Echo Chambers in the Tulpa Community

[G+3]

Stuff

 

That is a huge ass wall of text and I will address it in the morning; sorry, it's 1 AM.

 

 

Sorry if I wasn't clear, I meant the echo chamber phenomenon. Everyone, in my opinion, should approach creating their first tulpa with an open mind and a healty amount of scepticism. Just believing what is said online because the community seems to agree on it might not be the best way of going at it.

 

For example, the idea of assuming sentience from the start. This lead a lot of people to believe that a tulpa is sentient from the first hour of forcing. I do not believe this to be the case and cannot find good arguments to back up that claim. This can lead people into imagining that they have a tulpa when they really don't. (Not accusing anyone here, just giving a personnal opinion to illustrate my point)

 

Which I completely agree with.

I'll be perfectly honest and say that an idea unchallenged isn't an idea but a fairy tale.

Scepticism is a good and very healthy thing, but communities and groups shouldn't shun those who don't agree with them, and vice-versa. The echo chambers are too sceptic of anything that doesn't fall in line with their rules, which is nonsensical, (and kind of funny as I seen a few IRCs that were very apparent ''for science!'' folk, who seen themselves very highly. And then ended up being children; irony at its finest.)

[Linkzelda]

It's alright, I don't expect anyone to process that in one sitting. I purposefully do that so they actually take some time to think things through a bit.

[Couguhl]

Sometimes we want to feel that the moment we have a realization or some lesson learned, we assume others "should" know what we learned to. And the more we become attached to our tulpa, the more likely we develop urges of apathy and passive-aggressiveness (usually expressed through being condescending).

 

A wonderful description of cognitive bias. I've seen a lot of unnecessary cynicism from users who have "been there" so to speak, and it apparently affects others as well. It can be discouraging to newer users if they see that some of the more experienced users are so negative, for various reasons.

 

Because no matter how much we get into having implied separate consciousness, they aren't other-worldly beings, they are an aspect of ourselves, and can only be as sentient and sapient as much faith we put into those ideas.

 

I love this so much, I will put it in my sig.

[G+3]

I'm going to take this paragraph by paragraph, but snip those I've nothing to contribute or add to; I have to give you major creds for writing such an epic post.

 

-snip-

 

We know that tulpa.info is in a state of infancy, and it most likely will be like that the more people put aside their ambitions to make the tulpa phenomenon easily accessed and has a broader awareness. And even if there should be change within the community itself, it will always have to keep aiming for progressive mindset. IRC, to me personally, is bit more fast-pace then the boards itself, and most people don't really give much thought into the advice they're stating there in the first place. It's the idea that seems to encroach into people's heads that people in the IRC can help others, so newcomers who see this will automatically go there for advice, only to find that people are just saying what can be read on the main site.

 

I guess in that case there's the problem of impatience, where new comers maybe to excited to wait for advice and instead turn to a quick-fix source like irc. We could compare this to eating in that, generally at least, our staple foods are sufficient, but can very bad for us. Or, at least, not as good as time-cared-for foods would be. It's a real shame; and alas, it's too deep of an inset human nature to even attempt to change.

 

The idea of "For Science" seems to be irrelevant other than to create a pretense that there's something of a "studious" endeavors going on. And I have a feeling that it isn't the social aspect that's the major problem, but also just the individuals perception and how they define the social aspect themselves. It's one thing to be empathetic and compassionate for our tulpa to try and work through things they have to learn themselves, but it's another to start doing the same to other members in the community. Especially since when we built our own resolve and found solace in climbing over the insanity and over-doubting barrier, it's hard to try and reason with these people that are new, because we assume "Why don't they know this?" or "How come they aren't aware of this?"

Sometimes we want to feel that the moment we have a realization or some lesson learned, we assume others "should" know what we learned to. And the more we become attached to our tulpa, the more likely we develop urges of apathy and passive-aggressiveness (usually expressed through being condescending). And getting over the barrier itself is definitely painful, since it takes time to really make good reasons why we should be doing this. This is why what Ror did is what anyone should do, just temporarily alienate yourself from others' opinions and set a foundation on your own so you don't go worshiping people like their Gods just because "at the time" when you saw their opinions, it felt right to you.

