Talking issues, motivation, and shame.

[Jadedhourglass]

Hello everyone. This should have been posted a long time ago, but I never got around to it. This is about me, and my tulpa, Star.

You see, we started our journey around early January, and at first I did a hour everyday of personality work, and passive talking whenever I could. It was good at first, I got a really good real response two weeks in, in which they suggested that I talk to a friend of mine over something troubling me. Another time in which I got a response on their favourite color too(It's purple by the way).

However, over time, once I felt satisfied working on personality, I thought I should start working on being able to visualize them well. However, I never found the motivation for it. I did it once or twice, but slowly stopped working on it all together. With that, our passive forcing died out as well..i began only saying hello once or twice a day at all, or maybe saying a couple sentences about my day.I felt like shit for it. I care for Star, I really do. I've been thinking about having a tulpa for months before and I know I'm more then ready, but have to push past the motivation barrier. I've apologized many times, promising that we would push through this gunk eventually. But that isn't even the main problem. This is what the main problem is.

Essentially, my mind is overactive. By that, I mean it can do entire sentences on it's own, and has done that my whole life. When I get tired and close my eyes, sometimes I can literally hear in my head multiple people holding on a nonsensical conversation, me controlling none if at all of what they are saying, and just observing it as I drift off. Basically, slowly, my mind fell into a big problem. It began filling in for Star. I began expecting responses, which I know is probably toxic but I did. My mind seeing this, would immediately begin responding. Say I say hello to Star. I consciously realize they should probably say hi back in a millisecond and my mind automatically says hello back, me putting barley no effort in. This was a big reason we began talking less. I'd keep getting all these responses, which I can't really explain but I know it's cause my mind knows I expect responses from it, even though I don't want it to happen, and in a snap gives me a generic response. There were even times I can feel Star is getting exasperated by a gut feeling in my stomach because even if they truly wanted too they couldn't get a word in cause my dumbass conscious is screaming a response everytime I open my mouth. Or the times my mind and tulpa would respond, and literally at the same time I get two answers! I seriously can't explain the phenomena and it's really irritating I can't put it in words. In the shortest, most bestest way I can, essentially, even I don't want it too, and I'm trying to get it to stop, my mind is saying stuff for star cause I want star too and yet not want it too(my mind). Does any of this make sense?

Also, another problem is that my mind sometimes makes Star seem like they are saying some nasty stuff and I'm worried cause maybe they will start acting like that once they do become sentient. Stuff like "Oh shut up." "Your disgusting." Just generally really mean and sometimes even violent sentences and I know it's only because I have a overactive mind. Any ways to make sure they don't take this on?

 

Finally, any motivation ideas? Cause my motivation is horrible, but I need to do this. For Star, and for us. It's set in my mind, I know I'm ready and that I want this, I just need more drive. (Sorry this was so long by the way) Thank you so much!!!!

[Drakaina]

I think I understand what you're saying about the responses. You'll say something to your tulpa and your mind processes it and spits out a response so fast you may not even be done saying what you're saying.

I have this problem, so I'm afraid I have no advice or any ideas how to help with either problem. The responses or motivation. I'll be looking forward to reading the responses too.

[J.Iscariot]

What I am about to say does not only apply to tulpamancy, it applies to everything and anything you can think of.

 

So, here you are, OP. You're in the forcing developmental phase of tulpamancy, and you don't seem to be getting many answers if any that are legitimately, and without a doubt, from your tulpa. More than that, the time takes it toll and it seems like people get discouraged after a while, which is something to expect from anyone who puts efforts in this practice without much results or any. Logically speaking, one could say that there is no reason to be motivated. But I want to get a bit into this.

 

I don't wish to talk of myself and take this elsewhere, but I used to be a bad student. Absolutely shitty, I could not commit to my studies and would end up failing even though my teachers told me that I had such good potential, that I was one of those smart guys with potential but that I did not use that potential and thus lacked the capacities to succeed. That was a thread to my scholar life. One day, I realized how detrimental it all was, so I stopped doing the things I enjoyed. I alienated myself from what I loved doing. Playing games? Forget about it. I'd spend all day on my bed (yes I studied on my bed) solving exercises. Ignoring what I wanted to do, telling myself that studying was THE key to success, that I could do whatever I wanted to do later on when I was done. And I passed all of my classes. I mean that no matter what you want, you can force this type of commitment on yourself. You can make yourself do things without wanting them to happen if you just do them. A lazy person with nothing else to do than study for instance will eventually study once they realize the importance. You say you know that you are neglecting but do you really know how you are neglecting? Do you?

