Guide to Tulpa Control

[testing]

Reformatted version: here

 

This is the shortened version of the guide that only shows how to do possession and switching, the other guide has information on how to merge, and additional information such as more details on the process and a questions section. If you want to read that guide it is here. This shortened guide also has a pastebin if that is more convenient for you here <3

This guide is simply a shortened version of the guide that is shortened to 5 of the 13 sections taken directly.

A personal note, i have been switching for a while now and have used many different techniques, the one below is the one that i have found both effective and easy to explain compared to what the other things are. This is Version 1.0, and will be edited if need be. Im posting it because i have had a few people get good results with it.

Disclaimer

This guide requires a rather well developed tulpa, as it does put some strain on the host and tulpa. They should be sentient vocal and have had sufficient time to be comfortable in their own bodies before they use anyones besides theirs. Additionally do not attempt movements that put you or your tulpa at risk such as walking fast around your house at least until you are confident and trained that you can control the whole body. It is advised to train on your bed as well so if you fall you wont be injured as much

There is no set time that this guide and process will take, i have sped it up but it can be your first try (such as me) or it could take weeks who knows

 

Introduction:

I will first assume that you are aware of what switching is but in case you dont, it is when the tulpa can use the hosts body as if it were her own and the host is moved into a temporary mindform. This guide is made to allow for the host and tulpaes to switch much easier and smoother and also learn an easy method of possession following the same tecniques. If you are not at all willing to give your body to your tulpa temporarily, or permanantly as Koomer has done, then sadly this guide will not work for you. We do recommend reading Oguigis possession and the other switching guide as well, to increase your understanding of the processes involved with said methods. That being said the rest of the guide will be the real method

 

The Shortened Tulpa Guide to Easy Switching

 

 

Definitions:

Mindvoice: What you and your tulpa speak in to yourselves and each other

Possession: When a tulpa can control the hosts body

Switching: Switching places with the tulpa so the tulpa is in the place of the host and the host is in a tulpa state

Merging: In this version, it is when both tulpa and host as dominant with the mindvoices and can both control the body. Others refer to merging as merging wntire forms, usually permanently, as believed. This is not the merging described in the long version of the guide

 

Begin Switching

Get comfy, and have your tulpa nearby, sentience and vocality are required to do a switch with this method, so have your tulpa at that level first.

 

Step 1 Switch whos thoughts are dominant

This is very important and very useful to many many techniques of tulpa

Take a deep breath first and relax or whatever you like so you are comfortable

Normally people tell me that their voice is dominant, their voice is in the "front of their head," and their tulpas voice is in the "back of their head" or that they hear mostly their voice and some thoughts of their tulpa. The goal of this paragraph and step is to reverse that. Have your tulpas voice become dominant over yours in any way you like. If you can do that without any help then move on if you dont keep reading

 

>You can imagine your tulpas voice moving to the front of your head and yours move to the back

>You can make their voice louder and yours much more quiet

>You can imagine 2 orbs with 2 different colors, one smaller sized orb representing your tulpas mindvoices and one larger orb representing your own mindvoice(s), and have your tulpaes orb grow in volume while yours decreases in volume, or however you want

The 3 i mentioned are the methods that Ive told people to use but if you have a different method, that is no problem if you can get your tulpaes mindvoice as the dominant mindvoice you hear. This does not mean you should hear every word they say as words, think about how you think to yourself, you hear words, random thoughts and ideas wandering thoughts. It should be the same for your tulpa, and how they hear their tulpa voice, except their thoughts should be heard the same way you hear your own and yours should be how you hear your tulpa, bottom line is switch mindvoice dominance from yours to your tulpaes.

 

Please note the following

>If your tulpa is dominant, it will be harder for you to think, so the tulpa will have to do more work for the next few steps and it is advised to read the guide at least once before trying it so you know what youre doing

>Switching mindvoices does not mean you use her voice and the tulpa uses your real voice, it is switching places so that the tulpas is dominant, and is mentioned twice because it is important in this guide

>To confirm that you are doing it right, if you were asked a question about yourself, your tulpa should reply first before you reply, it just does that by itself, if you have that then you switched dominance and are doing it correctly. You also may try to do this to switch mindvoices, by having their reaction override your own speed.