 

I'm at a disadvantage here because I simply can't empathise with the urges of apathy or paggressiveness. I normally find myself revelling when other find difficulty in simple problems—simple from my stand point—as they can then share my triumph in overcoming that problem. I guess I'm the golden goose then. But I don't see it out of the realm of possibility those who do help others simple stand back themselves when they become tired. Which does happen, but I mean prior to the shift in attitude. Maybe I'm forgetting that alot more people are better natured than I think and desire to help, but in that case I only see it as reason to stand back early so that the process doesn't become overwhelmingly tiring, meaning they can return to help with a clearer mind.

 

But, Ror is very much in the green as you said, which over looks all the problems created by what I just said. And that would also negate—mostly-partially, at least—the effect of the Echo Chamber and Speaker effect as you just put. I believe I may push that idea in the future when confronting newer hosts.

 

There's absolutely nothing wrong with stepping back from the community a little bit to see what YOU think is suitable for your schema of things. And it's not just matter of being open-minded towards new ideas, it's just a matter of being empathetic. We know people are insecure about many things when they're starting out, and for us to go back to the same thing we were trying to avoid and conquer obviously wouldn't be something we do naturally. But when you start realizing that not everyone is going catch on as fast on things you learned, and when you practice remembering something so obvious, it gets easier. And people who keep asking the same questions only getting the same results, even if they say "I checked other threads" when there's threads with a similar format, it's just what anxiety does to us.

 

The totality of our being is like a Google Search Engine. When we collect the information from other people's perspectives (almost being "Yes-men/Yes-women"), we are in a way like Google Spider bots that mine for those opinions, but sometimes we're in limbo, and we're too caught into a person's words, and we never go back to our more analytical side (the search engine base) to actually learn something. The analogy might not make much sense, but I'm using it to state that we lose sight of our ability to use retrospect and hindsight because we're so caught up with trying to satisfy others too much before going back to ourselves.

 

No, I like a good analogy; they aren't used enough now a days; though I find myself using them maybe a tad too much. There's is one thing I can draw from this, maybe the guides section of the site could use an overhaul. Perhaps we need more guides which present similar ideas but in different formats, and vice versa. I feel there's a lot of repetition of ideas, which would be okay were they all presented from different perspectives. And when new ideas are formulated, they generally stray close to the originals. And only because the person may fear being ridiculed for a new idea that may seem outrageous.

 

If we are going to assume that a lot of people wont have the sense to stand back and create a person over view, we have to assume that the information we present to them obviously is never going to be one size fits all. This is, of course, asking a lot of the community—''MOAR GUIDES!''—though I can't help but point out that guides relating to... let use imposition for example, are all of similar length, topic, method, and language. Bar maybe the photo method, and one other I'm forgetting.

 

I'm going to be incredibly big headed, vain, and proud here, and say that Pruria's guide is a very good example. The idea was fresh, it was outrageous and completely against the gut of the grain. It was also presented in a semi-professional, semi-casual tone; much different to the very scientific approach most strive for. And it was revived well enough, and I actually seen a newbie about two weeks later correcting themselves to say 'host deafness' as opposed to 'vocality'. And my point is that despite how well it was received, I'd say a hefty lump of people didn't recive it well because it was very long, or the tone didn't suit them, or the information was presented in an insufficient way. And though, I'm assuming that others don't do this, which they do, they just don't do it often enough.

 

I've had thoughts of finish the big list of guides as maybe that would help newbies find what they really need. My mistake, just checked, Derp beat me by about two weeks; fair play.

 

 

And looking at that list, I can see you've written three guides, so I hope that maybe give you something to think about or something you can say to prove me wrong. I secretly hope I'm right, that would at least show that there's a chance newbies don't just skip the guides section and go straight to irc.

 

 

And as for people believing others who express more confidence/have more social status than others, of course that's going to be something people do naturally. No one wants to see a person that clearly can't get their shit together and expect to console or offer people's advice. People either put up a pretentious portrayal of confidence, or they're really confident and went through the pains that other people are now trying to resolve, or they're just people who are learning and don't want others feeling miserable. If a person doesn't know what to say to console the other person's concerns, they're bound to use pre-fetched concepts as a euphemistic way of getting the other to STFU. It's sad, but that's what happens when we rely ONLY on conjecture.

