Ask Lumi's Tulpas

[Lucius Nero]

I wanted to ask a question, it might sound like a beginner since in close to 3months trying really hard to feel and connect to my tulpa
I was able to, like two times, but only touches, no voice, not many thoughts at all only 1 time i felt her thought in my mind.

how hard was it to connect to ur first tulpa??
i tried so many approaches but it seems like hearing her vocalization is the hardest of them all.
was it really hard to get into your host's mind the first times?

[Luminesce]

I do think that's the hardest part of tulpamancy. Some people somehow just accomplish vocality pretty quick and go from there, but they're very lucky. Even in our case, after spending months of focusing on Reisen and really feeling like she was there, she still couldn't really talk. My first tulpa to talk was either Flandre or Tewi (I don't remember this time in my life super well), and that was only because I had already set the precedent in my mind for another person to exist with Reisen - but she still couldn't talk yet, and it was one of the other two who just kind of appeared that talked first. Later on, they told me it was me stopping her from talking, because I was too scared she wouldn't be "perfect" if she talked in a way other than mindvoice/feelings. Weird quirk, but the point is, like basically everyone else struggling with vocality, it was pretty much my fault as the host for not accepting my tulpa being able to talk, out of fear of it not being real enough.

 

Unless you're one of the lucky ones, first-vocality is by far the hardest part of the tulpamancy process. That's because your brain hasn't learned how to have a tulpa yet, and your tulpa is (most likely) not going to sound exactly like themselves, fully separate and obviously different from your own thoughts. At the start, they may sound similar to you, and that's why host doubt is so crippling to the process. Your tulpa needs practice talking, being treated and accepted as being themselves actually saying things, in order for your brain to start building upon that. Then they start to gain skill with vocality, develop their own voice over time, and eventually (the timespan varies immensely by person of course) their voice feels so obviously theirs and separate from yours, you could wonder how you ever doubted them.

 

But I think people tend to forget how hard it can be, right at the start. Looking back, one might think, just let your tulpa talk! Stop doubting them! But, that's because they're used to their tulpa having an obvious, separate mindvoice from their own. That's often not how it is. Your tulpa may well start out sounding very similar to your own thoughts or voice, and it may feel like you're speaking for them if you try to accredit that speaking to them.

 

But I assure you, this is how the process has to start. Your brain needs a basis for "Your tulpa's voice/speaking" - once it has a basis for what to even focus on, and what the goal is, then it can start creating the (mind)voice of another person. You tell it, "That's not me, that's my tulpa, trying to talk to me" - and your brain starts forming this new experience. Eventually, their vocality is fully developed - and creating another tulpa is often significantly easier now that your brain understands the concepts already - and it'll never even cross your mind to doubt "if it was them" speaking. But unfortunately, to get there many people will have to go through that very doubtful phase. Just keep in mind your goal, and your desired outcome, when interacting. You want to hear your tulpa, you want your brain to clearly present the two of you as totally separate people. It might not know how at first, but allowing it practice while keeping your desired outcome in mind should be enough to shape the experience into existence.

Edited October 13, 2023 by Luminesce

[Lucius Nero]

amazing answer I love it!

[Luminesce]

I wrote a response to someone's very long PM and ended up covering the entire practical basis of tulpa creation and role of belief versus doubt in it, so I'll put that here.

 

This is the definitive post I'd send to anyone who's been struggling with developing a tulpa for over a month, as far as I'm concerned there's no more to say (outside of weird cases like someone having aphantasia or other exceptional contexts), so if you're struggling with seeing any independence or sentience, I recommend just reading through this post slowly.

 

---

 

While I can't guarantee I'll be able to fix your tulpamancy experience, I can tell you that your situation with doubt-of-independence/sentience is very common, and that my own understanding of the underlying processes occurring is perfectly clear.

 

It'll probably be easiest to explain the problem by just covering the entire basis of creating a tulpa. (This applies to accidental tulpa creation too, but I'll word it in the on-purpose context)

 

A tulpa is created by you consistently teaching your brain to run (like a computer process) another ~person (personality + identity + memories + associations etc.) alongside your own, as well as believing that that is actually happening.