>At this point i have been told the tulpas voice is much clearer than before so that is something to look for as well and a method of training vocality if you wish

 

Step 2 Possession

On the side if you havnt, check out Oguigi's guide for a nice introduction and description of possession and what it does

At this step you should be able to do a possession easier, either with this or Oguigi's method. You can use the mindvoice swap with her guide for likely better results in posessing.

 

Keep in mind that the brain is "supposed to send signals" that control the body so if your tulpa can send signals to your body just like you do then your tulpa can possess your body by using that. This can be done easier because your tulpaes thoughts are the dominant ones, so if they wish to lift an arm it will be easy to do so.

 

Another method is to think about how you move your arm, send that feeling to your tulpa or have them think about how they move their own body, and as the dominant mindvoice, they should be able to move your body quite easily without much effort at all. In other words have them send signals to your body while using your body. Try to have your tulpa move your arm while she is the dominant mondvoice, move it like you move it yourself

Its not anywhere close to impossible, you do it with yourself all the time, just by typing, so your tulpa can do the same thing. Just teach them how.

 

Step 3 Tulpa coming in your bodie

There are plenty of ways to do this and all of them work, but i will explain a simple and easy to understand method that is effective and that i have recommended to people.

Keep in mind that things such as exposing your back are unnecessary but will help for people that are new to switching and merging. Expose your front and back with no large objects stopping your path such as your chair, shirts and pants are fine but we go shirtless and with clothes so it doesnt make a difference. Get in a position where your tulpa can reach your chest. Regardless of form, have them sit on your lap for the time being, for the purpose of this guide.

Have them sit on your lap then have their body become and feel less opaque, or clearer, like less solid, just solid enough to slide into your body. You can do other methods to have them enter your body, such as imagining a hole in your back and having them slide in, it doesnt matter as long as it is the same result. Have her be almost "hook up" to your body parts. If they are not the same size or humanoid its the same concept and the process will still work, which i know because Hanyuu is a wormy even though humanoid or pony is easy for this. For example if they move their arm your arm should move as well and vice-versa and at the exact same time.

After that, they should be able to move your body as if it was possession, because it is in a way possession of your body except they can control it directly as if it were their own body. This should be made easier by having your mindvoices switched. Keep in mind everything here is normally reversible by doing the opposite techniques.

 

Step 4 Give your body to your tulpa

This is the hardest step so far from these as i have been told by people using this technique, but with your mindvoices switched, its not overly hard. It is very hard to explain however. Form a mindform body that looks like your own, and then pull your thoughts into the tulpa body. Imagine your "energy" flow directly from your real body into your tulpabody.

You can just jump consciousnesses directly into the body if you are able to do that way, its the same thing. Control your mindform in your own wonderland, it is the exact same process to control an irl tulpabody, make your voice in your irl voice both weaker and quieter, and make your tulpabodys voice stronger, the same strongness as a tulpas voice normally is. At this point, also, the tulpa should maintain you to some extents, because you are the tulpa and your tulpa is the host position. You will naturally maintain yourself of course but you dont need to think about maintaining yourself, your tulpa should do that more than your body in the state that its in as a tulpa.

 

Look with the bodies eyes and sense with the body senses just as tulpaes do with their body. You should be able to figure it out, just become the mindform, or have the mindform pull from your body but be sure that youre controlling it. It is a temporary body that should be formed from only your thoughts, just as a servitor styletype body. Theres plenty of ways to do this.

 

Once you have your consciousness and or thoughts in the mindform body, your tulpa should be able to weakly control your body at first and will get stronger at it, or or will be able to strongly control your body right away. This is done because your tulpa is the only one left in your body so all movements that the body does are hers now and not yours. That is all you need to do. Keep practicing that until you are comfortable switching.

 

An example scene of switching that you can get an idea of what to look for is this: Tulpa is in your form using your body typing on your computer while you talk sit back by your wall talking to your tulpa and talking to them with a mindvoice like a/the tulpaes.

 

H: From the tulpaes point of view, it should be like the hostmasters normal point of view, meaning they should use the body just as if it were their own, as well as have full access to all 5 senses provided by the body. They should also hear the host as he would hear a normal tulpa. Also i repeat that not all thoughts are to translated into english and you should hear thoughts just as your hostmaster does. I mean that you should also hear thought ramblings and subconscious thoughts.

