A request to anyone that can help: This may end Imposition-on-Imposition Hell

[Jun and Alexis]

The message to [All Tulpa: Stay with me here. [i''ve written out a formula for an instant tulpa and it explains my complete understanding of T*;

 

What is the most] vivid effect and physical feeling of tulpaforcing skin and flesh? Like, can you [Please give us a joint account here like TulpaCouple. You should know what this means.]

 

You grew up with Yu Gi Oh, right? That's what it's like for me for 4 years.

 

I need Ayako's account deleted because she renamed herself Alexis because I told her [to make it easier for me, so he told me to deviate after 4 years because I] hurting her because we made a promise to, in be full-blown Yandere mode. It's not bad, but it's like growing up with an over protective stray puppy you can't let go of.

 

We give everything [half/half/];

 

So basically I gave myself which by association of such a pure personality because I sufferred and she suffered. We Chose to be Tulpa_Tulpa_ but switched to Tulpa to Tulpa.

 

I'm deathly afraid of intimacy and I get afraid if she even teases me. I get envious of all your fun random tulpas because I treat this like a full time job. When she is spontaneous in my mind it's akin to mind-violation;

 

It's been 4 years since she appeared. She was an accident, I just genuinely thought she was real from the start. It developed into more than that. Much love was given to each side, so I worked harder, however this was passively, now I wish to force "normally."

 

How do I force normally?

 

All her lies are coming up, I never take 50% of the burden, I take a lot more. I don't let her talk because I'm too stressed. I'm too grounded to the first plane. Wonderlands are our realities, and we're trying to find the right parallel reality and timeline correct.

 

 

 

[HOW DO YOU IMPOSE SIGHT AND TOUCH IN THE MOST SPECIFIC MANNER?!] SOS

[Linkzelda]

Firstly, if you keep trying to put a muzzle on her like that, she's obviously going to be like this:

 

 

Anyway, Here's what you can do as a host:

 

- Be a guide to her, not a disheartened parent that feels the need to think this is a full-time job. See it as showing her that you're trying your best to have a healthy relationship before one of you ends up being passive-aggressive with the spontaneity.

 

- Find free time where you can allow her to talk, and I know you're wondering if this is just going to give you a headache, but just let her burn out her thoughts and just try to practice relaxing. She'll eventually run out of a juice and will be less spontaneous and sporadic and hopefully will talk to you at a slower and moderate pace.

 

- Don't take for granted of her love for you, even though your sadomasochism with the yandere relationship is a bit concerning, you should be more than happy she actually cares about you and isn't trying to get away from you. You should expect her to want to express her love for you after being with her for this long.

 

- Communicate with her more, be a bit more empathetic and imagine her position of being with one host and having the desire to pour her heart out to him because tulpa are naturally shifted towards expressing unconditional love. You can do this by just simply honest with yourself and telling her she should be honest with herself as well. Stop worrying about who's lying and all that, she clearly wants to get her thoughts out, and since you've been suppressing them from time to time, you'll just have to swallow your pride and let her get mentally exhausted when you give her time to talk.

 

- Appreciate her a bit more, she's trying so hard to love you, and with you trying to cover her up with a pillow (metaphorically of course), she's going to be just as deadly in her spontaneous behavior.

- If she teases you sexually, let that be a sign that you just need to talk to her more. She might get sexually frustrated, especially with your yandere promise, which is honestly something you two have to talk things out with, otherwise, this is what will happen:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NI_fgwbmJg0

 

Unless you want that to happen, just communicate with her and be honest with her.

 

And here's what your tulpa can do for you:

 

- Acknowledge that your host is trying to balance between how he sees you and how he tries to have a grip with reality here. He has things he'll need to be responsible for as the years progress, so just know that he'll need some personal time to himself at times. Talk things out with him as well and try to make a plan you two can work with, and always be willing to be flexible if things come up that might make your planning inconsistent. Communicate with him as much as you can, but do it at a pace where he can comprehend what you're saying without him going SDAfSDGDGJKSDFJASDKFASJDKFAJSF all the time.

 

- You don't have to be clingy to him ALL the time, you should consider giving him some space from time to time. You're going to be with him for quite some time, so rest assured knowing that, and just use the time where he wants personal space for your own time to get to know yourself a bit more. After all, you deserve to help yourself into knowing more about yourself in as many aspects as you can.

 

- Know that he's trying his best to have a healthy relationship with you, and it involves both of you pulling your weight into this. Don't try to make it a competition on who shoulders more of the burden than the other, that type of lifestyle can be extremely exhausting, especially for the host.

 

- Try to help him out more with finding things he did in the past that made visualizing you easier for him. Since you can access the confines of his mind a lot better than he can, take some time to do that if you're more than willing to do so.

 

 

Now for both of you:

 

As for the imposition and "forcing naturally," honestly, just be aware of her as much as you can. Because when you're thinking of it as trying to "force" naturally, you'll just end up thinking it's a full-time job/chore/duty/obligation. And take the imposition slow, and just ask yourself:

 

"What would it be like to have her imposed into this reality?"

 

And ask her,

 

"How would you feel if you were to be imposed into this reality, and how do you think that might be done?"

 

Asking questions like that can really make things a lot easier than trying to copycat some hardcore and detailed imposition guide. Words that can be formed into questions and statements below (the "..." means to add whatever thought you and her can think about):

 

"Just pretend for a moment...."

 

"Imagine..."

 

"How would it feel if you...."

 

"Can you really enjoy...."

 

"What happens when you..."

