Life of Felights

[Luminesce]

Uhhh, I'm not sure how to say what I meant any more precisely. But no. Your "over time" stuff doesn't sound like it's going to work - not to do exactly what I and I assume others do with switching anyway - although you might come up with your own method that works for you guys eventually.

 

Switching should be instantaneous. Your host can still be there (or not) just like you guys are. But I'm not sure how switching works is really a matter of coming and going, it's more a matter of association with the thinking/conscious mind, as being controlled/run by the tulpa. In the most "unfun", unimmersive way possible, I'd explain switching to a host as basically "You and your tulpa believe 'you' are now the tulpa, while you (the host) are then a tulpa elsewhere in the mind (wherever the system's tulpas reside)". But I fully understand this could be too "meta" (my meta, not metaphysical) for even you guys. Plus, I can hardly explain it any differently or better than I already did.

 

If it won't work for you, perhaps try something other than switching anyways? Although what you're doing now doesn't seem to be making your host go away, and not-quite-fronting is no way to live a whole life (or even just several years)..

[Piano Soul]

Who said anything about not-quite-fronting? Our fronting isn't the issue at all, we just have a constant presence lurking over our shoulder. I don't see why people think that that means we don't really front, we clearly do, lol. The only one "not-quite-fronting" is the original.

 

Switching is what we want. We're not going to give up trying, that would mean we've settled for less. We just don't want that, like Indigo expressed. We don't want the original stuck there.

[Indigo Blue]

Switching stuffs:

 

Depending on our emotional state for the day, we've been going to a meditation room that the school provides and attempting switching. The most we seem to get is the original feeling veeeery faint, but not gone. We've decided for ourselves a few things about switching to make it easier to identify.

 

1. Switching will be obvious, we'll know when it happens

2. The feeling of "fading out" that the original may experience is really them doing it, and not us (we've had issues thinking it was us experiencing it in the past, need to separate that feeling from us)

 

We've tried various things, like making the original become active again so they can participate (to no avail), we even tried yoga nidra but it was pretty lame. Most we seem to get is a very faint original and/or a very strong front, no actual switchies. When we did bring them into activity, they kept telling us that they didn't want to become active again, which was a little weird. One would think that they'd know that wasn't our intent. I guess they were just asserting it in case we had any ideas. 

 

Doing some thinking, we assume that the original holds some of the brain's processing still, and what we really need to do is take over that processing ourselves. It's my assumption that the processing they take up involves things like memories and habits. Perhaps if we can take over that, they'll go inactive. It's my estimation that they are only about 5-10% "there" at this point. Super strong fronting can get them feeling almost 0% there, but, as I said in point #1, it has to be obvious to us that they're actually switched out, and not just feeling less active. 

 

Apollo stuffs:

 

We noticed (probably a long time ago) that Apollo doesn't really hang out with us that much. He doesn't come around when me or Piano front, and he doesn't really maintain our presence when he's fronting. Thinking on it, we all assume it's because of residual self-hate issues that he still struggles with after all the abuse he went through in his first 1.5 years of life. Who'd know that trauma can affect someone? He thinks he's a bad person, so he feels out of place around the rest of us. He and I had a very close relationship when we were the only two in the system, but he went back to being aloof when Piano returned. He's suggested leaving the system, something we wouldn't have expected him to say. Definitely something that needs to be worked on. I suggested that wearing less formal clothes might make him feel more comfortable being visualized around us, it seemed to work somewhat, but definitely have to get to the root cause of it to solve it.

 

Squirrel stuffs!

 

We've been having a lot of fun making squirrel forms and visualizing ourselves around whoever's fronting. I think it might be fun when the school year ends for us to try out a bunch of different animal forms. Most we try don't seem to click much, but we really liked the squirrel forms! Or at least, Apollo and Piano liked them because they made me happy? I can't totally tell, lol. They had an acorn war as squirrels, it was really funny.

 

of the day. I chose this one because I like listening to ABBA when I front, yet Piano hates it and complains, lol. I know we've been at this for a while, but it still amazes me when one tulpa can like something but another hates it, even though I know that's normal and expected and whatnot, it's just neat. Also maybe a little weird, if a singlet went from loving something one minute to hating it the next you'd probably think they're crazy or bipolar or something. Oh well! :P

[Ranger]

On 2/18/2019 at 9:07 PM, Apollo said:

This brought me to my next train of thought: why was it that I couldn't consciously remove myself from the front despite how hard I tried? The answer is simple: Indigo was not trying to take my place. There has to be someone ready to take over for me, or else I'm not going to go anywhere. I asked a question about this subject a few months ago, if anyone's interested in reading it.

