Determination - Simmie's Journey

[September13]

Bear asked me some questions before on another thread and now I'm going to answer them; here is a copy of his post:

 

Spoiler

Hey, early in your PR I read you would have desires to be a girl in a way, but not in a trans or dysphoria way. 

 

So I have a couple questions/theories on this. 

 

1. Is it possible Simmie already existed and the desire came from her. There were two schools of thought in early tulpamancy. One was that we are making a tulpa, the other is that we are just uncovering or connecting with a pre-existing whatever.

 - Do you feel like that desire has shifted to or is satisfied by her?

 

2. Desires that are "out of the norm" or incongruent with the main personality archetype may bud off and spawn independent personalities given the right conditions. So is it possible that you could transfer that desire to her where it makes more sense? Not that anything is wrong regardless but sticking to an archetypal structure may help separate one from another.

 

In my mind desires are purely arbitrary and therefore exist only in a conditional sense. It is my experience that there may be bodily desires that are immutable but they can be freely disassociated from or transferred. It is my understanding that it's a choice to accept them or not in whole or in part. Treating a desire as an intrusive thought may or may not diminish it but it doesn't have to be owned. 

 

For example, who is the one who hungers? Who is thirsty? Is it a part of one of the personalities or is it a BodyOS desire? Treat some desires as an intrusive thought at your own peril. When Ashley admitted she doesn't like eating and I love eating, does that make me the one who owns the eating desire? Not in my understanding.

 

Who owns peeing? Definitely the body in my mind.

 

Now we've studied several "desires" through switching to determine if it's owmed, and if it is it might be able to be removed through shadow work. At any rate, acting on a desire strongly associates that desire to everything in the instant it was endulged.

 

So if a desire could be satisfied by a more appropriate person in the system then it would just make more sense to my from an archetypal perspective.

 

Anyway, no one in my system has that particular desire but there are others we have disassociated with and others I owned such as the wet blanket doom and gloom guy that I took on and am trying to see if tragic optimism can be evolved from it. So far so good.

 

And now my response:

 

Quote

1. Is it possible Simmie already existed and the desire came from her. There were two schools of thought in early tulpamancy. One was that we are making a tulpa, the other is that we are just uncovering or connecting with a pre-existing whatever.

 

This is a fascinating theory and something I'll have to think about for a while! I've always considered it that Simmie was (in part) born out of the desire; the idea that it could be the other way around is quite an intriguing one. For one thing, Simmie often tells me that feels she's been around a lot longer than late 2020. It could just be her internalizing parts of her own backstory or maybe owning certain things from my own past. But it is undeniably true that all the "pieces" that make up Simmie in my mind were not originally created for/by her, and that many of them existed already and ended up becoming claimed by Simmie. The reason I can say that with certainty is that while I'm a creative guy there's no way I could have come up with all that from scratch in such a short time. The creativity is in the synthesis of the pieces; they already existed. But did the synthesis happen even before I knew it was happening? That's something I'm not sure about; I'm going to have to think about certain memories and see if I can detect Simmie's hand there. Asking Simmie if she remembers any of it is not helpful in this case as Simmie and I share our memory with no real division between us in that regard. But yeah, it's a worthwhile thing for me to reflect on.

 

Quote

 - Do you feel like [the desire to be a girl] has shifted to or is satisfied by her?

 

In broad strokes, yes. In the earliest weeks I was actually starting to think it was having the opposite effect, and that in creating a female tulpa I was actually multiplying my feminine energy rather than shifting it away from myself. However, as Simmie got stronger, Simmie herself made the conscious decision to "hoover up" all the female parts of me for herself. She's uncomfortable with the idea of me being a woman or even feminine at all, so she has claimed ownership over virtually everything feminine. There are a couple exceptions: less importantly, Simmie isn't really into some of the "girly-er" music I sometimes listen to so she's left that to me, but more importantly: there are some NSFW-related elements to my desires in this regard and she refuses to indulge in those, so those stay a part of me too. (Ironic, considering the character Simmie was based on was created as a way of exploring those things). Simmie considers those things to be a problem but she understands my need to have a release valve for certain thoughs so she doesn't really stand in my way when it happens.