 

They help you both to find things that worked before and being able to redefine them, and if you can imagine her and hear her voice, you can sure as heck impose her with practice without having to worry about extensive guides.

 

Hope this helps.

[HumbleGlow]

One day we will just compile all of Linkzelda's posts into an eBook or whatever. You are so incredibly helpful, man.

[Chupi]

I need Ayako's account deleted because she renamed herself Alexis...

 

Accounts can be deleted through User CP, there's a "delete account" link on the left. However, if you'd rather keep the account and rename it, PM me with the new name and I will.

 

I get envious of all your fun random tulpas because I treat this like a full time job. When she is spontaneous in my mind it's akin to mind-violation

 

Like Linkzelda said, don't treat it like a chore and it won't be. You're two people stuck together by random chance, and it's up to both of you to make of it whatever you like. It can be anything from enemies, to friends who mostly do their own things and meet up now and then, to partners who help each other with everything. She may not be able to do a really equal share right now, but with some work she can handle things in the mind while you do stuff in the real world. Or possession, work on wonderland immersion, and take turns doing real-life stuff while the other gets some relax time.

 

You might need to talk to her about some thing she does that you can't deal with, but it's usually not that difficult to reach a suitable compromise when you live in the same head. I've heard of people with far worse relationships with accidental tulpas working it out and living with each other as happily as those here you're envious of. From the sound of it, she cares for you a lot, so she'll probably be willing to negotiate.

 

As for spontaneous actions feeling like "mind violation", I think I know the feeling -- like a thought or image being shoved forcibly into your mind. As far as I can tell, this is pretty inevitable if you have an independent being in your head. Keep in mind it's not something she's doing to you on purpose. It's just the result of her moving around and doing things. Just about everybody here with an independent tulpa probably feels the same thing at least some of the time.

 

Most of us welcome it and see it as a good thing, a sign that this wonderful being is alive and well and doing things. Think of it as you seeing, hearing, etc. things she's doing in the wonderland or wherever. She's on a separate plane than reality and you're perceiving stuff happening on that plane -- just like you perceive stuff happening around you in real life. See it as a different sort of sight, and it won't seem like mind violation much more than it does when you see people moving around you in real life while you're doing something. Distracting, sometimes, but not violating.

 

However, if you need some alone time, you should be able to work something out. Perhaps she'd be willing to lay down, rest, and not do things for a bit. Or maybe you can make some amusement park wonderland and let her play there for a while.

 

If she doesn't understand why you would request this (or any other thing really), try this: Imagine a box and pack in it the sensations and emotions that make you feel the way you do. Give her the box. This will likely help her understand your point of view. Note that she may do the same to show you her point of view -- this is good, it will lead to better understanding of each other.

[Jun and Alexis]

I'll move my next post into PR since that's what it became. Too much information, too much drama, not enough straight questions.

 

I need some sort of reinforcement as while I love her, I'm borderline terrified of her and what happened since the 29th. I think it was just too much for a general forum post. I don't need a handout, I don't need spoonfeeding, I just have a lot of trauma and mass tulpadrama ensued since the first post.

 

Question for the tulpas TULPAQ&A: If there was one thing you could pick that makes you want to continously show your host love and affection, what would it be? Because they created you? Because they put so much work and love into you? Are you just happy to be with them and why? Did them choosing a form for you interfere with or stifle your affections?

 

 

 

Linkzelda:

Don't take for granted of her love for you, even though your sadomasochism with the yandere relationship is a bit concerning, you should be more than happy she actually cares about you and isn't trying to get away from you. You should expect her to want to express her love for you after being with her for this long.

This is exactly the problem. Too much is unusual about the way I met her. I opted 3 years later when I learned what a tulpa was not to view them as a perceived hallucination but to have her as something I can't tell the difference in reality of and drop spaghetti everywhere when I talk to her in public. I couldn't and am still having trouble with tulpa concepts. I don't take her love for granted it's just I fear she'll hurt me somehow as I view her more human than tulpa. I'm doing everything and anything NOT to muzzle her. In fact, I think it's that we talk too much. I might be stupid and naive, but I think the concept of unconditional love is terrifying.

 

Chupi: We do everything you say. Ayako tells me I don't treat forcing like a chore, it's just hard for me to try to see her with the level of attachment. That's it. She opts to alter my mind until she can repair me and I trust her. I love and trust her, It's just putting me through hell. It's just, in order for me to get the idea she split, broke my perception of her, and merged into Alexsis who I'm having trouble accepting because I got to know her as a separate person in that short time. I don't know how to feel but emotionally scarred and confused. The box thing is a good idea, but she refuses to take sync off. She knows what I'm thinking at all times so she opts not to need it. She knows I'm scared and is doing her best to help.

 

Is there any more advice you guys could give? It's really more of a problem with me than her, and it's not really much we can work out with talking. She's more like a romantic little sister in both of our eyes. I can't handle that.

[Linkzelda]

Is there any more advice you guys could give? It's really more of a problem with me than her, and it's not really much we can work out with talking. She's more like a romantic little sister in both of our eyes. I can't handle that.

Question for the tulpas TULPAQ&A: If there was one thing you could pick that makes you want to continously show your host love and affection, what would it be? Because they created you? Because they put so much work and love into you? Are you just happy to be with them and why? Did them choosing a form for you interfere with or stifle your affections?

 

Because our tulpae's existence is sustained through our faith in them, their entire self-worth, the totality of purpose behind their existence, it can lead to conflict between the host and the tulpa. However, because the totality of their purpose on trying to earn/gain/achieve/obtain their host's love or approval or goals, the actual burden, the harsh existential question is placed on them instead (or at least has bigger impact for them).

