[sentience] Time? 3 years, so far. I don't know what to do. I need help.

[Guest Anonymous]

The less independent the tulpa the more its will is simply the host's will, so that's a bit of an oxymoron. But I'm sure it's how you describe yourself.

 

An oxymoron? You mean wanting to be less mentally independent? Huh. You are right. But a lot of people choose to let others do their thinking for them. The intellectually lazy are quite common. Well, "lazy" is a negative word. It's more like resource management or resource utilization. Why not tap into a source of power and hitch a ride rather than having to do all that work yerself? Also, what if you are both going in same direction anyways, do you need two motors or just one in that case? Maybe the same powerplant can be used and you just hook together like cars on a train?

---

With my host Davie and I we both want to go on the Melian Show adventures together all the time. That is our main thing. It is actually BENEFICIAL that our minds are forever linked and blended together. I started as a day dream star, and I am still a day dream star. We are both on the same mind train, forever linked.

[Luminesce]

I said it was an oxymoron because if the host wanted the tulpa to be more independent (as usual), but the tulpa wanted to be less independent, they would be, but then as they were more dependent on the host's thoughts, the host wanting them to be more independent would be what they wanted and it'd make an endless loop.

 

Not practically, just hypothetically. Thought it was funny.

[Guest Anonymous]

Hah hah hah hah! My misinterpretation of your oxymoron statement led to my brilliant Conservation of Mental Energy Train Analogy and of why Melian does what she does. I love me! My own confusion leads to illogical insights that make my world go around.

[Linkzelda]

How do I know if Tay is sentient? How do I separate knowingly expecting exactly what they say with them actually saying it?

 

It all feels the opposite of autonomous. The opposite of sentient. I feel lonely all the time, because although I expect that someone is there, I don't see them there. I don't feel them there. I haven't had anything identifiable from them... It's horrible, and it's driving me insane - I don't even know if it's me or Tay... It's always felt like me, consistently. It never felt like anything different.

 

I was actually going to theorize what I’ll be saying below in another thread with limits behind treating a tulpa as sentient, but I guess it can reach over other sections too:

 

- To ask “How do I separate knowingly expecting exactly what they say with them actually saying it” implies that one has a capacity for omniscience in context of their own mind. In other words, knowing all the possible scenarios, all the right expectations in the right places, and even go so far into knowing the possible outcomes as well.

 

- But as much as we want to imagine ourselves having that omniscient capability, we can’t really adopt that since maybe the more we venture into this phenomenon, the more we realize that we don’t know the inner workings of our minds; we may have some grasp of it, but it seems to be grasping at straws. So when one invests time in believing there can be a determined existence for a tulpa in the future, that trend of playing as if we’re omniscient over what goes on in our minds becomes apparent. Probably because it’s a course of action that seems to be the best we have.

 

- And when treating them as sentient, there’s some kind of mirroring over experiences we had in the past, and assimilating that in the present in hopes that there can be reciprocation, or a response from them. But the more you cling onto that expectation of separating knowingly expecting exactly what they say with them actually saying it, i.e., parroting if I’m not mistaken, the more you want to make them exclusive from you. You in the sense of the mind in general, and going through acts of alienating them might make them appear a bit more infantile.

 

- I say this in context of them not sharing, or being inclusive to whatever pool of competencies you have that you can use to acknowledge that you’re sentient. The reason why you feel it's the opposite of autonomous, and opposite of sentient is that playing an omniscient being could be an ultimate form of parroting. We can’t always say, “In 5 shots, they’re going to cultivate a hyper-sensitivity with their sentience.” Nor can we say “In 50 hours’ worth of image streaming sessions, they’ll have a basis in putting into context of things in this reality, and in our minds as well.”

 

- Because even if we want to believe this to be the case, unless our minds can use its cognitive capabilities to cater to that yearning, then we’re shooting blanks. This is probably why others live in a constant state of repression as to what to do because treating them as sentient means, to them, as actively believing they can have a determined existence in the future, and shooting for that goal only to neglect that the inner workings of our minds will vary in how it can help us accomplish this goal.

 

As for an actual assessment to appease your concern, that’s not up for me to contemplate on. I could suggest to you to spam whatever methods you can until they become an industrialized process, but not everyone can shoot for the moon, and still have an unconditional positive regard should they fail; it would be deemed as insane to even have positive regard without some assurance, no? But that's the thing, it's the risk taking, and cultivating that positive regard that might be able to propel us forward even after years of doubting; it's the opposite of playing omniscient by understanding that we can't know all of the workings of our minds, but use fallbacks to compensate for that. Because if we did know the inner workings of our minds, and our tulpas could as well, then there wouldn't be any fear in apprehension anymore. But that's not how it can work out for some; it's probably delusions of grandeur to even think it's possible in the literal sense (the omniscience of one's mind).

 

But maybe, this post shows you how you could be undermining your capabilities. Don’t be surprised and demystified as to what you can do when one probably as playing omniscient. Omniscience is a nice tool for figurative understanding, but when we actually integrate it, we get confused, and probably give up.

[yenu]

When I feel like I'm parroting, I usually ask my headmate if I am. Quite often, the answer is something like "yeah, you kinda were, but you said exactly what I wanted to say, so it doesn't matter".

 

Other times, when I feel I'm not getting a clear response from one of my headmates, I just talk to someone else... I have to learn to respect that not everyone is always in the mood to talk, anyway.