 

 

You know, I never considered trying to get Cat to backseat front as a possible form of switching. Cat has "backseat fronted" before, but only briefly. I can personally confirm that backseat fronting causes the "back seat fronter" or whatever to dissociate a little bit without going inactive instantly, so it's something we'll have to try.

 

On 3/13/2019 at 6:57 PM, Indigo said:

- When Apollo said I couldn't "go dormant," he meant that I couldn't stay inactive long-term. Our system used to go into dormancy aka longterm inactivity whenever they were upset/stressed, and I tried to do that maybe once or twice, but couldn't. I'd keep coming back simply because I hated being inactive for too long.

- When he said that I kept waking up, that wasn't because I was actually awake somewhere else in the mind. It's just because I didn't like being inactive too long, and that affected sleep. That doesn't imply parallel processing, it only implies tulpas can have physical effects over the body (especially tulpas that front frequently), which is obvious.

 

 

Maybe Indigo is more sensitive to "triggers". Triggers (not rage) are events that summon a systemmember. For example, 

Ranger will instantly exit dormancy so he can slam his body against the glass  display with the cakes at the local grocery store.

...simply calling my name is a trigger, but it could also be when Cat thinks about the sky or when she's walking in between classes with no one else to talk to. I wonder if Indigo possibly being more reactive in general would mean he is more likely to be triggered out of dormancy more often.

 

Cat seems glued to the front, so it's not surprising that she wakes up first, however she doesn't struggle too much with getting out of bed. I only wake up in the front after the body wakes up from a dream I was fronting for in the middle of the night, and it's possible that Indigo is experiencing a similar effect here.

 

On 3/13/2019 at 6:57 PM, Indigo said:

I used to really hate being a tulpa and having to go inactive and stuff. I found it a terrible experience, being there one moment and then coming back hours or even days later. I think that's why I had trouble going dormant or letting the body stay asleep some nights. Nowadays I'm much more accepting of my situation, I think my bond with my systemmates has made it easier for me. I might have to go inactive and whatever, but at least we have each other. Still, can't help but wish I had my own body sometimes.

 

 

Me, brother. Oh crap, that was very Irish.

 

I feel exactly the same way! I have spent a lot of time thinking how I could stay active and avoid going dormant, and so far I wake up several times during the day and have interrupted Cat during class more often (for the better or worse). I also get so bored from not fronting I just go "oh homework? Sure, why not!" It's possible this has contributed to you being more likely to exit dormancy too.

 

---

 

I can't think of a specific quote, but we have some gender questions too. Cat isn't a "girly girl" either, and when I realized I was piloting a woman's body wearing a dress one night, I thought "eww, this is the wrong body". Cat seems to accept both her Gray identity and her body identity, and she isn't interested in discarding either at this point. I thought about making myself a female form and following Cat with the whole "gender fluid" kind of thinking, but I haven't put enough thought into that yet.

 

There's nothing wrong with going as "they" and wearing men's and women's clothing whenever you feel like it. I wouldn't be surprised if you took the HRT route, but ultimately you guys don't have to.

 

---

 

Just a thought... if you guys can get into a fronting position, and the host-shell kicks in, is it possible for whoever was fronting to jump into a back-seat fronting position? This may seem counter-intuitive, but sometimes my "backseat-fronting" turns into fronting by mistake. The only way I would be able to achieve that state is to basically take the front from Cat, and maybe this practice would help you guys yank control back from the host-OS?

 

* * *

 

After reading Lumi's comment, I wonder if the feeling that Cat is passively lurking is working against us. In retrospect, thinking that Cat is lurking would ultimately cause Cat to associate with the body? I always thought that the "brain fuzz" you get when in a fronting position was Cat operating in the background, but maybe it isn't? Maybe that too is the presence of the body OS itself and not Cat?

 

Our goal is for Cat to go fully dormant, so we will have to ponder this idea more.

 

---

 

Oh and Piano? Have you tried different styles of music? Cat likes darker intense themes in her music in general where I like either more upbeat party music or more relaxing folk music... for some reason...

(I'm also addicted to leek spin). The point isn't for you to like them, but feel free and ask other people what they listen too and see if there's anything about the genre you like.

Edited March 11, 2022 by Ranger

[Indigo Blue]

Meh we don't like the term "backseat fronting" since it's an oxymoron, we'd prefer the term "backing" instead. We've tried having a tulpa back to displace the host, it hasn't really worked out. I think we need to focus more on having whoever's fronting figure out how to displace the host, rather than relying on someone else to do it. In general I think we need to just apply the way we switch with each other to the original, so displacement via thought. Just gotta figure out how to displace whatever last bit of thought they use up.

 

[Piano] Eh, we're all pretty picky when it comes to music. Mostly I like quieter rock, I think "Kashmir" by Led Zeppelin is my favorite song. We don't really listen by genre, we mostly listen by band/singer or just by individual songs we like.