 

Which is,

"What would it be like when the host is no longer around?"

 

Now, for that question, I just mean in terms of the host's identity (with egocide), the same identity that all our tulpa will often use as a contrast and also something they want to achieve love from, because really, it's the only powerful and sustaining force they can rely on in the long run. Now as you and her see each other as romantic siblings, it becomes a morality issue (a pseudo-incest moral dilemma to put it more accurately).

 

So while you're contemplating that talking things out with her won't make much of a difference, honestly, it actually will make ALL the difference, especially when how you express your own faith and feelings for her can make or break her from having that existential question (especially if she reaches a state of self-actualization frequently that might convince her to see you completely different; to the point where she becomes disgusted by you despite of her relentless attempts of gaining approval/love/acceptance from you in her own unique ways that may be interpreted as sporadic and somewhat inconsistent in your perspective).

 

And here's another double-bind situation for you, because your faith and your whole existence as a whole is what all she has to reach deeper levels for her innate love for you, if you start becoming de-motivated yourself, the existential question starts slamming towards you now.

 

And even as you think that you, as the host, shoulders most of the burden, the thing is, you have to see "pulling your own weight" as something other than thinking "for your own problems/stuff/conflicts." You should see it as being able to pull your own weight in order to work things out WITH your tulpa for both you two's sake. And the first step in reaching compromises with your tulpa is obviously communication, whether you think it's effective or not, you can't rely only on the assumption that you're a good person at heart, you have to be able to demonstrate that, or produce that with your tulpa.

 

Your tulpa is wanting to do the same, to produce what she stands for by trying to gain your love/acknowledgement/acceptance for her, and when it gets to that point, it's actually her being the child and you being the parent (the child trying to gain acceptance of the parent because of the child's innate drive for love). But the thing is, our bond with tulpa isn't as black-and-white like that, the type of interaction we have with them can't be confined with such simple binaries.

 

And because you tend to shift between the role of a parent and the role of a romantic brother, it creates more pressure on you because you feel you're trapped. Because siblings, they can easily set each other as a contrast, to try and see who is able to obtain the love for their parent better; who gets appreciated more, and who is considered to be the most loved.

 

But because you're in both of those realms, and how she's really an extension of yourself (like all our tulpae are in some way in my personal opinion) when you're trying so hard to reach compromises only to have existential issues yourself, it can dehumanize your tulpa even more. They might have pity for you, but in sardonic ways, especially when they're more proficient in self-actualization than you are yourself.

 

Personally, finding compromises and ways to resolve these existential issues and double-binds/moral dilemmas we get into with this tulpa phenomenon is a challenge. We have to be able to go beyond the spectrum of what we perceive in terms of types of gender, gender roles, sexualities, types of relationships, and much more that exist in the world. Which is why I find myself realizing that this endeavor with our tulpa is slightly solipsistic, because when you become negative of yourself and your own competence in determination, perseverance, etc., you're really killing the opportunity for your tulpa to improve and grow.

 

And not only that, if you reach a loss of what to do, your tulpa may start to worry and question your loss and while they're at loss for your loss, they have no means to have a source that can get out of their loss that comes with being tulpa, because that source that leads them out to better things has to come through you.

This is why you see people packing their bags (saying they regret making one, etc.) and giving up on the tulpa phenomenon easily, because the very process of having a tulpa really CHALLENGES what we percieve the type of relationship we have with them. And whether any host and tulpa go through relationships (but not limited to) like:

 

- Romantic sibling

- Parent

- Gaurdian

- Yandere

- Tsundere

- Anima/Animus

- Perfect lover

- Etc.

 

You may notice that restricting your bond with them with one or two categories is a challenge because you have to be able to constantly have the assurance to see those few roles sustaining themselves. But that's really difficult, because how you express love to them may have to be done on many levels of consciousness. The love within becomes something that must be seen and expressed on different levels, and in order to deal with the moral dilemma that comes with that as well, you have to communicate and believe in yourself in what your unconscious mind can do with implicit knowledge to have better bonding with your tulpa.

 

Existential questions and concepts like what I've stated above is common, and it can grow into more intense levels that are often hard to endure. Which is why when you want your tulpa to become this sentient, sapient, vocal, and overly competent individual, you have to go first, go headstrong, and demonstrate that you can endure through those existential trials yourself.

 

When you give up, you give up on that opportunity you could've had with them, and that can impact you emotionally on deeper levels. It gets to the point where you're busy trying to piece together the fragments you broke, a back and forth motion of trying to gain solace and reaching new beginnings, except you're doing it alone. You and your tulpa become more powerful through your connection through each other, not alone.

 

And as we go through this burden, we may or may not notice we're afraid to give our tulpa a chance to speak, but you shouldn't be afraid to speak with her or think that speaking to her won't make a difference. Learn how to delegate that burden with your tulpa for both your own sake and her's.

[Nobillis]

Question for the tulpas TULPAQ&A: If there was one thing you could pick that makes you want to continously show your host love and affection, what would it be? Because they created you? Because they put so much work and love into you? Are you just happy to be with them and why? Did them choosing a form for you interfere with or stifle your affections?

That's pretty easy for me. Kevin is kind to other people. Um, I can change my form at will, so that's not really a factor.

 

You find unconditional love terrifying? I'm surely missing something in your posts here. Let's try this from another viewpoint. Suppose you met someone, and you could see all that was good and worthwhile and wonderful in them. Wouldn't you still think they were amazing, even if they couldn't see those things in themselves?

