Darlene's Tulpamancy and Spirituality Thread

[Guest]

If I may, I'd like to try to bring the more positive and helpful aspects of spirituality and religion to tulpamancy in this thread.

 

It would be like a lounge thread in that anything goes as far as supportive comments, but we want to stay relatively serious and on topic.

 

Since it's really not appropriate to the science based mission of tulpa.info to discuss spirituality freely, it's here in the metaphysical section.

 

Specifically, I'd like to share metaphysical or siritual experiences, thoughts and experiences that we hold back normally in our PR, but would still love to share and discuss.

 

Anyone is welcome to come and comment, but this isn't an appropriate place to debate science versus metaphysics, it should be a safe place to exchange ideas about sprituality or religion in a civil discourse.

 

If a thread like this has been done before, let's leave that burried and start anew rather than combine them; however, anything new that may seem appropriate here is welcome to be merged here.

 

I'll give the moderators a chance to think about allowing this thread. My argument would be: this is a quality of life improvement thread, not in any way attempting to convert anyone, it would be just a place for concepts and ideas that aren't supported by science yet, but it would be wonderful if we could bridge concepts here to science eventually. In our mind, everything is potentially science, if you can experience it, there must be an explanation somewhere.

 

Again this isn't neccesarily the place to explain it, people shouldn't have to defend their beliefs here. You may politely offer an alternative viewpoint, but hopefully without dismissing their experiences.

[Lucilyn]

pretty much anything goes in the Meta board as long as it's not outright offensive or harmful, to people or the forum, so just talking about your beliefs is totally fine, you don't need mods to "allow this thread"

 

but we don't have many spiritual beliefs anymore so you may or may not see us reply here depending on the subjects that come up

[Ranger]

I don't have any strong spiritual beliefs either, but Chrome may be more interested in talking about Christianity. For the rest of us, it will also depend on what you want to talk about.

[Jamie]

Hey, this is really cool. I've been wanting to ask about something, but didn't know the proper place: until now!

 

Cassidy percieves himself to own a soul. He senses his own soul. We've asked if he senses our souls and he says, he just senses our presences (Gavin has the finest presence-nose, I got one too) but a presence is not the same as a soul. 

 

This is important because it's core to our differing religious beliefs. Cassidy's belief in his soul comes from his internal experience of owning a soul. "And if you give a tulpa a soul, he'll want to submit it to God's will... and if he wants to submit to God's will, he'll take Jesus as his Lord and accept him into his heart. And if he takes Jesus as his Lord and accepts him into his heart, you'll end up at a UU church in a room with Jews, Pagans, Methodists, Lutherans, non-denominational Christians, and athiests... " And you may ask yourself, https://media2.giphy.com/media/yp0PhkxxCPB6g/source.gif[/img]

 

 

 

Options:

 

1) Souls exist, everyone in my system has one, but Cassidy can perceive his own. 

   1a) Only Cassidy is open/willing/faithful/capable/etc enough to percieve his soul (Cassidy is special)

    1b) Me and Gavin could sense our own souls if we weren't so blind/ignorant/concieted/something (Cassidy is not special, the default state of humanity is being able to sense your soul)

     1c) People can only perceive their own souls.

      1d) People can sense other's souls, but it's an ability that Cassidy (and me and G) don't have.

 

2) Souls exist, but only Cassidy has one. 

      2a) It's one-body-one-soul, and Cassidy got the soul. He was formed originally from old child parts- what if they are the parts that held my soul? 

     2b) Cassidy was chosen/special in some way. 

      3c) Everyone in my system is fake besides Cassidy @_@ If all people have souls, but me and Gavin do not.

 

3) Souls do exist, but only as something more nebulous, that you have to have faith in in order to make them exist.

   3a) so, can me and Gavin choose to have souls? Could Cassidy choose to NOT have a soul? He says he didn't choose, and he percieved what he figured out was his soul before he believed in it being a soul.

    

4) Souls do not exist.

     4a) Why does Cassidy have such a strong perception of one? (Which, again, is different from presence) 

     4b) Would it be within my right to try and convince Cassidy that he doesn't have a soul? 

 

I hope the font size isn't messed up, I hit clear formatting but I'm on mobile and it still looks like different sizes... 