 

Some people have said that their mindform is unstable at first when you switch, pull your mindform out just as normal and have in in a low movement setting, and have it sit quietly and watch, then after you can switch, work on making your mindform more stable, just like developing a tulpas body. It is the exact same process regarding the body forming and form. Also as a tulpa your senses may be blurrier and harder to distinguish what is felt with your senses. That is normal, it is not always fixed, because that is how a tulpa body works, it is a little less vivid from what we have found with our personal experience with it, but you can try to work on it and make it clearer by focusing on it or other methods in order to accomplish this task here.

 

Step 5 Undoing possession, switching, and merging, the most important step

Step 6 in the first guide is this step if you look at the numbers, step 5 in the first guide is merging but it is cut out in the guide so the numbers are as they are. Why is it the most important step? If you dont do this step your tulpa may feel tired, sometimes, even a little out of it. Dont worry if this happens, from what ive heard its somewhat normal but its a thing easily fixable. it is likely not overly harmful as it will usually return to normal soon. If you dont switch for very long times such as days or weeks and if you know what you are doing then it should also not be a problem. If you are newer to switching, and afterward your tulpa feels fatigued, again dont worry, its easy to fix. Imagine them exiting your body and back into theirs, its that simple but if your tulpa ever gets tired after switching or whatnot this is the solution. This should be done at the end of most or almost all switching sessions, moreso if you are beginning to learn to switch, to keep things simple on switching.

 

Simply do what you did in reverse, its much easier to undo it than redo because the host is more attached to his body than the tulpa so he/she will return to the body in due time, even more so and faster if he undoes the switching. Oguigi and Koomer dont count because of their case. If you can become the dominant mindvoice again then separating the tulpa from your body the same way it entered, then switching and merging is pretty easy to break, very easy infact, easy enough to the point where it will probably break on its own and return to normal with your tulpa in its body and you in yours. Unswitching manually just removes possible questions.

Both I and someone else using my methods have had our tulpaes get the tired feels at least once, and when we unswitched it returned to normal without much difficulty from either the host nor the tulpa

Notes:

This guide is still under work, if you find any errors, have any questions or comments, do post them below.

Edited September 26, 2020 by Ranger
Fixed the reformatted link.

[Linkzelda]

Okay, I tried to reformat this guide in an attempt to salvage the actual use this guide has if grammar mistakes, spelling errors, and run-ons were eradicated. GAT members, please let me know what you think about this, and whether or not it’s any better than the original. And of course, if there's any errors in this format, feel free to address as soon as you can.

 

I tried my best to make sure I followed along OP’s line of logic (like his circular reasoning, but trying to reduce redundancy), and I hope I didn’t destroy that completely here. If it still doesn’t look decent enough, oh well, I tried!

 

 

________________________________________________________

 

Guide to Tulpa Control

 

By: Testing

Co-author/editor: Linkzelda

 

 

This is a concise version of the guide that only shows how to do possession and switching. The other guide has information on how to merge, and additional information such as more details on the process and a questions section. If you are interested in reading that guide, you can find it here here.

 

This guide also has a pastebin here if that is more convenient for you.

 

A personal note, I have been switching for a while now, and have utilized many techniques. The one below is the one I have found to be both effective and easy to explain compared to others. This is Version 1.0, and will be edited if needed. I’m posting this because I’ve had a few anecdotal cases of people making strides with this.

 

Disclaimer:

 

It’s suggested that one has a very developed tulpa because it does put some strain for both the host and tulpa. Your tulpa should be sentient, vocal, and had experiential learning to be comfortable in their own body before taking dominion over their host’s body. Please read this guide first before attempting switching because this is to ensure that you know the entirety of the process to prevent any mishaps.

 

Additionally, do not attempt movements that put you or your tulpa at risk (i.e. walking too fast around your house). You and your tulpa have to be confident and accustomed in controlling the whole body. It is highly suggested that you train on your bed so that in case you fall, you won’t be in a major risk. There is no procedural or fixed process in this, and how one achieves the breakthroughs varies.

 

Introduction:

 

This guide presumes that the reader is aware of what switching is. But in case you haven’t, it is when the tulpa can have more dominion over the host’s body, and the host shifts into imaginary senses. This guide is formatted to allow both host and tulpas to switch easier and smoothly. It also can be utilized as a method of possession if you follow the same concepts.