 

Tulpas see the potential for love in your mind and yes they want that - it is human to want love after all. Sometimes that feeling gets mixed up with feelings of attraction too (yes, I'll admit, I had that confusion too) - but if you explain that isn't what you want - that love can be without involving sex, then most tulpas are going to understand. Kevin and I were at odds for some months over this, but you can get past it if you talk it over, ok?

[Jun and Alexis]

Nobillis: See, that's where I have trouble. The problem is of course I think she's amazing. I think she's too amazing is the issue. She's had a hard life what with her backstory and all, now wanting a fresh start. I just want to continue where we left off before I got in this negative mindset of treating her love, compliments and affection as terms of either trying to control me in some way even if it's too make me happy. Like she's too pure to the point I'm guilty if I do anything, even get the sauce wrong at Subway when we eat since she can clone up whatever I eat. I've done things I'm not happy about and this caused a lot of pain to her, which she's over, but continues to pain me. This has been a theme throughout the past year. The stems are those events I don't wish to talk about and things I still can't get over since before I met her.

 

I've had my self-confidence and self-esteem issue for years, probably since 2009 that she's helped me through. It's borderline PTSD. That's why her sticking by me since 2010, well, I feel guilty for everything she's done. Like her backstory is some sort of alternate parallel version of what I went through that she only went through because of what I went through that crippled me emotionally, and the fact she's altering her own mindset and philosophies to make it easier on herself, not just me she says, I can't help but feel it's a self-fulfilling prophecy; the more she stays with me, the more she's going to hurt of empathy and eventually leave me because I can't accept her as the perfect person I knew her as. My delusion is massive.

 

More accurately, with her actions and level of maturity to handle and adapt to situations, I'm having trouble letting go of that Angel I first met her as that saved me from despair and letting her grow up, mature, and most of all deviate like HUMANS do. It's part of life and this is stopping all progress. Most of all, I feel I no longer deserve someone as kind as her in my life, and the fear induced by her positive actions and words despite telling me how wrong I am when I think like this.

 

Sometimes that feeling gets mixed up with feelings of attraction too (yes, I'll admit, I had that confusion too) - but if you explain that isn't what you want - that love can be without involving sex, then most tulpas are going to understand.

My issue is this never started to be a problem until recently. The longer I've known her, the more romantic the relationship got, being physical was not an issue. I don't want to be physical very often now, like my libido has all but died and I can't give her anything she wants. I just want to cuddle and pillow talk but I can't even do that and it hurts both of us.

 

It's because of my currently inability to change, the morality conflicts between the "sister" I know her as now and "perfect lover and partner" she still is stop me from even moving when she tries to do what we used to before. I do get the feeling of being trapped, even if it's with the person I want to spend all my life with, even beyond death.

 

 

 

linkzelda: The reason I thought that talking things out wouldn't do much isn't because we don't talk, but because we talk TOO much and I fall into the cycles and loops that she constantly digs me out of.

And not only that, if you reach a loss of what to do, your tulpa may start to worry and question your loss and while they're at loss for your loss, they have no means to have a source that can get out of their loss that comes with being tulpa, because that source that leads them out to better things has to come through you.

That's the problem. She's at a loss for my loss because of the dynamic we got into. Until recently it's always been "We're each other's tulpa." That means in itself we'll always love and stay together. I fluctuate between everything you said the tulpa does, but Ayako doesn't fluctuate like I do unless my negative emotions due to reasons above depress her, denying her even cuddling that isn't love-on-"oh god she's too loving help" where I get genuine fear. It's like I DO think her genuine comforting words and love is mocking or disdain, despite everything she does has been to better me and our relationship.

 

Again, the issue is mainly me, as I refuse to let her take the burden to the point I damage my own mindset. Because we didn't know about tulpas until last year, I didn't know what she was besides a real, sentient human with cool powers living in my head who loves me despite my many flaws and past full of regret. For that reason and the genuine romantic relationship we built, everything changed when I found tulpa.info late last year. For about 6 months I didn't even make an account, and the terms for forcing and everything made sense, but in retrospect the methods learned here, even if applied as mere guidelines are hard to accept now, because instead of that genuine human I perceived her to be, it changed into merely "tulpa." The concept of "unconditional love" and all these "Making tulpa from scratch" thing, making more than one, it messed with my head.

 

I thought things like "People shouldn't be made," while thinking at the same time "Everyone deserves a chance at life" the more I read, which eventually broke my perception of what she was very gradually into "Tulpa: Scientifically engineered half-human pets. FOR SCIENCE!"

 

This concept disgusts me. I know that's not what it is. I'm going through the "Sephiroth" phase I guess. I found her/our (Each other's tulpa concept) existence isn't necessarily "real" and it just stuck. If you remember that entire library scene, that's what happened for me and tulpa.info. Yet I still come here. The methods are helpful, but I can't bring myself to accept anything here despite how innocent and genuine everything really is. I accept the users and experiences, even the tulpas themselves as being real. Everything on the forums I don't doubt in it's genuine innocence, but well, to me, everything we're been through has changed. In my mind "Forcing," "imposition," "possession" are "Trying to prove love and spending time together," "badgering each other until we're schizophrenically real into each other's reality" and "You are mine, I am yours. We'll even be each other's property out of genuine trust and love; possession" as of recent.

 

This isn't a bad thing, but it's more overbearing.