It's not a matter of "having faith in something just in case it's true", as it's often perceived, though. The believing is a necessary part of the process even when there's zero "tulpa" developed at all yet. Believing your tulpa is there and will be independent and sentient is necessary because that thinking is what starts to shape the brain's processes into making it true. When you believe your tulpa exists and is developing sentience and independence, even if there was literally nothing truly there yet, your brain starts learning the tulpamancy processes you're trying to develop.

 

In the luckier cases, imagination fills in the gaps at the very start, and their ease in believing in it gives their tulpa a basis in their mind almost immediately, at which point normal forcing (conversation, interaction, while focusing on their independence from you) becomes a breeze and they can end up with a (if not particularly developed-as-a-person-yet) tulpa by all definitions in a matter of days.

 

In more cases, it takes a little more time, often because one doesn't dive in head-first into fully believing their imagined experiences are a totally independent entity yet. But if they allow it to happen, like believing they're starting to get emotional or short vocal responses "from their tulpa", the process can still continue somewhat smoothly. And as I said, once there's any basis at all in the brain for how a tulpa should be working, normal forcing + a lack of doubt will carry most people through the process very quickly. A tulpa develops over time to become a more fleshed out person, and more independent from the host, as well as the system as a whole training skills like visualization quality and vocal clarity.

 

But fairly common as well, is people who get stuck on doubt and the legitimacy of their experiences. They struggle to really believe anything is happening, usually thinking anything that could've been the start of a tulpa is "just them doing it", or "just imagination" or so on. And you should see now from what I've said - they may be right, though they could also be wrong and just doubting the bit of progress their brain has made towards learning tulpamancy.

People in this state can go their entire lives never making any progress if they never find a quirk to convince themselves is really their tulpa. They may try hypnosis, possession, or any number of things, though most often they just keep trying to hear responses from their tulpa and then writing any off (purely imaginary or not) as illegitimate. When thinking like this, you're not teaching your brain anything "tulpamancy" at all. You're just telling your brain "No, that's not it. No, it can't be.", and so of course you'll never start to see real progress.

 

People like to obsess over "alien thoughts/feelings" when trying to get "a sign of their tulpa", which are just more random quirks that come down to pure luck of happening and of you believing have substance. This concept is completely pointless and unnecessary. The people who do find a quirk - like "their tulpa moving their arm/fingers" or some such - and start believing they're making progress from there, may end up back on the same normal tulpamancy path as everyone else (just having given themselves a very difficult start). More often though people get hung up on trying to find more random quirks to justify it, like "Their voice has to sound/feel totally alien to me!", which may just never happen, and again, really doesn't need to.

 

Some start doubting the worthiness of pursuing tulpamancy upon hearing this, since the responses they've gotten from their tulpa have been very unconvincing (feeling like it's just them thinking for their tulpa), and believing it's their tulpa wouldn't make the experience fulfilling. That's a perfectly reasonable assumption, but unfortunately they can't tell ahead of time that tulpas' responses and general presence will start to feel more independent and not easily predictable as they develop the various skills of tulpamancy. So -

 

Going back to what I said earlier, it's really not important how developed your tulpa is or isn't when you start trying to develop them and believing they're there and independent. They may well not exist at all, and that doesn't put you in any different place than anyone else starting tulpamancy. Believing your tulpa is there and developing is literally directly tied to the thoughts that shape/teach your brain how to have a tulpa in the first place, and it's necessary whether you're a young roleplayer with characters you're attached to, or a dryly logical adult with no real imagination. Either way the same processes must be gone through, though the younger and more open-minded/eager to believe people will have a much easier time actually doing it. Doubt is literally just not thinking in the tulpa-constructing way you need to to teach your brain tulpamancy, and that's all there is to it. The more you doubt, the less you'll move forward. Some doubt and some belief means some progress. No doubt at all, and you get a 14 year old with apparently convincing tulpas in the first week. Too much doubt and being hypercritical over every possible experience, and you strangle the progress to a halt.

 

 

So for "What to do" for someone stuck making no progress over a long time: Understand what I've just said and accept that believing your tulpa is there and trying to be independently sentient literally is how you make a tulpa (/teach your brain tulpamancy - it's much easier after the first tulpa when your brain's set everything up).