 

It is suggested that one should read Oguigi’s Possession guide, and other switching guides as well. This is to ensure that you increase your understanding of the processes involved. With that said, let’s cover some words to know before you read this guide.

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Words to Know:[/align]

 

Mind-voice: Where the host and tulpa utilize an internal voice for communicating with each other.

 

Possession: When a tulpa can control parts, or most of the host’s body.

Switching: This is where the tulpa shifts into controlling the host’s body while the host shifts their awareness towards imaginary senses.

 

Merging: In this version, it is when both tulpa and host are capable of simultaneously controlling the body, and interacting with their mind-voice. Others may refer to merging as merging entire forms (usually permanently). However, this is not how merging is described in the longer version of the guide.

 

So now that you’ve been informed of common terminology, let’s get started.

 

[align=center]

The Concise Guide to Easy Switching[/align]

 

[align=center]

Begin Switching

[/align]

You want to make sure that you’re comfy, have your tulpa nearby, and that your tulpa is sentient and vocal. The reason being is having some level of consistent communication can reduce the chances of major risks and unwanted occurrences.

 

Step 1: Decide On Who Will Hold More Control Over the Body

 

This is very important, and very useful to many tulpa-related activities/techniques. You should take a deep breath, and utilize whatever mode you prefer to become relaxed and comfortable. Normally, people tell me that their mind-voice/voice is dominant, or louder while their tulpa’s voice is heard in the background (but how much one hears their own voice and tulpa’s varies). The goal of this particular step is to reverse this.

 

You want to be receptive to your tulpa’s voice, and you should utilize whatever mode of process to achieve this. If you can achieve more inward focus on your tulpa’s voice than yours, then move on.

 

One method of utilizing symbolism you may want to consider as a supplement to conceptualize this is:

 

Imagine for a moment of two orbs with two different colors. One is a smaller orb that represents your tulpa’s mind-voice, and the larger orb represents your own mind-voice. Now, have your tulpa’s orb grow in volume while yours decreases. Keep doing so until you’re capable of sustaining inward attention to your tulpa’s mind-voice.

 

Please note: What I mentioned above is a method I’ve told others that they could use, but if you have your own method, feel free to do so. As long as the end result allows you to have more inward focus of your tulpa’s mind-voice, take this method as a supplement. The bottom line is to have their voice become more apparent in your awareness.

 

Step 2: Possession

 

Note: If you haven’t already, check out Oguigi’s guide for a nice introduction to conceptualize the process of possession.

 

By the end of this step, you and your tulpa should be able to conceptualize and easily perform possession; this can be achieved either through this method or Oguigi’s.

 

One way to conceptualize the process of possession is:

 

• Try to move your arm, and also imagine your tulpa as the one that will be able to emulate this as well with their own body.
  
• Then allow them to develop an experiential learning to be capable enough to control your arm/boy part(s) (i.e. using pre-existing muscle memories for instance)

 

• Try to sustain more inward focus of your tulpa’s mind-voice as both of you are going through the motions with this mode of symbolism. Keep going through these mannerisms until you’re able to sustain an active imagination that your tulpa’s movement of their body part(s) will transcend to yours.

 

• If you’re having difficulty with this, you can move your arm up a little, and then have it remain still. Then you want to continue with imagining your tulpa (mind-voice and all) taking control of that. Even if you feel as if you’re moving your arm all by yourself, reinforce the symbolism simultaneously with the movement.

 

The idea is to get into the habit of imagining your tulpa doing so to allow the mind to develop predispositions from the imagery, active imagination, and inward attention of your tulpa’s mind-voice. The more you practice this, the easier it may be for your tulpa to utilize those predispositions/tendencies/reflexes for performing possession.

 

[align=center]

Step 3: Preparing Your Tulpa to Take Control of Your Body [/align]

 

There are many ways to go about this, and they all have varying levels of effectiveness, but I will explain what I feel is simple and easy in accomplishing this step.

 

• You want to expose your front and back with no large objects blocking your path (i.e. chair). Shirts and pants are fine, but it’s suggested to be shirtless for this, and as for clothes worn below the chest, it doesn’t matter.

 

• Now, get in a position where your tulpa can reach your chest. Do not worry about the form, so to follow along the purpose of this guide, have them sit on your lap for the time being.

