Sudden change of style and internal models of other people. Good or bad idea?

[Guest]

I've been narrating for at least a month and a half, but my tulpa still doesn't talk. Most of my narration is internal, and it's usually not very censored and a lot of it is just my stream of thought slightly directed to the tulpa. I sometimes feel emotional responses about certain things, but it's rare. I tend to just talk about anything, without trying to hide anything as I always considered myself an open book to the tulpa, but this style of narration sometimes feels very much like talking to myself, but not always. I do sometimes go off on tangents and explain a lot of things in detail when narrating to my tulpa, beyond what I would explain to myself when just thinking as some things are just obvious to me (to show an example difference between how the regular stream of thought and my current narration goes).

 

Tonight, I was watching this one show and it suddenly hit me that if my tulpa was a real person, one who didn't know my memories and with the traits and personality that I conceived for her (if she acted like it), I wouldn't be talking to her about everything in my stream of thought, but instead, act more like a real person and be shy about some things and even if she could read my mind and intentions still treat her a bit differently than how I do when I direct my stream of thought to her. Once the idea hit me, my tulpa's presence was felt very real, like she was with me right now, and I was quite a lot more careful about how I say things and how I word them. I felt very naked/exposed mentally when I imagined that a different person than me, even one without any/many memories prior, would be listening to what I have to say to them and still understanding what was going on in my subconscious.

 

While this way of communicating with the tulpa feels a bit strange, it also makes the tulpa seem far more real as I'm treating it like it would be a real personality behind it (which I assume), and I could feel the tulpa's "presence" far more better while I was talking like this. Emotional interaction also feels far more real because I don't just expect the tulpa to have the same exact thoughts and emotions as me while I converse, that my mind expects them to differ in opinions.

 

There are 2 main worries for me here: one is that since I had honesty/truth as my tulpa's traits and promised her that I would be honest/truthful as well, I didn't censor my thoughts about anything at all, but not doing so makes my thoughts seem more like my own and less like a dialogue, the other worry is that if I'm engaging the narration and treating the personality as absolutely real, I will be constantly modeling and expecting the tulpa's feelings, which might result in parroting, even if subconscious, but maybe that's just how tulpae work - you subconsciously build a model and the model takes a life of its own becoming independent of my own will.

A third minor worry is that I am limiting/censoring my conscious verbal thinking a bit to better suit the eventual dialogue.

 

Thus the main question is:

Is this partial subconscious modeling of the tulpa's attitude/response/emotional responses and so on a good thing that leads to the tulpa's development or is it dangerous and would lead to parroting? The latter case was another reason why I tried to not think too hard about what my tulpa would think or what my tulpa would respond to or how she could react to my narration (or at least, limited this modeling as much as I could, leaving it as "I don't know what my tulpa would do, but if she sticks to her personality traits, she might be thinking this or that") - even if such modeling is something we have to do when talking to real people so that we interact with them. I've been suppressing this modeling when dealing with my tulpa because I was afraid of parroting, but it's something I would be doing if I was talking to a real person (trying to understand them so I could better communicate with them), however if the tulpa isn't talking back yet, is there any harm in not modeling it as a person? Feels like a double edged sword, either I'm risking making a subconsciously parroted servitor at worst or I'm supressing their development if their own mind's bootstraps depend on us first modeling and thinking about how they would act (consciously and subconsciously), until they can act.

 

To those with vocal tulpae, how much of this subconscious modeling did you do? Did you try to understand how your tulpa would behave or what she/he/it would think about what you're narrating to them? Did you try to censor your speech to them so as to treat them closer to a real person because you knew how they would react if you told them something in particular that they could for example, disagree with?

[Phi]

Allow me first to say that talking to your tulpa via telepathy will result in slower sentience. Additionally, you shouldn't be expecting full out vocalization if you have not yet worked on their voice. Whether you have done this or not, I don't know/recall.

You don't have to think "my tulpa would probably react like this". If you did the personality stage correctly (assuming you followed FAQ's guide), then the personality is already set in your sub-c, and no longer needs constant attention. You are not working on your tulpa's personality anymore, you are trying to trick your brain into thinking that that personality is real. In other words, you are tricking yourself into thinking that the person who that personality belongs to is with you.

Now, saying this, it is not bad to think "my tulpa may think this...", because you do that while you talk to other people. "They probably think I'm an idiot now", etc. As long as you don't do it obsessively, I see no problem with it. If you do this obsessively, though, it could slow (but not stop) sentience. You might be letting your brain know, "REMEMBER, this person isn't real!" Though, this is just a bit of speculation. I'm sure that, eventually, you will get sentience either way.

As for your worry of keeping things from your tulpa, don't worry. That'll just help with the tricking your mind thing, since you probably don't tell everybody everything. Also, doing this will not destroy your tulpa's honest/truthful trait.

[FigN01]

You clearly took a step in the right direction as long as it's one that makes the tulpa more believable to you as real person. That's the bottom line, regardless of anything else. You just have to go with what feels right and make corrections along the way.

 

As for parroting, it's hard to tell for certain in early development. Some of what you say might be parroting, but there's nothing wrong with it as long as you're doing your best to listen for genuine responses. You have to learn to catch yourself when you're saying something in place of your tulpa, and that will get easier the more you practice and see more sentience.

 

It might help if you try more approaches than just narrating to see what else might elicit some good responses. Trawl through the forums, and you'll end up picking out some that sound good to you for sure.

[ThatOneGuy]

I don't think that modeling what certain responses might be could hurt that much, honestly. If anything you're only standing to develop the tulpa further, and like Fig said that's what's important here.

 

With Clair, I modeled a little bit but I quickly stopped because it didn't feel right to me. I just talked to Clair about things like she was fully sentient and could understand.

Clair: Even though I couldn't understand everything, the point got across and I began to form my own responses.