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How do tulpas fit into your religion/belief system?


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I know that God has a plan for everyone, and he has not appeared in front of me old testament style, but i have encountered the Holy Ghost multiple times.

 

I know God has a plan for me, and i intend to follow that plan, and that plan includes making another living soul. The carpenter gave me the tools to make it, and he intended for me to do it. and it is for my best that i do it. Of course i do it, and i do it with the tools from the carpenter, and i do it properly and with patience, so the end result is the same boat as the carpenter made so many years ago.

 

wouldn't it be better if you just said "he threw a blueprint twoards my direction" instead of "he gave me the tools"? i think that's closer to what you're trying to say isn't it?

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Perfect. let's take a look at that again , shall we?

You cannot create a soul; only God can.

i don't remember that. Where exactly does the bible say that?

It does not. However, Christianity teaches that the soul comes from God:

For example. It is here taught that the soul is God's work, on a similar scale to creating the world. Moreover, were humans making souls a possibility, it would probably be addressed, having such huge moral consequences.

Yes , the original one does. That doesn't mean it could be impossible or bad to create one yourself. (i mean , it's not a rule or anything , this is all considering it's possible.)

I don't know where it does and couldn't find a reference myself. It is impossible for a human to create a soul equal to another human soul, if nothing else because they are not made by God.

You said it yourself. There is no such reference anywhere. Yet you state it is imposible to for a human to create a soul equal to another human soul because they are not made by God.

 

(i know , that was damn crafty of me to slip that first sentence in my second quote but i proved my point didn't i?)

 

But they didn't change the Bible. The Bible is universal to all denominations (as far as I know) and it is the Bible that we are (mostly) discussion.

 

ok my bad then , i just wasn't quite sure what they had changed and what they left as it was.

 

As for the other two points i guess those are settled.

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The difference between you and God is somewhat different to the difference between two factory workers. That much should be more than clear.

To clarify further, if God's work was identical to your own, then we would either worship you or have no reason to worship God. A soul from God is intrinsically special, because it is from God, just as the Bible is (in the view of Christianity) different from other religious scripture such as the Qur'an.

 

Edit: damn these post timings.

Perfect. let's take a look at that again , shall we?

You said it yourself. There is no such reference anywhere. Yet you state it is imposible to for a human to create a soul equal to another human soul because they are not made by God.

 

(i know , that was damn crafty of me to slip that first sentence in my second quote but i proved my point didn't i?)

 

It is true that there is no specific reference to humans not being able to create souls, as I have maintained. Bearing in mind that in the first post you quoted I (as I have been frantically correcting) meant a soul equal to that of a human, this is still true. Even if a human were to create a soul that is a copy of a human soul, it would not be the same because it did not come from God. As above, God's work is intrinsically special whereas yours is not.

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Edit: damn these post timings.

It is true that there is no specific reference to humans not being able to create souls, as I have maintained. Bearing in mind that in the first post you quoted I (as I have been frantically correcting) meant a soul equal to that of a human, this is still true. Even if a human were to create a soul that is a copy of a human soul, it would not be the same because it did not come from God. As above, God's work is intrinsically special whereas yours is not.

 

So the word we should be using here is "Unique" then. Not "special". But how are we sure it is in fact unique?

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So the word we should be using here is "Unique" then. Not "special". But how are we sure it is in fact unique?

No, definitely special. God's work is in higher regard than the work of man because he is God. What he does is intrinsically special; this means that human souls made by God are special. Since the same does not apply to the work of man, we can conclude that 'human' souls made by humans are not special.

 

Even if they are functionally identical, there is your difference above.

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No, im not saying that Gods work is equal to mine, God's work is far greater than mine, but im also saying that i am working with Gods help,

God helps people to do things all the time, but that does not make what those people do God's work.

 

and since God is perfect he has no trouble in making me capable of making a soul or two with his help.

