How do tulpas fit into your religion/belief system?

[waffles]

I have a tulpa, and as I've said before I don't actually hold a personal belief that tulpas are not equal to humans. What I'm trying to communicate is that the statement goes against traditional (taken completely from scripture) Christianity.

 

You are clearly not an expert on quantum mechanics (no-one is, really). Electrons do not move in a random way, and quantum mechanics predicts their movement precisely. It'd be unfair to dismiss it there, so let's take an actual example of randomness: radioactive decay. Science cannot predict when a radioactive nucleus will decay, although can predict how many will in a given time. Despite this, since God is omniscient He still know when it will decay. As such, the comparison to free will does not hold.

 

It is simply wrong to say that God gave you the power to create a soul. If He did then you are not creating a human soul; this is an underlying point of Christianity: the human soul is special because it comes from God. By this reasoning, if you created a soul for your tulpa, then it would be religiously equivalent to an animal's: (correct me if I'm wrong) animals can have free will and can be intelligent, sentient and so on; but they are not special because they did not come from God.

 

To clarify here; in earlier posts, where I mentioned tulpas not having souls, I should have specified God-given souls.

[Sock]

Weighing in on the Christianity and thought folk thing (I apologize in advance for verging on metaphysical talk):

 

My view of tulpa is that they aren't their own unique soul, but simply a piece of your own that's been sectioned/broken off. Midori often said things along this line when I asked her about it, and some recent experiences concerning a prayer group and blurting out that I was experimenting with this seems to back this view of things. Furthermore, if one would allow more anecdotal talk, it seems that while this practice/existence of a tulpa is tolerated, there is a suggestion made to the tulpa that they become one with their host again.

 

I'm not going to go too deep here, since this concerns a lot of talk about intangibles, and this forum is mainly about the purely psychological aspect of things. If you want to know more about my experience, just PM me.

[Semi-Nomadic]

You guys seem to be taking over the discussion. Maybe debate this in a separate thread?

[waffles]

I'm well aware that it can be offensive; keep in mind that I am not the one holding these beliefs. Also bear in mind that this argument does not stand up for all Christians, only those who believe in a divine soul as according to scripture.

You can't compare making a tulpa to making a human, because humans (the souls at least) are made by God. Even if God wanted you to make a tulpa it would not have a God-given soul because you made it.

As for the plan, even if it was God's will for you to make a tulpa, you can't say that it was inevitable and still claim to have free will. It was still, ultimately, a conscious, personal choice to make a tulpa.

 

Edit:semi, is there a better thread? This one seems pretty apt.

[412]

You cannot create a soul; only God can.

i don't remember that. Where exactly does the bible say that?

 

the Bible doesn't mention contraception, and yet the Catholic church rules it as wrong

it is mentioned. it's a form of murder. murder is a sin.

 

I don't actually believe that the above is true, only that it is according to scripture*.

*the catholic one.

 

It is simply wrong to say that God gave you the power to create a soul. If He did then you are not creating a human soul; this is an underlying point of Christianity: the human soul is special because it comes from God. By this reasoning, if you created a soul for your tulpa, then it would be religiously equivalent to an animal's: (correct me if I'm wrong) animals can have free will and can be intelligent, sentient and so on; but they are not special because they did not come from God.

 

To clarify here; in earlier posts, where I mentioned tulpas not having souls, I should have specified God-given souls.

 

no it's not. I don't know about the catholics and their branches but the orthodox church says nothing of the sort. The human soul is special because it was created in a different way. God created animals souls as well.

 

To clarify here; in earlier posts, where I mentioned tulpas not having souls, I should have specified God-given souls.

Basically , i believe they're not even a new soul at all. more like partitions on a hard drive or users on an os without the downsides. I mean , withought you really loosing anything or as Sock said splitting your soul into two parts. More like a hydra. Or an add-on to the soul. Maybe modification.