 

• Try to imagine your tulpa’s body becoming more transparent/less opaque while you imagine them sliding into your body. You can utilize other forms of symbolism that correlates to them entering your body, such as (but not limited to):

 

• Imagine a hole in your back, and have them slide into it. It doesn’t matter what method you use as long as it achieves the end result of you going through the motions of imagining them entering your body.

 

• Then imagine them “hooking” up to your body parts. If their size isn’t relative to yours (e.g. humanoid, wormy composition), the concepts will still apply and work. Speaking from experience, Hanyuu was able to do so despite of her wormy composition.

 

 

This is to be consistent with what I wanted you to conceptualize as having their arms moving in tandem with yours. This is where having inward attention to their mind-voice is vital for developing predispositions for the end goal of them utilizing those habits/reflexes/movement.

 

Step 4: Have Your Tulpa Take Control of Your Body

 

I will do my best to explain how to conceptualize this process, so please bear with me:

 

• Imagine a body similar to your own, and then shift your thoughts and awareness towards that mental manifestation of yourself. Another helpful point is to imagine emulating sensations of yourself shifting from your real body to your imaginary body (i.e. feeling an energy flow during the shift, or whatever mode of symbolism that can accomplish this).

 

• Become more familiar with your imaginary body and senses.

 

• Try to make your physical voice weaker and quieter while imagining your tulpa’s voice becoming stronger in reality.

 

• At this point, your tulpa should be able to sustain dominance of your body to some extent because you’re applying more inward focus on imaginary senses while they become accustomed to senses in reality.

 

• Don’t worry about having to sustain your real body, so keep going through the implications and mannerisms of knowing your tulpa can sustain dominance of your real body

 

• Try to imagine yourself being able to see through your real eyes that would be similar to your tulpa seeing your perception in their imaginary body.

 

• Once you have better inward concentration on your imaginary senses and awareness within your imagined body, your tulpa should be able to control your body. They may seem to have less control of your body at first, but they will gradually become accustomed to it. Or they may be able to easily control your body right away.

 

In theory, because you have your attention on imaginary senses rather than your real senses, your tulpa can presumably have an easier time being proficient with those real sensory perception. That is all you and your tulpa needs to do, so keep practicing to develop a stronger experiential learning until you’ve made a breakthrough and are comfortable switching.

 

One more example of conceptualizing switching and/or possession:

 

• Your tulpa has more control of your body typing on your computer while you talk to your tulpa with your mind-voice. Try to practice how to empathetically be in the position of your tulpa communicating with you if they shifted to their imaginary form.

 

Here’s what Hanyuu has to say about this…

 

Hanyuu: From my perspective as a tulpa, it should be like the host’s normal point of view, or how they view their perception of reality. This means having proficiency in accessing all 5 senses, and they should try to hear their host’s mind-voice that would be similar to a tulpa using their mind-voice as a mode of communication.

 

You should also take into consideration that not all thoughts can be translated to your primary language (i.e. English). Try to conceptualize this experience as being receptive to certain thoughts that the host wouldn’t typically be aware of (i.e. subconscious ramblings).

 

For hosts shifting to imaginary senses: Some individuals have declared that their imaginary body is unstable at first when you switch. So one way to resolve this issue is to pull from your imaginary body, and to be in a situation where it has little to no movement. Do whatever you feel is practical to sustain a more stable imaginary body, and then after you can switch, keep sustaining your body just like developing a tulpa’s body.

 

For tulpas shifting to real senses: As a tulpa shifting to your host’s body and senses, things may be a bit blurry, and harder to distinguish real vs. imaginary. This is normal, and speaking from experience, it is a little less vivid, but you can try to work on it by utilizing whatever methods to have better clarity in visualization.

 

[align=center]

Step 5: Shifting Awareness Back to Your Real Body/Having More Control over Your Body

[/align]

 

You may feel tired, and maybe even a little out of it. However, don’t worry about this because based on anecdotal cases, this is easily fixable. Simply imagine your tulpa exiting your body, and back to their imaginary body. As long as you didn’t switch for a very long time (e.g. days/weeks/months), and/or you know what you’re doing, this shouldn’t be a problem.

 

Notes:

 

This guide is still a work in progress, so if you find any errors, or have any questions and/or comments, please post below.