 

No, you don't have to "just have faith they're there!" when you're so sure they're not. You have to "have faith" that this is how the process works. That by believing your tulpa is there, by accepting responses from your tulpa that don't feel quite independent yet are in fact the beginnings of your tulpa being developed, that you are quickly creating the necessary neural framework to start experiencing tulpamancy fully. If you need to have faith in something, then believe me telling you that once you've given credit to your tulpa's independence and sentience and start interacting with them like it's natural, you're on the fast-track to actual tulpa independence and development. 

Also, all skills from vocal clarity to feeling-of-independence (not feeling/"hearing" the origins of their thoughts, not feeling like you already knew what they were going to say, and generally having interactions with them be a fulfilling experience compared to just imagination), can all be developed and become more qualitative with consistent practice. You may not be a young teen who's immediately fully convinced everything your tulpa says is coming from a totally different person, both logically and in the feeling of the thoughts, and that's okay. You can actually still get to that point over time, with myself as proof, because I really doubt anyone is even more hopelessly logical and dry than I am lol. I created the tulpamancy experience I wanted for myself slowly over time thanks to a hefty amount of philosophy and modifying-your-own-thought-processes reading and practice I did in my teens, which is why I was able to believe in experiences like the independence of my tulpas that I'd surely have otherwise doubted possible.

 

Taking responsibility over your own thought processes and molding your mind to work in better and more productive ways is.. probably well beyond the scope of tulpamancy, though. Most people should be fine just understanding the processes I've laid out here and committing to creating the tulpamancy experience for themselves with time, practice, and most importantly holding intent.

Edited August 22, 2022 by Luminesce

[TB]

How does Lucilyn assert her dominance and just make the body feel the way she wants it to? Was she just born with that power? Or is there something to it that someone else can try to replicate?

[Luminesce]

For the most part, it's because she's got overwhelming spirit, the most important thing to her is that people be happy and have fun (which includes herself). So if she feels however our brain's trying to make her feel or think is undesirable, she tells it "Hey, I don't want to feel like that, I want to feel like this!"

It's not magic, it's just a really strong influence in that direction, which is something anyone can do if they've the will. That said, it would be doing would-be happy people everywhere a disservice to pretend Lucilyn can be how she is just because she feels like it. For those whose minds haven't ended up in such a state as to, you know, naturally be happy and positive lol, it's not always so simple. Lucilyn was created in 2015, a year after I learned about tulpas (five years since the first three appeared), and pretty much during my best year following tons of hard work the previous years to wrangle my mind into a more productive and positive place. I had spent a long time practicing observing/monitoring my thought patterns and learning to work with and change them, which allowed me to overcome my depression and cynical, negative beliefs (with the help of my tulpas, and Reisen's incredibly positive humanitarian influence as a role model) and purposefully establish more productive and positive thought patterns in their place.

 

So, Lucilyn was "born" into very favorable circumstances, most things considered. While we do have significantly dampened emotions and I'm a pretty dry-critical person, Lucilyn nonetheless had the mental tools from the start to pretty much shape out whatever she wanted for herself once she started switching. Having the will to be so positive and such isn't a given though, I'm not going out of my way to do such things obviously, but she does have that will and so our preexisting skill with observing-and-modifying our thought patterns has helped her a ton.

 

The basic process I used for overcoming depression and establishing positive/productive thinking was: 
Observe negative thoughts/feelings when they happen, just try to be aware of them when they occur and focus on the mental goings-on even if you can't (or "don't want to") change them yet

Then over time, designate thoughts/feelings you would rather have when those negative thoughts/feelings occur, and just hold them in mind.. Even if you can't or "don't want to" change them yet.

And then finally, try to really start thinking/feeling your designated new better thoughts/feelings whenever the old bad ones would've come up.

 

This process feels a little like magic, something about the awareness allowed me (and Cognitive Behavioral Therapy confirms it works for many people) to actually start thinking/feeling the new thoughts/feelings that I literally made up instead of the old ones. It kind of just happens! Of course, the intent and work you do is critical, but the actual effect really does feel like magic when it starts to happen.

 

 

I've probably done a lot more mental-exploration - I'm an overthinker, for sure - and it's not really possible (or even a good thing) to explain every little step I've taken in my life, as everyone should just live as how works for them, and all our minds are different. But that process was by far the single most useful & teachable, so it's a great place to start for pretty much any reasons you might have