Yoda (May the Forcing be with us!)

[Guest Anonymous]

Melian is very persistent, and does have autonomous traits, and all the things you mentioned.  It is just EASIER to use the label fictive median when explaining to people, because tulpamancers are so fixated on independent sentience, which I do not believe in anyway. Perhaps I have a false hope that if she identifies as a median aspect we won't get the automatic assumption she must be a tulpa in development instead of an actualized person.  Really, when push comes to shove, I don't think there is anything substantively different between a tulpa or Melian.  I think all of it is figments.  

 

Yoda is easily visualized, like all my day dreams.  But he has no autonomous anything other than minor movements, which is a trait of my imagination in general.  Yoda is like Melian was when she first appeared.  But I day dreamed Melian from that point like a puppet.  I am bored to death and frustrated just watching one of my characters just stand there.  I have never done that before like this and it is tedious and dull beyond anything I think I will be able to continue for long.  

 

I don't know what to do about Yoda.  We started him probably for all the wrong reasons.  We did it to prove we could do it I guess and to prove that a tulpa could be made without believing in independent sentience.  Well, at least for me, it isn't working very fast, at least not fast enough for me not to want to shoot myself in the head.  If I drop back to puppeting and parroting, Yoda will be a second Melian pretty much because I won't be able or be willing to stop after that.  

 

Yoda is already probably doomed as a standard tulpa.   He is not doomed as a day dream persona and he won't "fade" or "dissipate" so no worries for the folks ready to jump my ass for killing a supposedly sentient being in my head.

[jean-luc]

It can be frustrating to do something one way when you already know how to do it better another way. But if you always took the easy path, would you ever learn? I say persist. Persistance is not futile! :P

[Guest Anonymous]

Maybe. But do I really need Yoda to be totally independent?

[Guest Anonymous]

And we are putting Yoda on hold again.  It is just too confusing right now.  I am not sure I will ever be a tulpamancer.  I think that I am okay with that now.  Don't worry, Yoda will be well cared for and not neglected or allowed to fade.  He will join Melian once again in her dreamscape, released from his forcing prison box or whatever it was.  He will be free to follow her around like a puppy dog again and join us on Melian Show jedi adventures.  He will be very happy.  

 

Thanks for all your support and who know, maybe some day Yoda will blossom.

[Luminesce]

Since I always considered Melian more or less a tulpa, I figured whatever it was you thought you were trying to do wouldn't work. The line in your mind between autonomy/spontaneous thoughts and puppetting/purposely directing them is pretty vague, so cutting off the autonomy part wasn't likely to result in autonomy, you know? You don't need a "tulpa" tulpa. I mean, you certainly don't need a tulpa-tulpa. But no one needs a tulpa that exactly matches the traits we tend to see. If my tulpas hadn't been so tulpa-like I could immediately call them tulpas, I certainly wouldn't have tried to change them to fit in here. But I'd still totally be here, 'cus it's the closest thing I've found to them (only place they can really express themselves, and I can help others, etc.).

 

If Yoda became as autonomous/independent as Melian already is I would consider that quite a success. Even going about it the way you know how might be a challenge, because you've only ever had one Melian. (In my case creating Lucilyn was extremely easy tulpa-independence/sentience-wise, but I mean.. I'd had multiple tulpas for years and a ton of knowledge from Tulpa.info. Unfortunately you did not learn from Melian.info how to make more Melian-like thoughtforms.)

[Guest Anonymous]

I am afraid Melian is once in a life time achievement for me and very unique for me. Yoda will bring joy to both of us and he will have a great time. Melian is already thinking of a room for him in the dreamscape mansion, complete with Star Wars universe gizmos and technology. He will be just down the hall from her room on the second floor. Third floor is for the ghosts. LOL He can still train her in her Jedi arts and so we will look forward to those adventures with her purple light saber.

 

Melian has a huge cast of day dream characters, so Yoda will have lots of company. I have no idea if they count as servitors or dream characters or proto-tulpas whatever. To be honest, Melian and I never thought about such things until about three years ago. They were just characters in her dream world. Sometimes a day dream character is just a day dream character. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. LOL Melian's friends are the cast and co-stars of the Melian Show.

[Luminesce]

I have no idea if they count as servitors or dream characters or proto-tulpas whatever.  To be honest, Melian and I never thought about such things until about three years ago.  They were just characters in her dream world.

 

Until I found tulpa.info, I considered Sylvia the same thing as the others. She was just relatively ego-less and more identified with the mind as a whole than her own identity. Now I call her a servitor, at least when talking about her to others. But she's still what she always was to me. She's not "soulless" or "robot-like" like people tend to consider servitors. But where her own personality and experiences would be, she's instead a conduit for ours, with extremely minimalist expression. I've never seen her do anything other than speak. And early on she even told me off in brain-speak when I tried to goad emotion out of her, by sending me the thoughts explaining why that was irrelevant, unnecessary and not going to happen, lol. She's certainly a level above me when it comes to matters of thought. And I call her a servitor (or servitulpa) as well as I call my tulpas tulpas and myself the host. But in the end labels are only for communicating your experiences to others. They should not dictate your experiences. Nobody changed who Sylvia was, or who my tulpas were, by telling me what servitors or tulpas were. If you could get that down you wouldn't have to be so defensive all the time, could have your daydream adventures in peace.

[Guest Anonymous]

Thanks that makes a lot of sense. I will try to remember it. I might be one of those people to whom labels are actually poison. Better to avoid them as much as possible or use them carefully.