[Sands]

Well first of all Linkzelda. Now that thing is actually in English and because you asked of the formatting, not sure about the center tags. Unfortunately it still is nothing but symbolism, so I doubt I will be approving of that one either.

 

That and you are actually going to need testing's approval for us to start approving this rewritten guide and replace his gibberish with this one. It's not really kosher to go around doing this stuff without someone's permission, changing their words into something they might not mean and such.

[Linkzelda]

Oh, it's kind of obvious I would need OP's permission to implement it, and it wasn't as if I wasn't going to aim to contact him, or anyone that may know him personally via IRC or some other medium. In fact, whatever the outcome would be for this would probably take a long time to contact OP in the first place, but it's just for the sake of suggestions in the past that maybe other members could reformat some things without trying to lose things in translation.

 

And there are others who've made edits to certain guide submissions like here for instance. Fortunately, OP didn't mind, but if it was the other way around, that other user would receive the same kosher 101. And I remember mayormorgan's suggestion in the independence guide I think with aarix for a re-edit. And I figured that part of the GAT system is to not really apply objective standpoints on the efficacy of the guide (since they'll all be subjective at best), but rather spelling, reading comprehension, and other aspects.

 

The only way it wouldn't be kosher is if staff changed the OP without informing the guide maker (since I can't edit the OP), but this reformat is simply there for testing as an option, nothing to be integrated if he doesn't want it there. There hasn't been any claim for ownership, and if there are parts that might not correlate with OP's line of logic, well, that's the beauty of them adding on to the discussion of their thread to improve or leave it to dust. But if they're nonexistent in this forum, rest assured that nothing will be implemented in the future.

 

 

Even if the reformat ever gets an update for approval from the other 7 GAT members (and 8 including my approval of the reformat with any needed revisions of course), it would still remain in the Guide Submissions since we would have to contact OP and get his approval. I think at this point to give kosher 101 to other members, especially when the GAT system wants its representatives to be ready for things like this, is an overstatement.

[Sands]

Just because you rewrote it doesn't mean you did something wrong. But the thing is, we can't really do anything with your version until testing replaces his guide with that. When dealing with an user who doesn't really hang out on the forums that much anymore, it might be better to ask them first. In most other cases the author can reply right away, but here it's going to be a lot more difficult. We don't even know if testing really cares anymore.

 

But unfortunately the guide still remains as nothing but symbolism, which is so personal that a guide based on nothing but it isn't the most helpful guide around. I don't think any guide that was purely symbolism has gotten through yet. In fact, the reason for their disapproval has been the symbolism.

[Linkzelda]

Well, let’s imagine for a moment of the intention of this guide. OP is trying to accomplish a guide on switching, and acknowledging that the concepts of possession can be used a transient mode of progress for switching. And with any guide submission that talks about possession or switching in particular, symbolism is inevitable, so it’s pretty much moot to state that guide submissions that are purely (or have a mélange/combination of) symbolism haven’t been approved as yet.

 

And before I did the attempt at reformatting it, OP clearly acknowledged that other methods (i.e. other forms of symbolism) can be utilized to achieve the end result for the steps. He was combining a conceptual framework by explaining why certain forms of symbolism (i.e. the ball decrease/increase analogy/metaphor/symbolism) may help achieve the end result (which were laid out if one took the time to read through and filter some things out). It was to have the reader finding another way to conceptualize the process (i.e. the hook symbolism to achieve the end result of going through the mannerisms of one’s tulpa “entering” their body, just for the sake of playing along with the guide’s intention; OP knew it wouldn’t work out for most, which is why they suggested they (the reader) could formulate something of their own to correlate with the end result).

 

Now, in order for anyone to state that a guide purely on symbolism (or a combination of them rather) has yet to be approved is a matter of their opinions on all submissions approved so far. All submissions are ad hoc claims from the guide makers, they all encroach symbolism/metaphors/analogies/etc. for the sake of hopefully contributing to others conceptualizing the rudiments better. It raises the question on whether or not the ends justify the means (i.e. the symbolism(s) utilized to conceptualize the end result would be compromised/plausible). Since that’s pretty much what we’ve been doing for all submissions to some level (excluding those gargantuan conceptual guides that just redirect to other guides of symbolism).