It is simply false to say that a human would be entrusted to the creation of other 'true' human souls. We have covered this before, in many different aspects:

you chose to make a tulpa. You would have essentially asked for another soul, that would be under the control of yourself. However you look at it, your tulpa is intrinsically subservient to you. Moreover, whenever the Bible mentions the soul it usually accompanies the body; the idea that a soul can enter the mortal world without its own body contradicts scripture.

It is simply wrong to say that God gave you the power to create a soul. If He did then you are not creating a human soul; this is an underlying point of Christianity: the human soul is special because it comes from God. By this reasoning, if you created a soul for your tulpa, then it would be religiously equivalent to an animal's: (correct me if I'm wrong) animals can have free will and can be intelligent, sentient and so on; but they are not special because they did not come from God.

 

If i however where to do this without the blessings of God i would fail on epic proportions.

So the people on this forum who have not created a tulpa with God's blessing, what happened there?

 

God has infinite potential, and thus he uses me to make a new soul.

While it tends to be best not to directly question the will of God, this point does raise a question: why would God use you to create a new soul? (As mentioned above) it would be naturally subservient to you and so on.

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i dont know about you, but my faith is of the kind where God loves everyone. What is it that a lot of people here need? Companionship. But since a lot of people here are hardcore atheists, they cant just skip down to the local church and make friends with God Jesus Christ. So then God chosed to give his children the joy of making a tulpa, wether they wanted to or not, everyone is the child of God. I see tulpae as a gift from God himself, and he made them so that we can make them, and they would still have a soul equal to ours. God loves us so much that he even gave you a taste of what it is to be him.

 

If tulpas were a gift from God, then wouldn't they be mentioned in the Bible? Or in any religious text? Why would they be so obscure, or hard to make, or frustrating? Why would they be practiced by Buddhist monks and not Christian monks?

 

so that we can make them, and they would still have a soul equal to ours

You're still missing my point. If you make a soul then it will not be equal to your own.

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And you are still missing my point. I make a soul, and it is equal to mine. wanna know why? BECAUSE GOD HELPS ME. end of story.

But it's not. God can help you with whatever He wants, but that doesn't mean it's His work. I said this before. If you are the primary agent (or even present at any level as one) in making a tulpa then it is not the same as God making a soul.

 

 

and yes, they are a gift from God, just like a lot of other stuff not mentioned in the bible, because if you were to list up every gift from God you would never finish it, because God has made everything that is, and everything that will ever be.

So we go back to the common view that the whole world is God's gift. That invalidates your point, because we then say that everything in the world is God's gift to humans. Hurricanes are God's gift to people, so that the ones who aren't affected might enjoy life a bit more; fantastic. Although this is addressed in many religious arguments, it still invalidates your point.

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Are you saying that God cant help me do this properly? Because im pretty sure that God is perfect.

Not that God can't, and nothing to do with 'properly'. The soul you make just wouldn't be special because it's not created by God, and your argument doesn't get around that.

 

You cant have the goods without the bads, it is just not possible.

im pretty sure that God is perfect.

Yeah, you're contradicting yourself here.

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The thing with the bads is that they also bring with them a lot of goods, sometimes they bring more good than bad.

And tulpas aren't always good either. Consider that the long term effects aren't known.

 

And yes, my argument goes perfectly around that. in fact, my argument drives in circles around your argument. The soul is made by God, and he used me to make it. He gifted me with the skill to make a tupper with a human soul, deal with it. Saying that God cant make me make another soul that is equal to mine is something that God does not approve of, and if you believe in God i asume that you also believe he is perfect.

This is like saying 'God gave me power over other humans'. No, He didn't.

The point is that a soul created with you anywhere in the process is not the same as a natural human soul, and therefore your tulpa is not equal to you.

Moreover, a tulpa is (as previously mentioned) inherently subservient to you. Humans were not meant to have the power of true life and death over other humans (this is why killing is forbidden): procreation is not creating a soul, while creating a tulpa is; moreover the act of dissolving a tulpa is potentially destroying its soul. No matter how special you think you are, another human soul would not be placed under you, therefore the tulpa that has been is not exactly human.

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