 

So if anyone wants to solve anything with the presumed social problem, there's many things to cover, but one obvious and important thing is that as much information you get out of this community and other sources beyond that, you have to get time for yourself to analyze what you've learned and make your own principles. That is really the practical way to get anything out of this. We can't really change how people respond to others who seem to have confidence and/or higher social status, because everyone is going to have their own preconceptions of what fits the "competent" or "intelligent" persona. And if OP is worried more that people who seem confident are the ones getting acknowledged (and sadly worshiped like gods), then honestly, if you want your ideas to be known as well, you're going to have to state them in some way if anyone wants to know what you're thinking.

 

And even if those people who are confident and how people attach themselves so much to them bothers you, it doesn't mean that all people portraying confidence are pretentious or don't know how to follow what they're saying.

 

Hm, it was perhaps very close minded of me to assume all speakers are pretentious, and all those in power are bad. And I must also admit that without those of higher confidence, we'd all be only attempting to get our points across, and nothing would be sorted.

 

But I do see a way to get across my points without being aggressive or offensive in anyway; I actually had a very long discussion with a friend of mine—Kiahdaj—about that topic, and I'm probably going to compile a new thread addressing that. The best way to describe it in short hand is to simply look at this thread. I feel, at least, that I presented my points in the OP in a strong and scientific manner (I base my idea off the the language of science, or the language which is commonplace in scientific papers and journals, etc.) And all the replies I've revived have followed in the same format. And this is possibly the best discussion I've had in a while, or it's at least very highly ranked. But that's a topic for another time.

 

IRC is meant for people who are popular to have people on the sidelines, this is why you should make your existence known on the boards, where you can develop your thoughts a bit more than the High-School style the IRC is, a popularity contest. If the person people are worshiping can't discuss things with other members on the board, it's a clear sign that they're just people that others magnify their "greatness" over. Which is why you don't see many of those "greats" really commenting as much.

 

You get people to become attached to a person's clever way of words, and suddenly they're stripped of using their own brain for once. It happens, we all need as many perspectives as we can, but we simply have to make it a habit to know this is for our own sake at times. And for those groups of people that outcast a person for not sharing their own views, it's just like High School where people try to validate their identity.

 

Solution? Just like OP stated, Get over the bullshit they're doing and stand by your own beliefs. A select group of people not accepting you shouldn't make you feel worthless. Unfortunately, since people are still pretty young, it's going to take a few months to years for them to realize.

 

And it's not just about setting a positive image, we don't want to make that a militant ambition where the positive nature becomes superficial and pretentious; we should aim for being practical. Because when someone tries to give a realistic answer that might make others cringe, it's going to be considered negative because we're not doing our best to make this some kind of retirement home where we let people hear what they want to hear. We're here to provide solutions, even if those solutions may not be consistent with our beliefs and values, and for people to be intolerant of change.....you should be very afraid of yourself. VERY AFRAID.

 

It's funny, I initially thought that your post would be in opposition of mine, but I found myself agreeing with more or less all of it. And that's not to say it hasn't made me think; I've a few more things to ponder on now. Once again, cred for the epic long post, and now creds for presenting your ideas in possibly of the best formats I've seen on this site. (And no, I'm not just saying that because it's agreeing with the OP, what kind of biased wierdo do you take me for?)

 

And I have to apologise for going kind of askew in my third block of text, off topic, but still something we can ponder on.

 

 

And that ''Which is why you don't see many of those "greats" really commenting as much. '' Comment made me chuckle, much more than I should have.

 

[Linkzelda]

This is how you have discussions on the Internet. Snip the person's posts into manageable chunks, just one of many ways to actually get people to see things better and respond more deeply than usual. Again, I apologize if this is TL ; DR, but I feel this is what a discussion is usually supposed to lead to, getting deeper and deeper (depending on the intensity of the issue) into finding solutions to a problem stated in OP.