 

As for the kosher 101 you’re giving me again, I’ve already established that nothing (like the reformat) will be implemented if OP never responds to accept and replace it. And I’ve already responded to things you’ve stated like “it would be nice to ask them before” and all that are just overstatements because one of the intentions of the GAT system is to give constructive alternatives in advance (along with other forms of criticisms and critique of course). There’s no demand on my end for OP to change it immediately, it’s just one of the implied benefits they have at their disposal to have GAT members contribute into group thinking.

 

If testing doesn’t want to be part of that group thinking that’s implied for all guide submissions, he is free to ignore one approach I’ve given so far. We’re not changing anything within their submissions until we get permission, and all alternatives (i.e. that reformat I did) is merely one of many options testing has. So holding back those abilities of GAT to contribute with group thinking to see if the submissions can be improved in some way (i.e. constructive feedback/criticism/etc.) seems to defeat one of the premises behind the GAT system.

 

Like you’ve stated, just because I did the reformat, it doesn’t mean there’s something necessarily wrong with it. If we have to ask OP in all submission entries beforehand that we would be giving constructive feedback/criticism/alternatives/approaches/etc., it would take a really long time to get any guide submission approved.

 

If I or any other GAT member and community member cannot contact testing for more discussion, we’ll simply leave the reformat to dust. And ultimately, the submission to be left in the guide submissions. You’re more worried about how it’s not proper to give constructive approaches even though that’s what the GAT system promotes. As long as the reformat isn’t implemented without OP’s permission, we’re just going to be getting our jimmies rustled for doing what's expected of us in situations where the grammar/spelling/etc. is horrible in a guide submission (whether the OP is active or inactive).

 

As for it being purely symbolism, you're right, it's a given that not all explanations of symbolism will work for everyone. But that's when the other elements of the GAT system that takes into consideration of the testimonials/anecdotal cases of individuals in the past, present, and future cases that did work for them. If one wants to argue that not all testimonials would be convincing enough, or some bullshit reason like that, then maybe you should challenge that part of the GAT system and rules to potentially be removed.

[waffles]

so it’s pretty much moot to state that guide submissions that are purely (or have a mélange/combination of) symbolism haven’t been approved as yet.

Oguigi's guide is not purely symbolic. In fact, the entire main body of the guide passes with no symbolism whatsoever.

 

 

Now, in order for anyone to state that a guide purely on symbolism (or a combination of them rather) has yet to be approved is a matter of their opinions on all submissions approved so far.

If you think that a purely symbolic guide has been approved then you should say so and make it clear that it should be unapproved. Pure symbolism does not make a valid guide to go in Guides; this is in the announcement at the top and the 'New Guides' post in GAT Discussion, so I'd damn well hope you knew that already.

 

 

As for it being purely symbolism, you're right, it's a given that not all explanations of symbolism will work for everyone. But that's when the other elements of the GAT system that takes into consideration of the testimonials/anecdotal cases of individuals in the past, present, and future cases that did work for them. If one wants to argue that not all testimonials would be convincing enough, or some bullshit reason like that, then maybe you should challenge that part of the GAT system and rules to potentially be removed.

No, the reasons against symbolism aren't that. It's not that they're not potentially effective, it's that it's trivial to come up with your own, personal symbolism which will almost always be more effective for being personal.

 

 

 

If this does turn into a more lengthy discussion that's not directly related to this guide then we can split these posts into GAT Discussion I guess.

[Linkzelda]

Oguigi's guide is not purely symbolic. In fact, the entire main body of the guide passes with no symbolism whatsoever.

 

With how they made it clear in their disclaimer that “the mind is an abstract place,” that’s already setting up many implications for symbolism and metaphysics on what the mind/consciousness/etc. really is. I have no problem with that seeing how they know there isn’t a single way of doing/conceptualizing something. It’s just adding on to how most submissions will have symbolism to some extent. But to say it has no shred of symbolism is a matter of opinion, so I’ll just leave it at that.

 

If you think that a purely symbolic guide has been approved then you should say so and make it clear that it should be unapproved. Pure symbolism does not make a valid guide to go in Guides; this is in the announcement at the top and the 'New Guides' post in GAT Discussion' date=' so I'd damn well hope you knew that already.[/quote']

 

I just see it as a guide submission, seeing how most submissions are categorized there until they’re shifted to their respective categories. Though it shouldn’t really be something that requires me to inform others that it’s purely symbolic when they know it is. Which means other GAT members should see this as a potential Tips & Tricks submission. If there were implications that I only wanted this reviewed for a potential “Guides” shift, that was not the case. I am more than happy to change my vote for Tips & Tricks, but seeing how others will disapprove of the OP either way due to grammar and spelling issues, seeing it in the framework of a potential Tips & Tricks wouldn’t be needed.