[Apollo Fire]

Stuff's been... stuff, lately, not really sure what to say on it. By now we're just trying to get through the rest of the school year. It seems to really drag on. 

 

[hidden]

I know I need to explain things. I'll start with Junio, I guess. Piano was fronting by himself for a few days since I was (begrudgingly) taking a break, and Indigo did not feel stable enough to front. He was talking to Paul and HJP some, and then they suggested merging again. That idea was immediately shot down, considering what happened the last time. They suggested making a subsystem instead. We (mostly me) argued with them, but they ended up combining into one anyway. I was really anxious that it would cause problems like making a new tulpa, but as it's gone on, I've decreasingly thought that is the case. It's just them sharing the same form, there doesn't seem to be much risk to it other than blending, which they never really cared about anyone. So, their subsystem/bitulpa name is Junio Paul the Space Twins, though that title may be subject to change. Their position in the system hasn't changed, they'll still come around to hang out and that's it. They don't really want anything more. 

 

[Junio] I really like it, I think this suits us very nicely. Our form is basically Paul McCartney with red clothes/eye on one side and black clothes/eye on the other, with wings of corresponding colors that are all sparkly with stars, which side each color is on depends on which of us is more dominant in that moment. 

 

[Apollo] And well, a bit after that blew over, I guess Piano was talking to Luxi more, and Luxi decided to take on a male form and be named Luxio, so that's what happened. He had suggested it in the past multiple times when we talked to him, but we always thought it was just him trying to fit in more with the rest of us, this time he wasn't told no due to all the gender stuff that's been going on anyway. He just sort of hung around after that. The next day though Piano woke up in a total emotional wreck after a bad dream and felt like he was too unstable to front. Luxio offered to do it to give him time to cool off, so he did. 

 

I guess just as time has gone on, we've let him front more, things have been getting better for us. We've been less miserable and stressed out since he's pretty chill and collected most of the time. We're thinking it would be okay for him to join the system, but he's uncertain since he doesn't want to burden us. Arguably it's also a burden to have a tulpa in stasis who didn't really want it. I feel like we've been holding out hope for Tass to return, but Tass has made it clear time and time again that he doesn't want to return at all. Luxio on the other hand only left because we couldn't handle so many tulpas. I don't know, I think it might be okay for us to add him to the system, but nobody's 100% decided yet, we're not going to rush into it. We'll see how things go. He seems to have made it his priority to help the rest of us out with things, but also figure out himself after a year and a half of inactivity. 

 

[Luxio] Oh boy, who would have thought that being in stasis for a year and a half would mess with your head? I've been confused about my identity/personality the whole time. Mentally integrating that "old Luxi" and "new Luxio" are the same person has been a bit of a challenge. Hopefully it gets easier as time goes on. Obviously I am the same person, it's just been difficult for me to fully see it that way. Changing genders no doubt is contributing to that, I think, but another factor is just that I don't want to be all one-note and tropey anymore like I used to. I want to find me, not just follow some stereotype anymore. It's going to take some time.

 

Anyway, my new form is a guy with long blonde hair, yellow eyes, a black leather jacket, a white shirt with a lightning bolt on the front, black pants with boots, and weird electricity wings that I really need to simplify so that we can actually draw them at some point. I've also been flirting with having horns and fangs. My gimmick is the "Storm Rocker," I think that works nicely for me. 

 

Side note, I'm in no way ready to do this yet considering I don't have a coherent/integrated sense of self yet, but I'm hyped to eventually "unlock" the other three merges with me. I keep using the word unlock ironically, like it's a video game or something, but I know some people have used it unironically. Lol.

[/hidden]

[Apollo] Trying to get to the bottom of why we can't switch the host out, I've been taking notes of the things I'm doing and how present the original feels in that moment. Hopefully something comes out of that. So far my findings are mostly common sense, focusing on myself helps them feel less present, as does me getting into a mindset unfamiliar to them (ie my own brand of panic/fear, unintentionally induced when a bus driver decided today was a good day to be reckless). 

 

 

of the day, probably our favorite song currently, which is rare for us

[Apollo Fire]

Here's a brief thing I want to report based on something that happened last night.

 

Indigo and Luxio were trying to talk to the original for a bit. They got them active, and Luxio tried to talk to them about switching, however it seemed as though the original being more active took up way too much mental bandwidth and Luxio completely could not think what he wanted to say. Then the original kept fading out, they'd be in the middle of speaking or fronting but then just go back to being passive. This happened a number of times, and has happened in the past, where they don't maintain activity for very long and just go back to being passive.