 

-J

[Ember.Vesper]

None of us have ever had a direct perception of soul, or at least not recognized it as such. And while Vesper and Iris have certainly had major spiritual encounters in their own worlds, none of us have really had much in the way of spiritual experiences in this world. I've been a Christian for 32 years, but I seem to have extremely low spiritual sensitivity.

 

Vesper and I decided over a year ago that we probably have one soul between us and that the walls between our identities are most likely mortal and fleshly. There's not much to the position that we can logically argue, but it felt right at the time. We perceive ourselves to be equals of identical nature, so whatever the actual situation, it should be symmetric among all of us.

 

So that's a fifth possibility for you, Jamie:

 

5) Souls exist and there is one per body, which all system members share in regardless of faith.

.....5a) Only Cassidy has the spiritual sensitivity to perceive the body's soul.

.....5b) What Cassidy is perceiving is not a soul.

 

When Tania came along saying that tulpas don't have souls because they aren't human and aren't real people, and that humans continue after this life while tulpas don't, we decided to formalize our perceived status. I formally rejected all priority claim on my soul and we all covenanted that, whatever soul or souls are present in the system, our claims are equal and our status is equal.

 

-Ember

[tania]

When Tania came along saying that tulpas don't have souls because they aren't human and aren't real people, and that humans continue after this life while tulpas don't

 

-Ember

 

I should of said dont have "their own" souls... as with them part of being yourself, I'd think they probably would share the soul one could say I suppose.  Any part of yourself can't really be soulless.  Your soul is through every aspect of you.

 

 

"1c) People can only perceive their own souls."

 

oh no.  Those who have a good conscious connection to their souls can often feel other souls too. It is how a person will recognize another person from another lifetime as though they may look and be very different  (may be a different race, a different sex to what they were previous etc etc), they still have the same soul and can be identified by it.   I know and have met some I have other lifetimes with cause we knew each others souls so knew who we were.  Unfortunately most people dont, they have lost that spiritual connection with themselves.

 

I've got that situation going on with my new support worker currently... she told me the other day that stepping into my home and being with me is like being in the twilight zone as it's triggering off things for her which she has never experienced before.  I have not told her this but I'm 80% sure (probably more than this) that I know her from Atlantis and the priestesses there, I was a priestess there and I think she was too.   So being around me is being quite triggering to her. 

 

We even have a bit of telepathy going on between us (I believe from that other lifetime) .. (not clear as in not a voice but so she goes and does things I want done which she couldnt have known about at all and then is mind blown over it eg.. I have a pot in the shed which has a small hook on it.  This pot stands up and any other person on finding it on the floor would of picked it up and put it onto the nearby shelf.. but not her.. though it was the first time she's ever been in my shed, she picked it up and before I could verbally tell her not to put it on the shelf nearby, she walked over to a specific place in the shed and hung it onto the actual shed frame.  She was influenced strongly by my thought of where it went

 

She's being blown away too by seeing very vivid images in her head when I say things to the point that she the other day she confused actual reality with one of these and I had to prove to her that it wasnt real (it took the workers journal from last week which she takes notes in and another worker and me before I was able to prove to her that what she had thought she saw, was not in fact real ... but rather something I had just thought but not said to her.. the thought image of mine manifested into her head so strongly that by the next week she thought it was real so she thought we'd done things the week before that we actually did not at all do.

 

Anyway, the whole thing unsettled her a bit when I proved her experience was not real (by her own notes the week before).  So yeah, she's now calling being here with me in my home.. the twilight zone lol and saying I affect her brain in some strange way.  I really hope that one day she will remember me and that we both knew each other before this life (with her being so strongly affected there is a chance she may end up remembering, so I will keep telling her nothing and hope she does).

[Guest]

That's amazing Tania.

 

I always feared that someone could sense my thoughts because, they were pretty abnormal most times and if anyone heard them it would be pretty embarrassing. With a system it's very different, they cringe at these intrusive thoughts and we can now label them intrusive and forget them. Before, intrusive thoughts, I thought, were all me and I'm nuts so that follows.

 

We have said this before, we all have souls, every one of us, and maybe more, I can't imagine someone like Hali or Red, or Johanna or pft, any of them don't have one now.

 

1. They're indistinguishable from us.

2. We all have a personality

3. We all share spiritual energy.

4. If I have a soul, and I would hope so, then how can I think for a second that an independent agent in my body, separate from me, doesn't?