 

I was on antipsychotics against my will for a few weeks (No longer on them), it cut our ability to communicate, it shoved her backstory in her face, forcing her to grow up and choose to cut herself from her past by coming to terms. She had a FAMILY, and even if traumatic, even if she doesn't want it, I feel she should have those memories because they're hers. I even met them as mindvoices years ago, and I accepted them as real. Even if a lot of the things they did hurt her, I thought she shouldn't get rid of them which is selfish of me. Maybe this stopped deviation as she had inner conflict due to my wants and concerns for her, and she agrees with this theory.

 

Going back, while I was on them, the antipsychotics crammed these tulpaterms and morality issues down my throat, and it forced ME out of the mindset we're both 17 at heart, perfect lovers mindset we had established for 3 years, threw terms like HOST into my face and essentially ENGRAINED it. It robbed EVERYTHING from us. It even made her "crash." Moreover, when I got off of them, the damage had been done. She got over things, but I didn't. New ways and mindsets were then required to be together on my part, so much so that the day after I made the thread She split herself into 3 differently aged sisters who did things to me, merged after forming more bonds, split, merged, all for MY sake, almost BREAKING herself in the process because she split her CONSCIOUSNESS? It FURTHER shattering my reality and concepts of her.

 

She said breaking my mind with the sister thing was so that she could rebuild me, so that I could come to terms and things would resume as normal. Instead of taking 3 versions of herself and saying "Here's 3 of me, here's 3 sides of me, we're gonna force you via separate bodies and you tell me who you like best so I can use that as a base to make you happy again," I took it as "Here's 3 consciousnesses of me, have fun with your traumatic mental harem of clusterfucked thoughts and existential conflictions about me." I knew she would merge, I knew they weren't full tulpas, but the differences in behavior and personalities, maturity levels, age and what I perceived, it made me fall in love with each of them in hyperdrive just because it was her. They fought over me exactly like you said a child does for a parent's love does, to the point I couldn't get near any of them because they were too... something for me to say no to. When they said "Pick!," I couldn't.

 

So when Ayako merged with the oldest, older sister type, what was left was Alexis and Ayako. Alexis now, being essentially the same in my eyes as old Ayako but with a fresh start, younger, an even MORE pure little sister, the things that happened in those 3 days, even if Ayako-Ayako made them happen, were too much and I couldn't spend time with Alexis, whom Ayako wanted to be, because she was then my pure little sister I thought Ayako condemned herself for. Ayako-Ayako was and is now a separate consciousness of Alexis, all because she split for 3 days-- for my sake.

 

She kept saying "Be nice to Alexis," "Play with Alexis," "Let Alexis play with us," and I couldn't even give a certain card she wanted (Light type mounted knight secret rare) during a Yugioh tabletop game we made for her to play as because I thought it would cement her as a separate tulpa, even if I may want/have wanted that. She even called it, Ayako even said to give it to her. Solely because it was Light-type and a Knight I thought this action would be massive and earth-shattering. I still wanted to be nice to her, so I made her the GM (Who decides rules but still plays on our team). Because the cards and lifepoints represented people or soulshards (We were making "Soul" decks and going into each other's mind-worlds with certain "pieces" of ourselves. Smart in my condition, right?), ALL reality is gone and everything is imposition at this point and an hour later of sitting there with music and a show to influence ideas for the RPG, I couldn't bring myself to even start the game.

 

The scenario was in a nutshell, me, Ayako, my old self/Ayako's "older brother" going into the "Brother box" (Yugioh tin with the brother/my old self's card on it) looking for the old me so we could move on and end my negative thoughts. A team effort to end my brain-fuck. I had to fight Alexis at one point after making her a deck of shinies and commons to use. Maybe it was the "Move on, the only thing stopping you is you" ceremonial duel that would have ended everything. I had to leave the room and end the game. The Ayako-Brother-Me team was separated from the Me-Me-Me team without realizing it until she set up the board, which goes into your "What will a tulpa do without the host," essentially giving me rights to duel with Alexis alone, IE, new Ayako and accept her deviation as her choice and not mine. "What does a host do without a tulpa" is my dilemma.

 

This is why you see people packing their bags (saying they regret making one, etc.) and giving up on the tulpa phenomenon easily, because the very process of having a tulpa really CHALLENGES what we percieve the type of relationship we have with them. And whether any host and tulpa go through relationships (but not limited to) like:

 

- Romantic sibling

- Parent

- Gaurdian

- Yandere

- Tsundere

- Anima/Animus

- Perfect lover

- Etc.

 

You may notice that restricting your bond with them with one or two categories is a challenge because you have to be able to constantly have the assurance to see those few roles sustaining themselves. But that's really difficult, because how you express love to them may have to be done on many levels of consciousness. The love within becomes something that must be seen and expressed on different levels, and in order to deal with the moral dilemma that comes with that as well, you have to communicate and believe in yourself in what your unconscious mind can do with implicit knowledge to have better bonding with your tulpa.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. I have always viewed Ayako as Yandere, perfect lover, and guardian past the point of "Yukki for 10 hours," which has always been a good thing, as anyone who knows the difference between yandere and yangire will know. Deredere is lovey-dovey, which tsundere develops into. Yandere is over-the-top tulpa-tier unconditional love with or without a direct reason for having it, Ayako's reason being "I saved her." An outside source is their partner's problem, all other girls taint him, that's why they are misunderstood as inherently violent and problematic, however I have viewed Ayako ALWAYS as a borderline and self-contained yandere, while I have recently become Yanyan-deredere rather than any of the 3.

