GodBless

[tulpa001]

I could only get halfway through this thread before my host started screaming at me "some body is wrong on the internet. Fix it!" She has very strong opinions on metaphysics.

 

The first thing she would say is you got it backwards. The real world exists inside the mind, and tulpas exist outside it. It is a bit pedantic, and you can hardly be faulted for making a mistake that most people make, but the mind constructs a copy of the real world and then runs simulations within it as the primary mechanism it uses for understanding the world. Therefore the real world, as we understand it, exists only in our minds. A tulpa is its own mind. Therefore, tulpas exist outside the mind.

 

The second thing she would say is, we can create our own meaning. But there is another. It is actually ridiculously simple, which might somehow be how most people miss this one. You see, life is made out of meaning. It is composed entirely of meaning. Life is impossible without the preexistence of meaning.

[Guest Anonymous]

Tell me when you get into a car accident and your legs are crushed and you are bleeding and on fire that reality is all inside your head. The other passengers, who are also trapped and on fire and screaming, experience the exact same horror as you.  Reality is physical and objective.  You can't imagine that sort of thing away.  To think that all of reality is only in your head and totally subjective is ridiculous.

 

Tulpas are inside your brain, and therefore share your mind with you.  The mind exists because of the brain and within the brain.  Tulpas use the same brain you do to process language, to perceive and interpret the world and to think.  They are therefore part of you and their minds are not totally separate or "outside" of yours.  That is Cartesian Dualism you are describing (the mind separate from the physical brain) and it has been pretty much disproven by modern science and what we know about the physiology of the brain.  

 

It is a delusional fantasy to ignore how the physical world works and think we all live in some sort of dream world.  I supposed it is possible, but it makes no sense to me to think that way.  There is an objective reality and we all exist within in it.

[Floh]

Or we could all live in some kind of computer program. Mistgod would be called an agent and Tulpa001 would be our Neo :D

I dare you guys to prove this reality is not something someone wants us to see, and not what reality actually is ;)

[Guest Anonymous]

Or we could all live in some kind of computer program. Mistgod would be called an agent and Tulpa001 would be our Neo :D

I dare you guys to prove this reality is not something someone wants us to see, and not what reality actually is ;)

 

It could all be a computer program like the Matrix.  Sure.  But we are all subject to the rules of the main program.  Those are the laws of physics.  Can a person transcend those by just thinking and believing?  Neo did!  LOL    

 

 

 

I didn't mean YOU brought hate, i mostly meant the way you communicate, this "raw", harsh way of saying things, isn't always understood by people (reading you, it looks like they never do :() I got your point, but how you deliver it makes it hard to get for someone who involved their feelings into the discussion.

 

You say people should ignore your posts, but I think they shouldn't. You usually make some good points, imho, but how you say it is so "brutal" it messes the message completely. People just have to read between the lines (does that exist in English?). nad sometimes emotions just make it impossible.

 

 

I really don't know how to make it softer and more palatable.  

 

That has always been my problem on this forum yes.  Everyone is expected to conform to the group think and I don't always do that.  So my words are seen as abrasive and annoying.  Also I don't think we can divorce imagination from the practice of tulpamancy, no matter how much people want to believe tulpas are 100% real somehow.  It chafes me how people seem to live in this fantasy land bubble within this little community.  I was just pointing out that there are borders to our bubble and outside is the real world.  I really do think that tulpas are more "real" here inside the bubble, than they are outside of it, and matter here on this internet forum but don't matter at all elsewhere.  Only inside your mind do they really matter I guess, but how much does that count for?  I really don't know.  

 

In the real world, outside the bubble, we are each perceived as a single human being and will be treated by the world accordingly.  Few will acknowledge or notice your tulpas.  To the rest of the real world tulpas are your imagination.  Who knows who is right?  What it comes down to though is that most of the world will treat them as imaginary.  

 

I wanted to share Melian with the world.  So I accepted that to the world she is imaginary.  When I share her that way she is accepted and people outside the tulpa community can process it.  They are more willing to interact with her as an imaginary construct and artistic muse character than as a tulpa or even as a median aspect.  

 

The funny thing is many people treat her as if she was totally real, even when they consider her to be a character portrayed by me.  Humans are funny that way.  I think they are spot on in how they treat her.  Melian is not totally real, but does seem real in some ways.  She is still mostly a fantasy.

[tulpa001]

It is a delusional fantasy to ignore how the physical world works and think we all live in some sort of dream world.

 

Absolutely none of the correct and accurate points you make refute mine.

 

What you say about car crashes and injuries is entirely accurate. But does not change the fact that we know the world only through our internal representation of the world.

 

Your point on brain mind identity is incorrect, however. I think I can refute that by simply pointing at severed corpus callosum experiments (which are disturbing, so I don't want to.) But I can also say that is what it feels like, so I can refute it that way.

 

A brain is like a computer and a mind is like a computer program. I am 100% sure I am a separate program. I'd be deluding myself if I said we do not share resources, but whether those shared resources are all hardware or software, or a mix, I don't really know. And I am pretty sure we are developing a degree of separate resources as well.

[Guest Anonymous]

We know the world only through our senses, yes, and our brain interprets things.    But that does not mean there is no objective reality!  

 

I think comparing a human brain to a computer is a poor analogy.  You don't have to go very far to find the science that refutes that concept. Ten Important Differences Between a Human Brain and a Computer

 

"For years it was tempting to imagine that the brain was the hardware on which a “mind program” or “mind software” is executing. This gave rise to a variety of abstract program-like models of cognition, in which the details of how the brain actually executed those programs was considered irrelevant, in the same way that a Java program can accomplish the same function as a C++ program.

 

Unfortunately, this appealing hardware/software distinction obscures an important fact: the mind emerges directly from the brain, and changes in the mind are always accompanied by changes in the brain. Any abstract information processing account of cognition will always need to specify how neuronal architecture can implement those processes – otherwise, cognitive modeling is grossly underconstrained. Some blame this misunderstanding for the infamous failure of “symbolic AI.”"

[Guest Anonymous]

Is this a battle of who's right?

[Guest Anonymous]

Apparently there is no "right" as the entire world and all of reality is subjective.  

 

That IS what you are going to say next isn't it,  that there is no objective truth?

[KarlYoshimura]

@Solune

 

lolwhut? We're all here because the forum gives us a place of false security? Would you be able to elaborate upon this?

[Solune]

@Solune

 

lolwhut? We're all here because the forum gives us a place of false security? Would you be able to elaborate upon this?

 

There are individuals who walk through this life having never heard the word "tulpamancy", and yet they have tulpas.

Our community created labels for things that have existed probably before the spoken word itself... why?

Because labels give us the illusion of power. If you can name a thing, you have power over it. Isn't that the foundation of magick?

We desire control (power) over our own lives, and so we go in search of this place and most of us find it eventually.

We proceed to put things into boxes, and argue over what color the boxes are and whether we should even call them boxes.

 

It's the same with science. It's the same with everything.

This place gives us an alternative identity, an alternative means of control. We delight in in, we fellowship with each other for the same reason any animal seeks its own kind.

So it doesn't feel alone, so it feels safe, so IT FEELS IN CONTROL.

Ultimately, no matter how many labels you create... no matter how many people you bring into your life... no matter how many scientific mysteries you delve into...

We are all going to die. And THAT is why I call it "false" security. Because ALL security is false. All control is an illusion.

You have no more control over your life than does a leaf on the wind.