Problems with visualization (No mental images at all)

[ThatOneGuy]

You'll get better at visualization as the process goes on, so it shouldn't hinder you from creating a tulpa.

[Chupi]

Chupi: You mean when you stare and it seems like the blackness of your eyelids gets kind of 3D, as it has depth? I know how to do that, but visualizing is still pretty hard for me, even in that state

Not quite, unless I'm misunderstanding you. When you first visualize, it isn't even in your ordinary field of vision.

 

If you read a well-written description of something in a novel, can you kinda-sorta see it in your head as you read? This is what it will be like. It's not a visual hallucination. It has a position in your field of vision, but isn't "there" -- like it's on another plane. If you look at where it is, you see both the visualization and the real world behind it perfectly; one doesn't obscure the other, nor is it like a 50% transparency blend.

That's what closed-eye visualization is like, but the IRL plane is blank because your eyes are shut.

[Tryed]

@tulpatalk: http://pt.reddit.com/r/nosleep/comments/lm0qr/my_experience_creating_a_tulpa/

 

@Chupi: I think I get it, but for me thats just ordinary thinking. Is that what you meant?

[Chupi]

I guess... I mostly think in words, so I think of this as something different from normal thinking. (too many "think"s in that sentence there...) But yeah, I sometimes imagine how a mechanical thing would work, and it's the same deal.

 

The images seem a lot more vivid and real with eyes closed, simply because they aren't competing with your real vision.

 

When I was getting started here, it took a lot of effort to get closed-eye visualization working at all, mostly because I was watching my eyelids and couldn't convince my brain to do anything else.

[Tryed]

I see, I was actually doing the wrong thing then. I tend to separate the terms "visualizing" from "thinking" but they didnt actually match with the guides. But is it working for you? I have to be sure so I won't waste more time with more mistakes.

[Chupi]

It's working pretty well, though somewhat spotty. When I'm in my usual forcing spot and I can relax properly, I get between 4 and 6 on your chart, usually at least 5 (some color).

 

What I'm still having trouble with is that I often need to describe what I'm seeing to myself in words to see it vividly; when I look at a detail the rest of the scene fades; and I have to consciously "see" things. (Last one sounds trivial but rules out adventures in uncharted areas of my wonderland, which I'd really like to do.)

[Hoppip]

[pic]

 

what's the difference between 2 and 3?

[Targaryen]

@Chupi: So are you saying that the visualization referred to during "visualization procedures" is actually the same as the images we see when we think about something? If that's the case, I'm very relieved. Has it gotten better with practice?

[Tryed]

 

what's the difference between 2 and 3?

 

Theres was a poll on the thread this was originally posted... its the same thing, but 2 "disappears fast" and 3 is "quite stable".

[Chupi]

@Chupi: So are you saying that the visualization referred to during "visualization procedures" is actually the same as the images we see when we think about something? If that's the case, I'm very relieved. Has it gotten better with practice?

It's the same in kind, at least for me, but when you get used to doing it with your eyes closed, it seems more vivid and real.

 

Also (with closed-eye only), after you do it for maybe 10-15 minutes, the line between your real and imagined vision starts to blur and it starts to feel more like it's projected on your eyelids. But if I consciously note this at the time, it immediately becomes a lot less real.

 

@Tryed: Thanks, I was wondering about 2 vs 3 too.