 

But like you’ve stated, and what I’ve already read from the announcements and the New Guides section beforehand, since others would disapprove of this for Guides, it’s already implied that this would be considered as a potential Tips & Tricks submission. Though I figured that since previous GAT comments that disapproved of the guide submission in general, it would be kind of futile since they feel the guide submission (that could be shifted to Tips & Tricks, or whatever the majority agrees) on would be futile.

 

So it’s something that I hope other GAT members read as well, instead of just saying “disapprove because of symbolism", even though purely symbolic submissions can easily be reviewed in the mindset of Tips & Tricks:

 

 

 

Tips and Tricks, the division should be whether or not they outline a proper method. If they don't actually give instruction, or the instruction is purely symbolism, it belongs in Tips and Tricks. There's obviously a big grey zone in which case the guide writer should be allowed to decide, or maybe edit the guide. Basically the same criteria apply to tips as do to guides.

 

This is why I went ahead and offered a constructive alternative for OP, despite of their presumed long-term inactivity. It had potential to be edited for a Tips & Tricks submission, and with what I stated to Sands on how that only depends on whether or not testing wants to extend on my reformat, or accept/reject it, it's already implied.

 

Though I guess Sands implied the reformat was for “Guides,” but seeing how I’ve agreed with him that it’s symbolic (but I disagreed that it does have some instruction with explaining the concept behind it all), it’s implied that he should also review this as a potential Tips & Tricks. I hope he read that as well, because I already did (which is why I went ahead with the reformat either way). And if he did, then awesome!

 

 

No' date=' the reasons against symbolism aren't that. It's not that they're not potentially effective, it's that it's trivial to come up with your own, personal symbolism which will almost always be more effective for being personal.[/quote']

 

 

So you’re saying that people that created their own symbolism, but also clearly laid out a decent instruction (not implying this submission does that really well at all) could also be potentially trivial. Well if that’s the case, maybe there should be more groundwork on settling more distinctions from that, because how I’m seeing it in short is:

 

- Guide submissions with only symbolic references and no steps/instructions (which this guide submission is implied to fit in that category) goes to Tips & Tricks. But since it has horrible grammar and spelling, it’s pretty much not going to happen until it’s fixed. But since this guide submission that's potentially a Tips & Tricks shift has a clear step-by-step instruction, we have to settle on whether or not this "concise guide" (that's really long for a Tips & Tricks) could be viewed as an intermediate for Tips & Tricks, or guides.

 

- Guide submissions with purely symbolic explanations with instructions (i.e. numbered steps), with no major grammatical or spelling errors could potentially be between a “Guide” or “Tips & Tricks” if certain aspects are reviewed (i.e. longer, explained submissions that focuses on one aspect, like switching, could be considered Guides rather than Tips & Tricks)

 

 

And anything beyond that is talking about Guides and Resources, but seeing how this guide submission isn’t going to be in “Guides” at all (based on the current opinions and more that may agree to them), maybe we should tackle those two concepts I’ve presented above. And I’ve emailed testing, and PMed him as well, and if he doesn’t respond, oh well.

 

If this does turn into a more lengthy discussion that's not directly related to this guide then we can split these posts into GAT Discussion I guess.

 

Oh nah, I’ve pretty much stated my points, so I won’t be arguing. But you are free to split it since people might want to explain any points I've mentioned that I will probably have to clarify to them better as well.

[waffles]

Alright, if that's your intent here then I'm fine with that. Just one clarification and then I'm done:

 

So you’re saying that people that created their own symbolism, but also clearly laid out a decent instruction (not implying this submission does that really well at all) could also be potentially trivial.

No, not at all. The symbolism itself is always trivial but the method is not. If they gave non-symbolic instruction then that fulfils the criterion for Guides.

[schlondark]

Disapproving based on formatting and spelling errors.

>Fake Greentext has no place here.

[Guest Anonymous]

Nope.