 

Now, the point is not how you can 'force' yourself to do stuff. Sometimes, there might not even be any motivations. You're literally forcing a being into existence, a being that means nothing to you on the level of relationships. You can infatuate yourself with the pretense that the tulpa 'will be' the most precious being to you, but right now? Your mind has no reason to even be motivated after continuous failure.

 

That's not it. Don't take any offense to it but you seem to be, as I would like to call it, the architect of your own demise. How passive forcing died for you, how you started to grow more distant from your tulpa... would you say that the effort you are providing is enough for a whole sentient and complex being? Would you say that you would be fine if your parents put very little effort in raising you as a toddler? It clearly is not, to be honest. It's not enough. Nobody expects hosts to be perfect, all this phenomenon asks for is a little effort.

 

Do you even want this? Why are you forcing at this point? Why did you not abandon this already? I'm not saying you should, I'm asking about what's holding you back from quitting. Because quitting is pretty easy. And there is no shame in quitting! You could say that we're all roleplaying and that having a tulpa is a form of self-deception, and forget about this. About your tulpa. It would feel no pain and would start the dissipation process, the self-destruction process. What do YOU want? You, the host, you will tulpas in existence for a reason. What's the fuel here, though? What's your reason?

 

Whatever reason you may have, you need to realize what it means to you. The impact it's going to have on your life, how important it actually is to you. People underestimate the importance tulpamancy holds, I swear, you don't want to end up with a being you cannot keep up with, because then you would hurt both you and the tulpa. Why do you even care about Star? What is making you care? Do you actually feel like shit on a personal level, or is it just the guilt of being a bad host? You say you care, but why? I'm acting like this because I want you to realize why 'you' care. You don't understand. Some people made tulpas because they had absolutely nothing else! Nobody else! They made tulpas because the world gave up on them! Because they had no other hope, and wanted to project their ambitions, their hidden ambitions into others, but had no one! What do you have? Why is it so important to you?

 

If you cannot motivate yourself some dude on the internet cannot motivate you with words of pseudo-wisdom that originates from some 'deep' philosophical thinking. You need to find out what 'you' want, why 'you' want this. Tulpamancy requires a lot of commitment, reconsider your options.

 

 

As for the auto-responses thing, here is a tip for you. Get up, stand in front of a glass/mirror. Look at your image in the eyes, and talk. Talk about how you're tired of getting responses from your brain. Say that this is something your brain should not intervene with, that you dislike it a lot and that it is hurting Star's development. Try to maintain eye contact with your image in the glass, and mean the things you say. State them freely, get that out of your system. If you get any thoughts like what you described after that, discard them. Ignore them. Keep asking. Keep inquiring. Ignore responses that 'sound like you'.

[Luminesce]

Possibly relevant old posts I've made:

https://community.tulpa.info/thread-wonderland-i-m-at-the-end-of-my-rope-here?pid=153006#pid153006 Dealing with invasive thoughts (Talked about visualization but it's universal)

https://community.tulpa.info/thread-narration-is-it-possible-for-a-tulpa-to-achieve-mindvoice-without-narration?pid=150854#pid150854 Narration and vocality, was directed at a different problem but you might learn something

 

Basically, you need to take control of your thoughts and tell your mind what it's gonna do, not the other way around. Don't accept invasive thoughts in any form. When your tulpa says something totally negative and against their nature (or when you have violent visualizations or anything doesn't go right in general) just ignore it. Don't try to stop it, thinking about not thinking about it is just thinking about it. You don't have to worry about putting words in your tulpa's mouth this early in development, they'll understand later if it's for the best. Sorting this stuff out early is worth some possible unintended parrotting. Just follow the rule of: Would my tulpa say this, or want to? Would they be upset if I thought they did and they didn't? If no and yes, think twice about accepting what you think they said. But if yes and no, you're all good, don't worry about it.

[kookumber]

I also have the hyperactive mind. Responses jump out of my inner voice with no filter, images flash up, the hands of my mind start to do evil before I can stop them.

 

So for a long time it was hard to know wtf was actually going on in there, with tulpa and with ME. I'm still not sure how much of the awful is in fact me and how much is invasion or noise or whatever other theory there is.

 

But you can deal with it, unless you have the same problem in your physical life. One thing that has helped with me, recently:

I told tulpa that anything I mentally "said" to it was to be disregarded. EVEN the good stuff, the legitimate desires, commands, ideas. Toss em', they can't be trusted. The security certificate is not signed, so to speak.