 

If no one can take the time to read through it, that's fine, but if we want to prevent repeated responses, I figure that taking time to develop deeper thoughts would be another step in preventing echo chambers.

 

I'm going to take this paragraph by paragraph, but snip those I've nothing to contribute or add to; I have to give you major creds for writing such an epic post.

 

 

I guess in that case there's the problem of impatience, where new comers maybe to excited to wait for advice and instead turn to a quick-fix source like irc. We could compare this to eating in that, generally at least, our staple foods are sufficient, but can very bad for us. Or, at least, not as good as time-cared-for foods would be. It's a real shame; and alas, it's too deep of an inset human nature to even attempt to change.

 

 

I guess I'm the golden goose then. But I don't see it out of the realm of possibility those who do help others simple stand back themselves when they become tired. Which does happen, but I mean prior to the shift in attitude. Maybe I'm forgetting that alot more people are better natured than I think and desire to help, but in that case I only see it as reason to stand back early so that the process doesn't become overwhelmingly tiring, meaning they can return to help with a clearer mind.

 

Yeah, we all have our limits on how much and how frequent we try to help others. If we're exhausted most of the day, and we try to contribute in the Questions and Answers Section, or any section with a particular topic in mind, how we provide our opinions might be different than ones if we were calm and relaxed. There's only so much energy we can exert before we become irritated ourselves, especially since seeing how these people were in the same position we were in finding solace on why they're doing this. I admit that I've had many cases where I wanted to help, but I didn't reply because I felt I would be too aggressive, and not the "I'm-doing-this-because-I-care" aggressive, the "God-what-the-hell-is-wrong-with-you-spineless-cur" aggressive. :P

 

I'm at a disadvantage here because I simply can't empathise with the urges of apathy or paggressiveness. I normally find myself revelling when other find difficulty in simple problems—simple from my stand point—as they can then share my triumph in overcoming that problem.[/Quote]

 

For me, I stated that we might develop those urges of apathy and passive-aggressiveness because of how I relate tulpa with dream characters in non-lucid and lucid dreaming. When I first started out with lucid dreaming, I never had the thought slip in my head that I was initially being passive about the dream characters/thought-forms that existed, especially in my first lucid dream. I had all of those thoughts of dream guides, LD techniques and what have you nicely packed behind my head, and when I met a dream character that stated they were my dream guide (they looked like Will Smith), I eventually tried to kill them for some odd reason. That was due to me wanting to do as many things as possible in a lucid dream. So in a way, I wasn't being thoughtful that the dream characters themselves could just be my subconscious' way of trying to reach out to me.

 

Then I reached the stage where I was trying to see if having Self-fulfilling prophecies with dreaming (like dream incubation where you set a plan of what you want to dream) could've been Apophenia:

 

Apophenia is the experience of seeing meaningful patterns or connections in random or meaningless data. The term was coined in 1958 by Klaus Conrad, who defined it as the "unmotivated seeing of connections" accompanied by a "specific experience of an abnormal meaningfulness".

 

-en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apophenia

 

 

I realized battling through this made me more aggressive towards these dream characters, or at least when I was recalling the dreams I had with them. I felt as if I was living a lie, deluding myself by trying to make a humanistic reality with thought-forms inside my head during non-REM and REM cycles in my sleep. I started to go back how I would get into spiritual aspects like finding my Spirit Animal, Akashic Records, and about anything mystical and purely driven by faith and didn't have substantial evidence to prove. Those endeavors with those thought-forms and my attachments in foreseeing good from those experience made me realize (after going through my own pity party with the realization) that my life was a blank canvas. Everything I did up until now was done mostly through seeing myself accomplishing them, and making accommodations to make them a reality (including other factors like families, friends, etc. that gave me experiences that helped me teach myself).

 

So I had the ideas in the back of my head of words relating to how lucid dreaming can let you do and become anything if you put your mind to it, however, I was blinded of the truth that it was just my expectations and letting my subconscious do its wonders in making it a reality that I didn't want to believe was true. But I eventually got over that, and started appreciating my existence more, both in dreaming and waking life. Which is why when I shift things to tulpa, thought-forms as well, I see the huge similarity of how I would behave to dream characters, except, I'm making implications of them being real until they're actually so in my reality.