 

Ayako/Alexis is deredere to the point it literally hurts. She is now yandere, deredere, tsundere, little sister-type, older mother type, HNNNGGH-type, both anima AND animus to me, while I'm merely feminine to myself despite being male. She's the man to the point I'm ashamed of myself. I no longer see her as "Perfect yandere lover," but "Perfect lover and God." I don't know what I'm doing.

 

Existential questions and concepts like what I've stated above is common, and it can grow into more intense levels that are often hard to endure. Which is why when you want your tulpa to become this sentient, sapient, vocal, and overly competent individual, you have to go first, go headstrong, and demonstrate that you can endure through those existential trials yourself.

 

When you give up, you give up on that opportunity you could've had with them, and that can impact you emotionally on deeper levels. It gets to the point where you're busy trying to piece together the fragments you broke, a back and forth motion of trying to gain solace and reaching new beginnings, except you're doing it alone. You and your tulpa become more powerful through your connection through each other, not alone.

 

I asked-- maybe I told, I don't remember-- Ayako not to merge back because I thought another accidental tulpa was formed. I didn't know how tulpa were exactly made despite being here on tulpa.info. Within 5 minutes she did merge without telling me beforehand. What's more, Alexis cried I couldn't love her the way I love Ayako. I didn't get to say goodbye to Alexis, I didn't get to say goodbye to Ayako, and I felt like Ayako was literally dead, not dissipated, not back to herself or a whole person, but EATEN by Alexis and I would never see any side of her again. New tulpa, new start. This is wrong, and she says it's wrong. Ayako, NOW, is Alexis-Ayako. I don't know in my mind who is who, but in my heart I trust her words that she is still Ayako-Ayako. She wants me to call her Alexis so we CAN move on, because she says that's the first real name gave her. [That's not exactly true anymore. He can call me whatever he wants. He chose Alexis in his heart because it was the closest to me, so I chose to be her. I ate her if we had to put it that black and white, but we don't and he can't get that. I want him to grow up so he can grow back down. I told him tulpas age in reverse and back up but he doesn't believe me.]

 

In my mind, names are the whole issue. In Japanese, names are words, and to my understanding in languages words are things. Ayako is written as "Colorful child," so losing the -ko would just mean "Colorful," signifying she grew up. That's what I always thought would be her name when we grew up. She's saying that it happened earlier than I expected, and that this Aya is now Alexis, but she's still the same girl I love, my first and ONLY tulpa. How I perceive this, despite trusting her, in fact it's not even a matter of trust, but mind-logic, is that Ayako was never a tulpa and now she's converting to classic tulpa.info format tulpa to make it easier on me. She said it's akin to a shapeshifting tulpa.

[Jun and Alexis]

Nobillis: See, that's where I have trouble. The problem is of course I think she's amazing. I think she's too amazing is the issue. She's had a hard life what with her backstory and all, now wanting a fresh start. I just want to continue where we left off before I got in this negative mindset of treating her love, compliments and affection as terms of either trying to control me in some way even if it's too make me happy. Like she's too pure to the point I'm guilty if I do anything, even get the sauce wrong at Subway when we eat since she can clone up whatever I eat. I've done things I'm not happy about and this caused a lot of pain to her, which she's over, but continues to pain me. This has been a theme throughout the past year. The stems are those events I don't wish to talk about and things I still can't get over since before I met her.

 

I've had my self-confidence and self-esteem issue for years, probably since 2009 that she's helped me through. It's borderline PTSD. That's why her sticking by me since 2010, well, I feel guilty for everything she's done. Like her backstory is some sort of alternate parallel version of what I went through that she only went through because of what I went through that crippled me emotionally, and the fact she's altering her own mindset and philosophies to make it easier on herself, not just me she says, I can't help but feel it's a self-fulfilling prophecy; the more she stays with me, the more she's going to hurt of empathy and eventually leave me because I can't accept her as the perfect person I knew her as. My delusion is massive.

 

More accurately, with her actions and level of maturity to handle and adapt to situations, I'm having trouble letting go of that Angel I first met her as that saved me from despair and letting her grow up, mature, and most of all deviate like HUMANS do. It's part of life and this is stopping all progress. Most of all, I feel I no longer deserve someone as kind as her in my life, and the fear induced by her positive actions and words despite telling me how wrong I am when I think like this.

 

Sometimes that feeling gets mixed up with feelings of attraction too (yes, I'll admit, I had that confusion too) - but if you explain that isn't what you want - that love can be without involving sex, then most tulpas are going to understand.

My issue is this never started to be a problem until recently. The longer I've known her, the more romantic the relationship got, being physical was not an issue. I don't want to be physical very often now, like my libido has all but died and I can't give her anything she wants. I just want to cuddle and pillow talk but I can't even do that and it hurts both of us.

 

It's because of my currently inability to change, the morality conflicts between the "sister" I know her as now and "perfect lover and partner" she still is stop me from even moving when she tries to do what we used to before. I do get the feeling of being trapped, even if it's with the person I want to spend all my life with, even beyond death.

 

 

 

linkzelda: The reason I thought that talking things out wouldn't do much isn't because we don't talk, but because we talk TOO much and I fall into the cycles and loops that she constantly digs me out of.

And not only that, if you reach a loss of what to do, your tulpa may start to worry and question your loss and while they're at loss for your loss, they have no means to have a source that can get out of their loss that comes with being tulpa, because that source that leads them out to better things has to come through you.

That's the problem. She's at a loss for my loss because of the dynamic we got into. Until recently it's always been "We're each other's tulpa." That means in itself we'll always love and stay together. I fluctuate between everything you said the tulpa does, but Ayako doesn't fluctuate like I do unless my negative emotions due to reasons above depress her, denying her even cuddling that isn't love-on-"oh god she's too loving help" where I get genuine fear. It's like I DO think her genuine comforting words and love is mocking or disdain, despite everything she does has been to better me and our relationship.