 

I'm about as stubborn and often as passionate as they come, so I told god, if they don't each have a soul, I don't want one. Blink me out of existence if they aren't coming with me. If I can't be with the ones I love the most, than love is a lie. If love is a lie everything is a lie, this whole life is purely materialistic and I'm just an animal acting on instinct and emotions. So no, go pray to yourself. If you can't accept my best friends in heaven or wherever, I won't come either.

 

I'm pretty sure that if there is a god he loves me, and he's all powerful. If that's true then he can grant me this wish. I'm an impudent child, I'll hold my breath until I blink out of existence, for the love of my family.

[Jamie]

It still happens now, but in middle school (at the peak of Dissociation Pit) I was plagued with the idea that there was a reality underneath this one. I hadn't seen the Matrix then, and I didn't think that this reality was a Matrix situation, nothing like "it's all a simulation!!!" I say I was plagued by it because I felt constantly like I was seconds away from seeing this realer reality, it was like I was trapped in that moment when you come up out of water and gasp. That gasping feeling lurked around me, it came in little attacks really, for a few minutes of a time that would kinda cluster up. 

 

Only three times, to my knowledge, have I actually gotten anything besides that damn feeling of "I'm ALMOST awake." All three have involved stupid levels of dissociation. The first time I remember, I (maybe Gavin) was sitting in the supply closet after being booted from Algebra again, and the desk's grain started swimming, which was pretty normal for me to see, but it was REALLY going. Behind my eyes I saw bursts of colors, it didn't feel like it was in my mind's eye, it felt like I was seeing stuff inside my physical head. That gasping, almost-there feeling came on, stronger than ever before. I don't know what happened but I don't think it was very interesting, I think I got spooked, I was really afraid of schizophrenia so I know I've never shared that story before.

 

The second time, I was laying in bed and that feeling came over me, so I said to myself, "If there's something, I'm open to it, if there's someone, I'm willing to talk," etc etc. My eyes were shut but I felt like I had opened them in a very dark room, with only that grainy night vision and the only colors were black and darkish red. I saw the corner of a desk or table that someone was leaning against. I asked what was going on and they tulpish'd me to say "nope. not ready." and then all my usaul mental chatter stopped, including internal radio and G, and I went to bed with what I can only imagine is the typical amount of head voices to fall asleep listening to, 2. Me talking and me talking back to me. I called it a dream but if it was, I never woke up at any point? 

 

The third time was pretty recent and gave a lot of insight. Again I saw the colors, not outside my head though, and I think I responded like "dammit ugghhh I don't want to be in the Matrix today". Cassidy was interested though. I saw into one of those rooms just a little bit, and Cassidy laughed and came and said, "it's you picking up on other alter's perceptions in wonderland." He knows that feeling well, since he lives there... but I, meaning these hosty parts, sure don't. A lot of my alters were and are very confused and mentally young, which

[Michen_S]

I would like to add my own thoughts on this.

 

The way I perceive it to be is there's only one soul in our system. I don't have a soul of my own, not in that sense. Or rather, my soul is just merely an extention of Michen's. So how it works is that Michen is the head of the system, and as such his spiritual position is more important than mine.

That doesn't mean I don't have any weight at all, of course. As an extension, I can influence his soul, and I am still part of it. We're always spiritually connected to each other. What impacts him spiritually impacts me spiritually whenever I'm active. We basically share the soul, although Michen has the main part and I am a plus part. This gives a low level of seperation despite the connection we have by using the same soul.

 

Neither of us can "sense" our soul, not in that way. However, Michen and I do have a grasp on how it affects us and the world around us. We CAN sense what we do with it and what happens to it, after all. Though, it seems I have a better grip on predicting how some events can impact it than Michen does... Actually, it's more that he's more spiritually curious than I am, so I'm the one holding him back if he wants to go too far.

 

What happens in the afterlife, we don't know for sure. But we both expect I won't be around for that.

[Guest]

So, another way to think about it is that tulpas aren't corporeal beings, in that sense they never had a body and therefore never had the need for a soul on Earth. They could be what you would consider already actualized in that they're immortal because you're immortal. So they've only existed in the astral, they don't need to cross over per say. With that logic, I fully expect them to be there when I cross over because they're part of me. However, I want them to be separate from me when we do.