 

Which is why what Coughal quoted from me:

 

"Because no matter how much we get into having implied separate consciousness, they aren't other-worldly beings, they are an aspect of ourselves, and can only be as sentient and sapient as much faith we put into those ideas." started to become true to me.

 

They became more than just words to me, I started to see myself living and breathing by them. I felt that just having anything discussed with my tulpa through words would be enough for them, and it was simply a matter of pulling my own weight to reach my desire of having a vocal, fully-sentient and fully-sapient tulpa. This is also why I became interested in Hypnosis (and clearing myself of the misconceptions behind it), it provided the basis of a self-fulfilling prophecy and enabling yourself to have high inward concentration towards my goals (of course there's more variants of Hypnosis like NLP Hypnosis, but that's something I'm still researching and learning from).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But, Ror is very much in the green as you said, which over looks all the problems created by what I just said. And that would also negate—mostly-partially, at least—the effect of the Echo Chamber and Speaker effect as you just put. I believe I may push that idea in the future when confronting newer hosts.

 

How you stated that was a bit confusing, but I feel this is what you're trying to declare (please correct me if I am wrong in my presumption). You're saying that people who alienate themselves to learn more about themselves, and not trying to contribute into making a change in the social aspects of Tulpa.info is a detriment towards the site's progress as a social haven or social cluster. If that's the case, I can disagree that people doing this would be a detriment. The thing is, people join these small groups of individuals because they felt that the leader or just the people within it helps them fill the gap of confusion and insecurities they have. The thing is, they never realize that their attachment to those social groups is simply because of the memories and most likely the opinions and discussions they had with those people. So it's no wonder that when other groups find ways to contradict that other groups' ideals, they'll put up defenses, and it becomes a battle of who is more right and who is more wrong.

 

This is why I feel that people like what Ror is doing is to have those realizations that forgetting about the attachments "temporarily" to understand and analyze themselves instead of others is beneficial. Because the more we get into frequent experiences of Introspection, the more we see these people were merely beings that helped us evolve in some way, and we just want to stick by them because they're important to us. It's a basic human emotion and behavior of sticking by few people we feel are worth investing our time and efforts on, and anyone that tries to fight that, we defend it.

 

It's just something anyone would do for their friends, but it takes more strength to consider other people's thoughts that maybe, just maybe, the little group in the corner they're part of that's intolerable to change might not be right in everything. That's something that mostly takes an individual analysis on, not just a social analysis.

 

One example I feel I could relate this to, and your OP is this skit from Tales of Symphonia 2 (it's just a few seconds, no worries)

 

Starting from 1:13 through 1:51

 

[video=youtube]

 

it's a skit where one of the main characters comes to the realization that someone who she thought caused suffering for her family was a human being herself with her own past and present and wasn't just a random person with an ambition to cause pain. And then when you continue listening until 1:35, another main character comes up with one of many quotes I feel that a lot of people can relate to, even in a forum like this:

 

"We all play the starring roles in our own stories. When those other than ourselves appear on stage, we tend to view them only as minor characters." - Tenebrae

 

Almost anything we experience, whether it's a video game or just talking with others, it's really about findings your own set of words based on what you grabbed and listened to from those sources. And when you continue striving to find more words, you start seeing them as things to live by, and it only gets better because there's always some way for words to pierce into a person's psyche. It's about gathering bits and creating your own religion, or creating your own belief system I should say, because being able to cherry-pick things you prefer (both good and bad) and constantly upgrading it with more is how we evolve mentally in this and anything we do in life.

 

 

No, I like a good analogy; they aren't used enough now a days; though I find myself using them maybe a tad too much. There's is one thing I can draw from this, maybe the guides section of the site could use an overhaul. Perhaps we need more guides which present similar ideas but in different formats, and vice versa. I feel there's a lot of repetition of ideas, which would be okay were they all presented from different perspectives. And when new ideas are formulated, they generally stray close to the originals. And only because the person may fear being ridiculed for a new idea that may seem outrageous.