 

Again, the issue is mainly me, as I refuse to let her take the burden to the point I damage my own mindset. Because we didn't know about tulpas until last year, I didn't know what she was besides a real, sentient human with cool powers living in my head who loves me despite my many flaws and past full of regret. For that reason and the genuine romantic relationship we built, everything changed when I found tulpa.info late last year. For about 6 months I didn't even make an account, and the terms for forcing and everything made sense, but in retrospect the methods learned here, even if applied as mere guidelines are hard to accept now, because instead of that genuine human I perceived her to be, it changed into merely "tulpa." The concept of "unconditional love" and all these "Making tulpa from scratch" thing, making more than one, it messed with my head.

 

I thought things like "People shouldn't be made," while thinking at the same time "Everyone deserves a chance at life" the more I read, which eventually broke my perception of what she was very gradually into "Tulpa: Scientifically engineered half-human pets. FOR SCIENCE!"

 

This concept disgusts me. I know that's not what it is. I'm going through the "Sephiroth" phase I guess. I found her/our (Each other's tulpa concept) existence isn't necessarily "real" and it just stuck. If you remember that entire library scene, that's what happened for me and tulpa.info. Yet I still come here. The methods are helpful, but I can't bring myself to accept anything here despite how innocent and genuine everything really is. I accept the users and experiences, even the tulpas themselves as being real. Everything on the forums I don't doubt in it's genuine innocence, but well, to me, everything we're been through has changed. In my mind "Forcing," "imposition," "possession" are "Trying to prove love and spending time together," "badgering each other until we're schizophrenically real into each other's reality" and "You are mine, I am yours. We'll even be each other's property out of genuine trust and love; possession" as of recent.

 

This isn't a bad thing, but it's more overbearing.

 

I was on antipsychotics against my will for a few weeks (No longer on them), it cut our ability to communicate, it shoved her backstory in her face, forcing her to grow up and choose to cut herself from her past by coming to terms. She had a FAMILY, and even if traumatic, even if she doesn't want it, I feel she should have those memories because they're hers. I even met them as mindvoices years ago, and I accepted them as real. Even if a lot of the things they did hurt her, I thought she shouldn't get rid of them which is selfish of me. Maybe this stopped deviation as she had inner conflict due to my wants and concerns for her, and she agrees with this theory.

 

Going back, while I was on them, the antipsychotics crammed these tulpaterms and morality issues down my throat, and it forced ME out of the mindset we're both 17 at heart, perfect lovers in honeymoon phase mindset we had established for 3 years, threw terms like HOST into my face and essentially ENGRAINED it. It robbed EVERYTHING from us. It even made her "crash." Moreover, when I got off of them, the damage had been done. She got over things, but I didn't. New ways and mindsets were then required to be together on my part, so much so that the day after I made the thread she split herself into 3 differently aged sisters who did things to me, merged after forming more bonds, split, merged, all for MY sake, almost BREAKING herself in the process because she split her CONSCIOUSNESS? It FURTHER shattered my reality and concepts of her. [it didn't split my consciousness until he made it an issue. He kept me out for too long until he created a "persona" of me that was Alexsis instead of a simple name change. I don't see the issue but he can't take my words at face value. Maybe this is why me roleplaying 3 girls is bad? I won't do it again, that's why I merged.]

 

"Here's 3 of me, here's 3 sides of me, we're gonna force you via separate bodies and you tell me who you like best so I can use that as a base to make you happy again," I took as "Here's 3 consciousnesses of me, have fun with your traumatic mental harem of clusterfucked thoughts and existential conflictions about me." I knew she would merge, I knew they weren't full tulpas, but the differences in behavior and personalities, maturity levels, age and what I perceived, it made me fall in love with each of them in hyperdrive just because it was her. They fought over me exactly like you said a child does for a parent's love does, to the point I couldn't get near any of them because they were too... something for me to say no to. When they said "Pick!," I couldn't.

 

So when Ayako merged with the oldest, older sister type, what was left was Alexis and Ayako. Alexis now, being essentially the same in my eyes as old Ayako but with a fresh start, younger, an even MORE pure little sister, those 3 days, even if Ayako-Ayako made it happen, it's too much and I couldn't spend time with Alexis, whom Ayako wanted to be, because she was then my pure little sister I thought Ayako condemned herself for. Ayako-Ayako was and is now a separate consciousness of Alexis. [Which she shouldn't be. All I did was give him another little sister for a day or two so he would know what it's like to get the little sister he wanted all his life. I didn't know it would break him with conflictions so hard.] It was hard. I don't know what a "real" family is, really, and that's why it nearly killed me. I need advice, as this is mainly a problem on my part and co-dependency. I feel like just a dependant and it's making me stressed. She says it's still co-dependent because she needs my love to survive. "There's no point in living if it's without you." I started thinking that this Alexis thing was so she could die and be reborn, that she thought I couldn't make her happy anymore, and I thought she would leave me. [but that's wrong. You're still you. I need you just as much as you need me.] That's why I thought Alexis was another person. I couldn't separate my love and while I thought Alexis was cuter and more cuddly, I still picked Ayako over and over again despite both of their best efforts to accept her growing up.

