experiences that IS life, and the fact that I could have gotten in the way of their happiness by melding them subconsciously is painful to think about. For now though, yes, I'll leave it be, and if it turns out they didn't and Amber pops up again, well.. time will tell.

 

That's an interesting though, I never had. I don't know if tulpa feel pain. I would think if its something they haven't experienced, and you haven't taught it to them they wouldn't feel it. Pain sensors are located in the body, it's a defense mechanism wa have to help keep us alive. The brain can't actually feel anything, its why brain surgery can be done while you're awake.

So I wouldn't worry that either of them felt pain. At the worst maybe it was a bit startling.

 

If/when Claude develops enough to get good at communicating with you, you can ask Him (her? It?). That would be an interesting conversation. :3

[Joss]

 

I don't know if tulpa feel pain. I would think if its something they haven't experienced, and you haven't taught it to them they wouldn't feel it. Pain sensors are located in the body, it's a defense mechanism wa have to help keep us alive.

 

For the record? Yes. We can.

 

Physically, we are capable of experiencing the body's physical pain by proxy, or directly if we're keyed into it.

 

But even if we couldn't, that's not the only kind of pain. Things like grief? Betrayal? A feeling of wrongness and discomfort when something that should be working correctly doesn't? Those are kinds of pain that have nothing to do with physical senses.

 

I'm not commenting on anything to do with the OP, but seriously? Think before you type. That right there is downright depersonalizing to the point of being freaking insulting.

[Drakaina]

 

For the record? Yes. We can.

 

Physically, we are capable of experiencing the body's physical pain by proxy, or directly if we're keyed into it.

 

But even if we couldn't, that's not the only kind of pain. Things like grief? Betrayal? A feeling of wrongness and discomfort when something that should be working correctly doesn't? Those are kinds of pain that have nothing to do with physical senses.

 

I'm not commenting on anything to do with the OP, but seriously? Think before you type. That right there is downright depersonalizing to the point of being freaking insulting.

A lot of thought went into the post you seen to have taken more offense to than was ever meant by it. The post before was clearly talking about physical pain, and that's the general assumption most people make when they hear the word "pain", so bringing the emotional kind, which is centered in the brain, into it is totally irrelevant.

 

I also outright said that unless taught what it is, or the tulpa can/had tapped into physical senses, they would have no frame of reference for what pain is. Its like how I have no concept of what it's like to be kicked in the gonads. I can guess based on cues and what I've heard, but cannot actually feel it even empathise with the feeling.

 

Also, you are clearly working from the perspective of a fully developed tulpa. The two in question in the OP are embryos, only a matter of weeks old and from what the OP said only just started to show signs of sentience.

 

I believe I'm approaching this with a healthy level of objectivity, You're the one who posted in a thread just to say how offended you were at my post (which I'd like to point out is worded very obviously as supposition), not even bothering to contribute to the discussion of the thread at all.

[Saylin]

Alright, considering this debate was not even in response to my post, I'm going to ignore that little tidbit. However, I will say that after reading your responses and processing everything- and a bit of forcing with Claude- I do feel better about the whole situation. I didn't sense physical pain from him, which is good. I believe there was some emotional pain at first, but I think that resulted from a mixture of me not seeing him for him for a little while, and not the two predecessors, and my feeling so guilty over it.

 

That aside, I've chosen to just accept what's happened and move forward, as at this point Claude seems fairly happy, and so do I. So thank you, Drakaina for your response, and no worries, I will be sure to ask him more about it once he's sentient enough to hold a conversation. <3