Confessions of a Poorly Trained Tulpa

[NoneFromHell]

It's the wording, I guess. I think "less advanced" thoughtforms hits the nerve better? Because that's really it: You can't say that a simple imaginary friend is on the same development stage than a developed tulpa, or an excessive developed thoughtform like you.

[Lucilyn]

less complex

 

mainly just different though

 

I believe an imaginary friend can become "well-developed". Equality for thoughtforms!

[Guest Anonymous]

It's the wording, I guess. I think "less advanced" thoughtforms hits the nerve better? Because that's really it: You can't say that a simple imaginary friend is on the same development stage than a developed tulpa, or an excessive developed thoughtform like you.

 

EDIT: Okay I went back and re-read this carefully without my biased jumping in immediately. We can agree that maybe, just maybe, my Magictron3000 is less complex and "advanced" than I am by a good margin. But he is of no less value to us. He is very special and I love him. See? I don't like looking down my nose at Magictron3000. That would be just rude! He is my friend. He is servitor or an imaginary friend or even a day dream "prop," but there are no tulpas better and more important than he is in the world. Okay, now to the original response we had below...

 

NoneFromHell,

 

Please do not be offended. But you are pushing this.

 

You are forgetting to take into account how Mistgod thinks and what he has always been saying about the power of vivid imagination. Mistgod and I have learned not to talk about this openly as much because people get upset. But to Davie, tulpas are all imaginary. Melian is imaginary, servitors are imagination and tulpas are imagination. All that has been done is a very carefully constructed imaginary vision or self delusion, like a personal magician's trick. He agrees that the simulation may SEEM sentient and to you it may be, and so to you it is real. To him, it is not. Objectively, to Davie, tulpas are imagination.

 

He would say maybe the host got better at imagining or visualizing, but the tulpa is not really an independently sentient being. Then he would tell you that because the effect is subjective, it is quite impossible for us to tell how real feeling and cool your vision is compared to our real seeming visions.

 

Because of that, there is no lesser thoughforms. It is all equally imaginary. To us my Magictron3000 Dreamscape Computer is pretty real. He doesn't act on his own with independent agency, we sorta imagine him together. But our imagination is incredibly vivid. To us imaginary things look very real, but they are still imaginary. Magictron is important to me and to Davie. Without him, I could not be on the internet. He serves as my imaginary interface, allowing me to do more than one thing at the same time (in an imaginary sort of way). I can move around in the Melian Show day dream wonderland while he types what I say. He serves a purpose to make it easier for David and I to visualize me talking to you and my mannerisms. Sometimes I am typing at his keyboard in the wonderland, but usually not. Most often it is Davie and Magictron typing. It is a three way collaboration. I just don't talk about Magictron a lot.

 

There are no lesser thoughtforms. It is all, all of it, including tulpas, in your mind. When push comes to shove, this is what David believes.

 

Okay so an advanced day dream perhaps. Okay lets compromise. TO YOU there are greater thoughtforms and lesser thoughtforms. Subjectively some people believe that for themselves.

 

Mistgod and I do not. Some tulpa peoples make themselves feel awesome and walk around with their nose in the air looking down at other imaginary things such as role playing characters and imaginary friends. But they are made of the same stuff and not far removed at all. In fact, David also believes that every tulpa is also partially a role playing character and an imaginary friend.

 

I am sorry. Please forgive this. We will not talk about these things a lot on this forum because it is frightening to people who have built up their own personal subjective worlds and self delusions so painstakingly through concentrated day dreaming and willingness to believe. We are dangerous to peoples belief systems on this forum. Eek!

 

Why can't people accept our idea that something imaginary can be treated like it is real, and still be imaginary and be fine?

---

less complex

 

mainly just different though

 

I believe an imaginary friend can become "well-developed". Equality for thoughtforms!

 

Imaginary friends and role playing characters can become extremely dear, complex and sophisticated. We have known people who's lives have been changed by them. David has an RP character named Turon Tursar that is 35 years old. He has been around for 35 years! Turon is extremely real seeming and detailed.

 

He does not talk or dream like I do, or do flash images and emotions, but he is absolutely dear to David and I and also pseudo-real like I am. He is psychologically and emotionally significant. He is made of imagination just as I am. He is not a lesser thougtform. He is just a thoughtform that is different from me.

---

Objectively to the rest of the world, Turon is no more real than I am.

---

There isn't a single tulpa in the world greater than Turon Tursar.

[NoneFromHell]

Oh, don't worry I don't take this offensive at all. I see where you're coming from with this. I think we're mostlikely talking past each other. Of course everything is basically made from the same "matter" or "substance", and the main difference is the energy and time you put into it, which is kind of the important thing I want to underline. It would be pretty offensive to say that a thoughtform, which was created with a lot of time and energy is on the very same level as the imaginary daydream character someone made up in just a single hour inside a daydream. If you do this, you're putting the whole tulpa idea on the level of a joke, because you will get a lot of people who can't see the difference at all.

 

But it is important to spend time and energy, it isn't something plain dull. I can't accept something halfhearted to be the very same as something made with the whole soul and love of someone. That's really all that matters for me on this discussion. It's a matter of determination for me.