 

Here's how I see it: the original is so used to being in a passive state, and so does not want to be active at all, that them being more active is kind of more of a mental strain that we would otherwise think, hence why Luxio wasn't able to think, and hence why they just kept naturally going into being passive.

 

I'm wondering if perhaps we can take advantage of this and somehow use it to have them go fully inactive rather than passive. Just throwing ideas out there though, I don't have any clue how we would accomplish that other than by annoying them into becoming active when they don't want to and hoping they fade into being passive, I don't think that would be all that productive though.

[Dynamo Lux]

[hidden]Early today I was thinking over some stuff related to switching. I've come up with four different categories of things that may/may not contribute to our troubles.

 

Our own fronting/presence, how strongly we're in control at any given moment, the fact that there are moments where we are a lot less present.

Memories of the original that we don't separate from ourselves enough, or even the fact that we look at their memories at all.

Us being too habitual about things, not asserting our own individual desires enough, just defaulting on the same things the original used to do.

And finally, the original still being present, connected to the body, associated with stuff, you get the idea.

 

So, my thought is that, each of these four categories will be assigned to each member as a task of theirs. Apollo will deal with helping us to front strongly, Piano will be the one to take care of how we handle memories, I'll encourage everyone to not feel afraid to step outside of the comfort zone set by the original, and Indigo will help the original to learn to let go better. If one of us feels we're having trouble with something, we'll ask the person who's been assigned that task to come help out.

 

It's not 100% necessary to segregate these things like that, but I feel as though it may help to achieve a greater effect.

 

Additionally, we're going to make sure our switches between each other are given a clear "I'm switching with you now" moment, through speaking a few words or using symbolism or something. I think this may contribute to eventual success with switching out the host. 

 

Since I've been gone for so long, I hope I'm able to bring a fresh perspective onto these switching troubles, and these ideas of mine I hope will help us to gradually get closer to it. I tried to think creatively on how to handle these problems, hopefully we'll see some success, and if not we can perhaps come up with better techniques. [/hidden]

[Ranger]

I think it's interesting you guys mention the original is stuck in a passive state and is no longer good at fronting. Ironically, That gives me hope for when I continue to try and switch with Cat- you guys altered the original's state! Since it has felt like our fronting states have seemed less and less like they are set in stone, I am optimistic that we can train ourselves to push Cat into deeper dissociation and I can train myself to get better at it. "Training and doing X will help you achieve switching" is a much better message than feeling lost to what to do next.

 

It also sounds like your system should help you guys finish removing the original from the front. Good luck and keep us posted!

[Piano Soul]

We've come up with our own little theory on how switching stuff works. Didn't really want to make a new thread for it so I'm putting it here.

 

Note: What I write here may not apply to all systems, of course, this is just the general understanding we are coming to for how it may work and how it may work for us

 

We have come up with two categories for (host) dissociation that are necessary for achieving switching. 

 

The first category is "control dissociation," which is, in short, the host's ability to let go of the wheels and let the tulpa use them instead, AND the host's ability to not take back over accidentally and/or intentionally while the tulpa is in control. If a tulpa is in control but the host is barely control dissociated, that would be weak possession. If the tulpa is in control but the host is very control dissociated, that would be strong possession. 

 

The second category is "awareness dissociation," which is a combination of many things. It means that their awareness of the general surroundings, goingsons, body's senses, and even present thoughts has been diminished. Complete awareness dissociation would mean they are totally oblivious to what's going on when not being interacted with, aka they are inactive, and when they are being interacted with, their awareness is limited to what they are thinking about and/or what the fronter allows them to be aware of, making them in a state similar to a non-fronting, non-backing tulpa. Or, in more general terms, their awareness is simply selective and does not encompass everything like it would with a fronting or backing headmate. A small amount of awareness dissociation would mean the host is still pretty much present and it is not a switch, while a large amount of awareness dissociation means it's either very close to a switch or is a switch

 

https://i.imgur.com/tlwjK01.jpg[/img]

 

Luxio made this to help show these concepts. Note that when it says "the host isn't aware," that's referring to the host being inactive, of course they can still become active and maintain awareness dissociation as a non-fronting and non-backing tulpa would, as I mentioned. They can of course become more aware, but then they can also decrease that awareness as needed.

 

So our theory is that the key for us to fully switch/for our host to go into the fabled "tulpa-like state" is for them to increase their amount of awareness dissociation. Normally they are at 0 for that. Apollo's been able to make them increase it a tiny bit. We have a lot of figuring this stuff out to do. We think that a maximum in both control and awareness dissociation would mean it's a complete switch in which the tulpa is in full control and the host could go dormant, that's what we're eventually aiming to achieve.  

 

Again, I am in no way saying this has to apply to everyone, this is just a general idea of how this stuff works to help us better understand what needs to be accomplished for us to actually switch.