 

Examples and analogies are probably the only way to really solidify the meaning behind words. And yes, I find a lot of people probably just reading snippets of other guides and just making a watered-down version of that same guide and calling it a guide without them actually taking time to give their own definition and opinions. And I feel that making a guide that gets recognized by others is a milestone for users, but aiming just for that shouldn't make us try and rush our ways through. (I'm a hypocrite for saying that because that's how it was with my Motivational Tulpa Guide, but I am aiming for something that goes a bit deeper than that because I feel I evolved tremendously from it, but just couldn't find the right words, even though people seemed to be okay with what I gave at the time).

 

So if you're using examples too much, that's not a bad thing, and if people complain about you using examples, it's just them reading it and automatically predicting what you're trying to get at. However, there's going to be people that really understand you better from those examples and analogies and aren't so snobby and think they're know-it-alls.

 

 

 

If we are going to assume that a lot of people wont have the sense to stand back and create a person over view, we have to assume that the information we present to them obviously is never going to be one size fits all. This is, of course, asking a lot of the community—''MOAR GUIDES!''—though I can't help but point out that guides relating to... let use imposition for example, are all of similar length, topic, method, and language. Bar maybe the photo method, and one other I'm forgetting.

 

Exactly, that's the right mindset (the "things not being a one-size-fits-all"), because no matter how much we know about these concepts and our experiences with them, our lessons learned from them couldn't possibly be the totality of what everyone can do. There are some rudiments people can use as a starting point, but again, fostering the idea (an example like making a disclaimer when making a guide):

 

"In this guide, I provide my personal opinions of what I've learned and experienced throughout all of this. My experiences alone does not imply that you should follow the guide word for word, but I hope that the content within it shows that you can develop your own sets of principles to live by and always strive to learn more. Take my ideas and concepts as a supplement for your own progress in doing this, and continue to learn from others and analyze the pros and cons."

 

Just mentioning that alone are words people can get that the community is not people who say "YOU MUST FOLLOW THIS OR YOU MUST LISTEN TO MY TONES OR YOU FAIL" but rather is a community of people who say "I can't possibly know all there is for this, and I don't know where it will take me, but I am willing to give it a try, and you should too by finding yourself and what you think is right and wrong."

 

Point being, just making implications itself is what I feel is one step towards changing the community. People have to really analyze themselves before they can start understanding what they're living by. One by one, each experience and each person that aims to give well-thought out responses and into guide-making is what prevents Echo Chambers. That's just my personal opinion.

 

 

I'm going to be incredibly big headed, vain, and proud here, and say that Pruria's guide is a very good example. The idea was fresh, it was outrageous and completely against the gut of the grain. It was also presented in a semi-professional, semi-casual tone; much different to the very scientific approach most strive for. And it was revived well enough, and I actually seen a newbie about two weeks later correcting themselves to say 'host deafness' as opposed to 'vocality'. And my point is that despite how well it was received, I'd say a hefty lump of people didn't recive it well because it was very long, or the tone didn't suit them, or the information was presented in an insufficient way. And though, I'm assuming that others don't do this, which they do, they just don't do it often enough.

 

And you have every right to believe that Pruria's guide was something that you enjoyed and truly admired. However, I'm sure Pruria would want anyone to just see their guide as a supplement, and not taken to absolute law. So their guide was the catalyst for you hoping others would give the thought-out explanations that also had a feeling as if their words felt the most like home to us.

 

So based on what you stated, you want guides where people show they went through pain and suffering with the confusion that comes with climbing over the barriers of insanity and such and were able to battle it through and come out stronger individuals with stronger tulpas. These are the people that appear to be most confident, but you can tell they are genuinely confident because they give the tone that they're aiming to keep learning and not intentionally being one-sided.

 

 

 

 

 

 

And looking at that list, I can see you've written three guides, so I hope that maybe give you something to think about or something you can say to prove me wrong. I secretly hope I'm right, that would at least show that there's a chance newbies don't just skip the guides section and go straight to irc.