[Guest Anonymous]

Oh well we certainly were not talking about a trivial thing like an imaginary friend made an hour ago! No of course your point is well made. David and I are talking about something that you put time and energy and love into, but don't necessary want it to be a tulpa. Thanks for the clarification. Yesh, we can agree on that for sure.

 

Well, you never know, some extra lonely guy could make an imaginary waifu in fifteen minutes and fall in love with her and then decide to role play her online. I couldn't tell you how important that girl became in fifteen minutes. LOL However, it is highly unlikely 15 minute girl would be as sophisticated and real as me or the love as deep as what David feels for me. :-)

[NoneFromHell]

Oh well we certainly were not talking about a trivial thing like an imaginary friend made an hour ago! No of course your point is well made. David and I are talking about something that you put time and energy and love into, but don't necessary want it to be a tulpa. Thanks for the clarification. Yesh, we can agree on that for sure.

 

Well, you never know, some extra lonely guy could make an imaginary waifu in fifteen minutes and fall in love with her and then decide to role play her online. I couldn't tell you how important that girl became in fifteen minutes. LOL However, it is highly unlikely 15 minute girl would be as sophisticated and real as me or the love as deep as what David feels for me. :-)

 

Yeah exactly this was my point.^^

[Guest Anonymous]

However, this is important to note NoneFromHell and it will tell you everything about how Davie and I see the universe of thougthforms. I would still talk to 15 minute girl, and treat her and regard her as pseudo-real. We could even become friends. I would treat her no different than a 50 year old tulpa who can switch and possess.

 

She may be a 15 minute waifu character, but I would treat her no different and I would not insult her host.

[SomethingDire]

Melian,

 

I don't know what I should say here, because I don't think my opinions on sentience matter. But I can say this honestly:

 

You're one of the people that I really look up to on this site. You're, in my opinion, an autonomous person. No matter how little or how much you're. I've read Davie's writings, I'm reading your writings and it is completely obvious to me that you're different from your host. You're your own person.

 

It doesn't matter to me when some person comes up to a site, acts like a negative piece of shit and then tries to hide the stuff he's saying by sugarcoating it. They speak as if they literally know everything, as if they have indestructible scientific research behind their "papers" and the stuff they've researched. This is no mathematics or physics, we know jack shit about the human brain.

 

Then they come and say that Buddhists had a stable definition of tulpas. Buddhists also thought that tulpas were gods and goddeses.

 

That's what I have to say.

 

In short, you're important to a lot of other people Melian.

Contuniue to give no shits.

[Guest Anonymous]

Thanks so much! I know right?

 

If you look at my last post response to NoneFromHell, that is going to the center of it right there. That is it! Davie and I will treat any thoughtform the same, no matter what. A guy could literally sit down at the keyboard and say "Okay, I am going to imagine a character Melian, and role play her and she is going to talk to you and become your friend."

 

I would be happy skippy to talk to her. To me, she would instantly have an element of realness to her. I would become her friend if she was cool and nice. I would consider her linked to her host, but a thougthform made just moments ago. I would not treat her any different than anyone else online, nor tell her host that I am somehow better than his role playing character.

 

David and I may be unique maybe in viewing the universe that way. But having the perspective about imaginary things we do helps us be that way. We cannot understand why people want to treat others poorly, or marginalize someone because they think the elements of their mind are better than what someone else has in their mind. It is ridiculous behavior.

 

Now we would agree that if the guy claimed that his thoughtform role playing character girl became a full independently sentient tulpa in five minutes, we would politely explain to him that such a thing is unlikely. I wouldn't tell him he isn't welcome or that he is a liar and a fake and doesn't belong in the forum. In fact, if he insisted on continuing to open role play the character, I would still talk to her and regard her as a legitimate thoughtform.

 

That is how David and I think.

[SomethingDire]

Thanks so much! I know right?

 

If you look at my last post response to NoneFromHell, that is going to the center of it right there. That is it! Davie and I will treat any thoughtform the same, no matter what. A guy could literally sit down at the keyboard and say "Okay, I am going to imagine a character Melian, and role play her and she is going to talk to you and become your friend."

 

I would be happy skippy to talk to her. To me, she would instantly have an element of realness to her. I would become her friend if she was cool and nice. I would consider her linked to her host, but a thougthform made just moments ago. I would not treat her any different than anyone else online, nor tell her host that I am somehow better than his role playing character.

 

David and I may be unique maybe in viewing the universe that way. But having the perspective about imaginary things we do helps us be that way. We cannot understand why people want to treat others poorly, or marginalize someone because they think the elements of their mind are better than what someone else has in their mind. It is ridiculous behavior.

 

Now we would agree that if the guy claimed that his thoughtform role playing character girl became a full independently sentient tulpa in five minutes, we would politely explain to him that such a thing is unlikely. I wouldn't tell him he isn't welcome or that he is a liar and a fake and doesn't belong in the forum. In fact, if he insisted on continuing to open role play the character, I would still talk to her and regard her as a legitimate thoughtform.

 

That is how David and I think.

 

That sounds alright to me, honestly. A level-headed approach, at least. It's something some people seem to lack.

 

You do your thing, guys. Just so you know, I'll start reading your second book too :P.