 

 

Actually , what does the bible say about people with DID? Tulpas pretty much are a form of self inflicted and controlled DID in a way , aren't they? So the general christian outlook on tulpas should be at least somewhat similar to the one they have on people with DID , correct?

 

by the way , i do not agree with a lot of things here , i'm agnostic. (grew up as an orthodox christian though) This is all asuming souls exist and were made as the bible states.

[waffles]

i don't remember that. Where exactly does the bible say that?

It does not. However, Christianity teaches that the soul comes from God:

And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul

For example. It is here taught that the soul is God's work, on a similar scale to creating the world. Moreover, were humans making souls a possibility, it would probably be addressed, having such huge moral consequences.

 

it is mentioned. it's a form of murder. murder is a sin.

I don't think it is explicitly mentioned.

 

*the catholic one.

Is there any other scripture? The only accepted Christian scripture is the Bible, and that's universal.

 

no it's not. I don't know about the catholics and their branches but the orthodox church says nothing of the sort. The human soul is special because it was created in a different way. God created animals souls as well.

The Bible doesn't say anything about the souls of animals. However, it does make reference to animals being inferior to humans:

Then God said, “Let us make man in our image, after our likeness. And let them have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the heavens and over the livestock and over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.”

The point is that human souls are still special, and would not be if not made by God.

 

Basically , i believe they're not even a new soul at all. more like partitions on a hard drive or users on an os without the downsides. I mean , withought you really loosing anything or as Sock said splitting your soul into two parts. More like a hydra. Or an add-on to the soul. Maybe modification.

It is sometimes taught that the personality and the soul are separate. By this measure, a tulpa could simply be another personality, 'sharing' your soul, as it were.

 

Actually , what does the bible say about people with DID? Tulpas pretty much are a form of self inflicted and controlled DID in a way , aren't they? So the general christian outlook on tulpas should be at least somewhat similar to the one they have on people with DID , correct?

DID was never mentioned in the Bible because it was not prevalent or medically recognised at the time. As for what contemporary Christians say on DID, I don't know, but it's not the same as a tulpa. DID is unintentional and usually harmful too (or at least the cases that are documented).

[waffles]

 

If you dont believe in it, then why the fuck are you spreading it like as if your life depended on it? And yes, i can make a new soul. Wanna know why? Because God gave me the gift of tulpamancing, and with his blessings, i shall do so. I believe in free will, but i also believe in a God that has a plan for everything, wanna know why? Because we are as free as we say we are, thats why.

 

If a carpenter gives you the tools to make a boat with the intention of you doing so, and you use those tools to make mentioned boat, then is it not the carpenter that indirectly made you build said boat?

 

I'm making the point that it is incorrect to say what you are saying in regards to Christianity and tulpas.

 

What makes you believe that it is God's divine will for you to make a tulpa? Did he appear to you Old Testament style and tell you?

My point about free will is that God may know what you are going to do, and could change it but would not, because you have free will. Even if God has a plan for you, it is your choice whether or not to follow it.

 

The point about ability to create a human soul is that a human can't. Even if it is similar to a true human soul then it would not be unique like a human's. Your carpenter did not make you build the boat, you chose to make the boat. And moreover the boat was not built by the carpenter with all that entails.

[intelhunter]

 

I'm making the point that it is incorrect to say what you are saying in regards to Christianity and tulpas.

 

What makes you believe that it is God's divine will for you to make a tulpa? Did he appear to you Old Testament style and tell you?

My point about free will is that God may know what you are going to do, and could change it but would not, because you have free will. Even if God has a plan for you, it is your choice whether or not to follow it.

 

The point about ability to create a human soul is that a human can't. Even if it is similar to a true human soul then it would not be unique like a human's. Your carpenter did not make you build the boat, you chose to make the boat. And moreover the boat was not built by the carpenter with all that entails.

 

I know that God has a plan for everyone, and he has not appeared in front of me old testament style, but i have encountered the Holy Ghost multiple times.