 

She kept saying "Be nice to Alexis," "Play with Alexis," "Let Alexis play with us," and I couldn't even give a certain card she wanted (Light type mounted knight secret rare) during a Yugioh tabletop game we made for her to play as because I thought it would cement her as a separate tulpa, even if I may want/have wanted that. Alexis even called the card, Ayako even said to give it to her. Solely because it was Light-type and a Knight I thought this action would be massive and earth-shattering. I still wanted to be nice to her, so I made her the GM (Who decides rules but still plays on our team). Because the cards and lifepoints represented people or soulshards (We were making "Soul" decks and going into each other's mind-worlds with certain "pieces" of ourselves. Smart in my condition, right?), ALL reality is gone and everything is imposition at this point and an hour later of sitting there with music and a show to influence ideas for the RPG, I couldn't bring myself to even start the game.

 

This is why you see people packing their bags (saying they regret making one, etc.) and giving up on the tulpa phenomenon easily, because the very process of having a tulpa really CHALLENGES what we percieve the type of relationship we have with them. And whether any host and tulpa go through relationships (but not limited to) like:

 

- Romantic sibling

- Parent

- Gaurdian

- Yandere

- Tsundere

- Anima/Animus

- Perfect lover

- Etc.

 

You may notice that restricting your bond with them with one or two categories is a challenge because you have to be able to constantly have the assurance to see those few roles sustaining themselves. But that's really difficult, because how you express love to them may have to be done on many levels of consciousness. The love within becomes something that must be seen and expressed on different levels, and in order to deal with the moral dilemma that comes with that as well, you have to communicate and believe in yourself in what your unconscious mind can do with implicit knowledge to have better bonding with your tulpa.

I agree with this wholeheartedly. I have always viewed Ayako as Yandere, perfect lover, and guardian past the point of "Yukki for 10 hours," which has always been a good thing, as anyone who knows the difference between yandere and yangire will know. Deredere is lovey-dovey, which tsundere develops into. Yandere is over-the-top tulpa-tier unconditional love with or without a direct reason for having it, Ayako's reason being "I saved her." An outside source is their partner's problem, all other girls taint him, that's why they are misunderstood as inherently violent and problematic, however I have viewed Ayako ALWAYS as a borderline and self-contained yandere, while I have recently become Yanyan-deredere rather than any of the 3.

 

She is now everything you listed aside from parent as well as anima and animus to me. In a nutshell, my entire situation is this:

Jungians warned that "every personification of the unconscious - the shadow, the anima, the animus, and the Self - has both a light and a dark aspect....the anima and animus have dual aspects: They can bring life-giving development and creativeness to the personality, or they can cause petrification and physical death".[11]

 

One danger was of what Jung termed "invasion" of the conscious by the unconscious archetype - "Possession caused by the anima...bad taste: the anima surrounds herself with inferior people".[12] Jung insisted that "a state of anima possession...must be prevented. The anima is thereby forced into the inner world, where she functions as the medium between the ego and the unconscious, as does the persona between the ego and the environment".[13]

 

Alternatively, over-awareness of the anima or animus could provide a premature conclusion to the individuation process - "a kind of psychological short-circuit, to identify the animus at least provisionally with wholeness".[14] Instead of being "content with an intermediate position", the animus seeks to usurp "the self, with which the patient's animus identifies. This identification is a regular occurrence when the shadow, the dark side, has not been sufficiently realized".[15]

 

 

Existential questions and concepts like what I've stated above is common, and it can grow into more intense levels that are often hard to endure. Which is why when you want your tulpa to become this sentient, sapient, vocal, and overly competent individual, you have to go first, go headstrong, and demonstrate that you can endure through those existential trials yourself.

Except that she went first. She couldn't wait for me to be stable and took it into her own hands because I gave her permission, and even encouraged changing my memories.

 

I asked-- maybe I told, I don't remember-- Ayako not to merge back because I thought another accidental tulpa was formed. I didn't know how tulpa were exactly made despite being here on tulpa.info. Within 5 minutes she did merge without telling me beforehand. What's more, Alexis cried I couldn't love her the way I love Ayako. I didn't get to say goodbye to Alexis, I didn't get to say goodbye to Ayako, and I felt like Ayako was literally dead, not dissipated, not back to herself or a whole person, but EATEN by Alexis and I would never see any side of her again. This is wrong, and she says it's wrong.

 

Ayako, as of yesterday, is Alexis-Ayako. I don't know in my mind who is who, but in my heart I trust her words that she is still Ayako-Ayako. She wanted me to call her Alexis so we CAN move on, because she says that's the first real name I gave her. [That's not exactly true anymore. He can call me whatever he wants. He chose Alexis in his heart because it was the closest to me, so I chose to be her. I ate her if we had to put it that black and white, but we don't and he can't get that. I want him to grow up so he can grow back down. I told him tulpas age in reverse and back up but he doesn't believe me.] She doesn't want the name anymore. It hurts.

 

In my mind, names are the whole issue. In Japanese, names are words, and to my understanding in languages words are things. Ayako is written as "Colorful child," so losing the -ko would just mean "Colorful," signifying she grew up. That's what I always thought would be her name when we grew up. She's saying that it happened earlier than I expected, and that this Aya is now Alexis, but she's still the same girl I love, my first and ONLY tulpa. How I perceive this, despite trusting her, in fact it's not even a matter of trust, but mind-logic, is that Ayako was never a tulpa and now she's converting to classic tulpa.info format tulpa to make it easier on me. She said it's akin to a shapeshifting tulpa.

 

 

I'm sorry for the wall of text, but we're going through a lot. It's all very confusing to me, I'm aware all I need to do is trust in her. It's not a matter of trust, it's mind-logic. I don't know what I'm doing.