 

I'm kind of confused on this, I feel like it was a mix of nudging my back and saying "you should make more guides yourself based on what you made so far," and another nudging where you're saying "You're probably making some super-guide in secret, and you're just being patient before you release it and wow us with your own thoughts where you encourage people to find solace in their own principles."

 

I don't know, that's what it felt like to me. :P Please correct me if I misinterpreted that. :)

 

It's funny, I initially thought that your post would be in opposition of mine, but I found myself agreeing with more or less all of it. And that's not to say it hasn't made me think; I've a few more things to ponder on now. Once again, cred for the epic long post, and now creds for presenting your ideas in possibly of the best formats I've seen on this site. (And no, I'm not just saying that because it's agreeing with the OP, what kind of biased wierdo do you take me for?)

 

Yeah, IRCs can be a social clusterbang where those who make the first wave of aggression and can get others to join them (whether it's joining them out of fear of not being bullied by them, or whatever). And when people get so caught into gaining acceptance from a system like that, in my opinion, it's just about avoiding those people in the first place and realizing you and your tulpa creates the ultimate source of introspection and knowing a sense of self. And when you can learn from those moments that make you cry, feel painful, etc. and can still put a smile on your face, that's when this social group thing becomes petty and the least of our concerns. Then you make an ambition that if we want to have a practical social haven in this community, people have to realize their opinions is mostly based on conjecture, so we can't imply that everything is solved and is irrefutable.

 

It's that type of mentality where people know they could be wrong in doing this, but with working with others, we will eventually trigger practical approaches that leads to practical results. And even with that there's always more to learn that can get the same result, or even a better one. This is why no matter how powerful we become mentally and emotionally as we build a deeper bond with our tulpa, we still need other people's perspectives of things, and then going back to ourselves. Rinse, lather, repeat. It's a constant back-and-forth process of learning, just like the google analogy I was using.

 

And that ''Which is why you don't see many of those "greats" really commenting as much. '' Comment made me chuckle, much more than I should have.

 

 

Oh you.

[Oguigi]

I don't go on the IRC much, when i do go their it's mostly a positive experience on my part. And i get to speak to a friend every now and then.

 

I haven't notice anything yet, but am not surprised that there's a dark side to the IRC.

[Guest]

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[G+3]

LZ!!! AAAAUGGGHHH.

 

I've seen posts.

Lots of them.

BUT FUCK ALL if you're not the most loquacious person on this entire forum.

 

 

On that note, brb 10 years, gotta read another post from linkzelda 4 info

 

 

Xeare, plz.

[Linkzelda]

You know what amazes me, here I thought with the potential you have with your tulpa with processing information, it would be prevalent in some people's posts. But something tells me they either keep it a secret because they're afraid of the TL ; DR and snobby comments with added euphemism, or maybe people aren't really using what they're imagining what tulpa can do for them. Nearly all of my comments has some collaboration with my tulpa without me wondering about their state of being vocal, almost as if I'm just proxying their thoughts. And I figured that if people actually wanted to pierce into the problem like what was stated in the OP, we would actually have to use our brains for once and expect something a bit longer than usual than those sporadic and laconic phrases that somehow is considered as one of many probable solutions to the problem.

 

At the same time, I don't want to become egotistical, and I admit I'm just going through the cognitive bias like Coughal stated. I guess my tulpa were right after all with the majority of people's lack of faith or lack of confidence in just stating what they feel is right (at the time). The same goes for the OP's intention of preventing echo chambers, when at the same time, their own habits of naturally shutting down well-thought-out responses that actually attempts to make one of many solutions to the problem....it's so ironic. It's really ironic, and I feel that's another thing people need to get over...these " TL ; DR." I would presume that as you continue developing some confidence in yourself and your tulpa, you would eventually be able to have a decent way of explaining things a bit further, and reading longer things.

 

[it seems all this hype of secondhand eidetic memory and higher levels of processing information and memories is expectations people can't strive for anymore. It almost disheartens me, it really does. But maybe Xeare is just going through that because now he has to chance to sublimate whatever aggression he had with people who thought he was senseless before (even though he's not). But if you have to do that, then do that, but when you're over it, come back and hopefully add some substance to this thread, Xeare.]

[Guest]

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