 

I know God has a plan for me, and i intend to follow that plan, and that plan includes making another living soul. The carpenter gave me the tools to make it, and he intended for me to do it. and it is for my best that i do it. Of course i do it, and i do it with the tools from the carpenter, and i do it properly and with patience, so the end result is the same boat as the carpenter made so many years ago.

[412]

It does not. However, Christianity teaches that the soul comes from God:

For example. It is here taught that the soul is God's work, on a similar scale to creating the world. Moreover, were humans making souls a possibility, it would probably be addressed, having such huge moral consequences.

Yes , the original one does. That doesn't mean it could be impossible or bad to create one yourself. (i mean , it's not a rule or anything , this is all considering it's possible.)

 

I don't think it is explicitly mentioned.

it's a form of murder. murder is a sin.

 

 

Is there any other scripture? The only accepted Christian scripture is the Bible, and that's universal.

 

Not really. A lot of branches have gone off and changed it to suit their own belifs , havent' they? (take Jehovah's witnesses or Mormons for example.) I'm not sure about the bible , but i know that Catholics did change a lot of things. i'm not really sure it's safe to go by what they say.

The Bible doesn't say anything about the souls of animals. However, it does make reference to animals being inferior to humans:

The point is that human souls are still special,

and would not be if not made by God.

it doesn't say that anywhere. ok yes , i know , it's probably implied. What i was trying to contradict there was

 

the human soul is special because it comes from God. By this reasoning, if you created a soul for your tulpa, then it would be religiously equivalent to an animal's: (correct me if I'm wrong) animals can have free will and can be intelligent, sentient and so on; but they are not special because they did not come from God.

Unless you mean they're not part of god the way we supossedly are.

 

It is sometimes taught that the personality and the soul are separate. By this measure, a tulpa could simply be another personality, 'sharing' your soul, as it were.

Yes , well put , i agree with that. (considering souls are a thing it seems to be the most correct imo)

 

DID was never mentioned in the Bible because it was not prevalent or medically recognised at the time. As for what contemporary Christians say on DID, I don't know, but it's not the same as a tulpa. DID is unintentional and usually harmful too (or at least the cases that are documented).

I see. Quite interesting.

[waffles]

 

I know that God has a plan for everyone, and he has not appeared in front of me old testament style, but i have encountered the Holy Ghost multiple times.

 

I know God has a plan for me, and i intend to follow that plan, and that plan includes making another living soul. The carpenter gave me the tools to make it, and he intended for me to do it. and it is for my best that i do it. Of course i do it, and i do it with the tools from the carpenter, and i do it properly and with patience, so the end result is the same boat as the carpenter made so many years ago.

 

That sort of makes sense. However, even if God wanted you to make a soul, and gave you the tools to do so, then the resulting 'soul' would not be equal to a human one, because it does not come from God.

 

The end result is not the same boat, because it was not made by the carpenter. Functionally identical they may be, but not the same.

 

 

Yes , the original one does. That doesn't mean it could be impossible or bad to create one yourself. (i mean , it's not a rule or anything , this is all considering it's possible.)

I don't know where it does and couldn't find a reference myself. It is impossible for a human to create a soul equal to another human soul, if nothing else because they are not made by God.

 

 

Not really. A lot of branches have gone off and changed it to suit their own belifs , havent' they? (take Jehovah's witnesses or Mormons for example.) I'm not sure about the bible , but i know that Catholics did change a lot of things. i'm not really sure it's safe to go by what they say.

But they didn't change the Bible. The Bible is universal to all denominations (as far as I know) and it is the Bible that we are (mostly) discussion.

 

it doesn't say that anywhere. ok yes , i know , it's probably implied. What i was trying to contradict there was

You're right in saying that the Bible doesn't cover human souls being made by someone other than God, but it is strongly implied.

 

Unless you mean they're not part of god the way we supossedly are.

Sort of; either way, I meant what I said.