 

Only things that I say out loud or write down, or type, that are clearly directed at tulpa, only those are to be accepted as my word. This does restrict vocalized communication to when you are alone.

It also cuts down on how often you can communicate, and that magical mind-speak glorious feeling goes away. This is a temporary hangup, have faith.

 

As a bonus, since y'all don't communicate that often now anyway, this policy reduces the feeling of demand for it. You have to wait for the time and place. As you get to understand each other better, and have better conversations that bring more good into your lives, you will want it more. You will do it more.

 

You will write to her in public places.

 

 

The reasoning:

Communication between us, at least from my side, must be in a form I can control, or it is useless, and we will get discouraged. As you did. I did too, we got over it, we talk and understand we're on the same team now.

 

We break the rules all the time and talk inside, but we know that whenever things start to get crazy we (usually "I" at this point, it likes the crazy) say "shut it down" and I talk to it verbally or we postpone until I calm down a bit.

 

 

The hope is that as you learn each other's voices and manners that it will become more possible to keep things clearly "you two" within your mind.

 

 

I pray that helps you. Everything Judas up there said is the truth as well.

Do you believe in the possibility of a mind within your own? How much of how you wish to be could be true if you had hands and help behind your eyes? If you had the direction of a trusted other when you had none of your own?

 

Is your Star real? Take the red pill. Put the work in.

Like being alone in there? Swallow the blue sadness. You haven't decided, maybe that is why she is purple?

 

Back up to the baby steps and build a good foundation, good habits and rapport of the mind. Maybe she'll just show you what she looks like and you won't have to try so hard.

[Temar]

Possibly relevant old posts I've made:

https://community.tulpa.info/thread-wonderland-i-m-at-the-end-of-my-rope-here?pid=153006#pid153006 Dealing with invasive thoughts (Talked about visualization but it's universal)

https://community.tulpa.info/thread-narration-is-it-possible-for-a-tulpa-to-achieve-mindvoice-without-narration?pid=150854#pid150854 Narration and vocality, was directed at a different problem but you might learn something

 

 

Reposted for emphasis. Especially the second link. Seriously, make sure to read all of that one.

 

My system just had a long-time headmate go vocal a couple weeks ago, and even for a group as veteran to the creation process as we are, it was a big deal. It's hard to get the mindvoice to really "click," yeah? Even harder when it's your first thoughtform, so you're not quite sure what you're supposed to be listening for.

 

It's a more active process than I think you're expecting, too. See, my host can induce audio hallucinations too. She does it to listen to music sometimes (yeah, it's pretty awesome). But those audio hallucinations are not connected to our mindvoices. We've managed to access the ability once or twice, but the reception's pretty spotty, and that's only for those of us who are already strongly vocal.

 

A mindvoice is something you have to meet your tulpa halfway on. It's something, especially early on, that you need to actively listen for, like holding open a window to someone speaking on the other side. After a while, we learn how to open that window ourselves, but before we can learn that, you need to train yourself to be receptive to that mindvoice. How?

 

Heh... it's really hard to describe, tbh.

 

Best advice I can give is to block out all the noise. Don't listen to any of those "responses." Instead, concentrate on your tulpa. Can you feel them? Can you see them? If either of those things, then that means that your tulpa might be able to communicate with you in some way. Given all the audio noise you deal with, maybe it would be easier to start with another form of communication. My system starts with feelings... our host can feel our emotions and general essence long before we can talk. But that's still a form of communication: project feelings of affection at the tulpa, and, if you get it back, that's a nonvocal "I love you too." If you establish that form of communication, you learn to interpret what the thoughtform is saying, and learn what it "feels" like when a thought comes from them... which, in your case, is pretty much going to be the basis of learning to distinguish your tulpa's voice from the general chatter.

 

And it's worth saying: it's probably going to feel like you're answering yourself for a while. It's pretty common that you'll hear kind of an "echo" where you know what your headmate is about to say before they say it, especially early on. This is your brain processing the response, but that doesn't mean that the initial impetus behind the response doesn't come from your tulpa anyway. That's why you need to nail down what it feels like to have something come from your tulpa before you can trust those repsonses one way or another.

 

Heh. Then again, our specific creation process involves a bit more than that, but that's pretty much the pertinent parts.

 

This takes dedication and time. It sounds like you're doing great so far, but you can't let frustration trip you up.

 

If it helps, standard tulpa forcing always sounded pretty boring to me. But then, I'm biased. ;) If your method of forcing isn't catching your interest, try a different one. It might take longer, but you may be able to sustain it better in the long run. And that's what making a tulpa is all about: the long run.