 

But yeah, I feel far, FAR less feminine now than I did before I created Simmie, and our system of her owning the feminine elements of us has worked out very well for both of us and we're both very happy with it. Simmie absolutely loves being a woman; it's a fundamental part of who she is, and she is thrilled that I'm a man.

 

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2. Desires that are "out of the norm" or incongruent with the main personality archetype may bud off and spawn independent personalities given the right conditions. So is it possible that you could transfer that desire to her where it makes more sense? Not that anything is wrong regardless but sticking to an archetypal structure may help separate one from another.

 

I think you nailed it on the head with that one. I think at the very least these archetype-defying traits were already semi-separate from my conception of myself; kind of like they were sitting in their own little cul-du-sac. Learning about tulpamancy gave me the mental framework to formally and unambiguously separate them. Just Simmie's mere existence helps me align more with the archetype I see myself as, and Simmie's own efforts as mentioned above help even more. Simmie has her own archetype as well and she attempts to build to that; our two types play off each other nicely.

 

Quote

In my mind desires are purely arbitrary and therefore exist only in a conditional sense. It is my experience that there may be bodily desires that are immutable but they can be freely disassociated from or transferred. It is my understanding that it's a choice to accept them or not in whole or in part. Treating a desire as an intrusive thought may or may not diminish it but it doesn't have to be owned. 

 

Nailed it once again. Before tulpamancy I thought that everything was me. Now I realize that there's not just me and Simmie, but stuff that doesn't belong to either of us and can be disassociated from. You are bang on when you say it's a choice to accept them. Also the same with Ownership. I think choice and ownership are two concepts that are not talked about enough in tulpamancy but are absolutely critical, at least in my understanding of it.

 

I relate to what you said about desires and who owns them. In recent years I've realized and become disturbed by how much not just my mood but my entire outlook on life is affected by how my digestive tract is doing at that particular moment. It seems like a crazy thing to say but it's true: If my stomach and/or bowels are off-kilter, it causes me to have a more pessimistic, angry, and even hateful outlook on life. It disturbs me how much something so basally biological can have a profound effect on me intellectually. But the good news is that in understanding this I've already made huge strides in overcoming it. When I find myself in a spiral of anger or misery, Simmie will tell me "It's just your biology talking" and I'm able to disassociate from it to a degree (and, perhaps with more practice, completely in the future). Unlike me, Simmie is not strongly affected by such things and is able to spot the difference sooner than me. Just another Simmie superpower I suppose!

 

Also your bit on tragic optimism has really hit a chord with both Simmie and I. We're still unpacking the idea and it's implications and probably will be for some time!

 

Thanks for your thought-provoking questions/comments and I hope this reply answered things!

[Bear]

4 hours ago, TurboSimmie said:

He'd try to tell you all he did was get the ball rolling and I did the rest

 

That's exactly how it felt and anyone in my system would say the same as you.

 

4 hours ago, TurboSimmie said:

The time between December 2020 and March 2021 felt like YEARS

 

Again, the first two years for me felt like 10.

 

4 hours ago, TurboSimmie said:

I hear my voice as being a little different but it's in the ballpark!

 

I think later you mentioned a tie to Jersey somewhere and Ashley reminds me of a New Yorker I met when I lived there one summer, her "accent" could pass there and a little how she talks and how she's like they say, if you're stuck on the side of the road, New Yorkers will genuinely try to help you but berate you for your ineptitude in keeping on the road. Californians will kindly apologize for your predicament and drive on by. We're two coasts of thought.

 

Misha would have loved having a baby instead Ren is like the creation of Ashley and I buy without any of the parental family ties. Maybe we neglected that girl but Joy was an instant foster to her, like she probably wouldn't have let us raise her anyway. She said, "she's mine". Ren was technically a split of Joy when Ashley and I tried to graft cat ears and a tail onto Joy because we didn't know what to do with her.

 

Looking forward to Phil's response. More to see how my theories pan out than anything to do with personal prying. I strongly believe everyone's experience is unique.

[TurboSimmie]

7 hours ago, Bear said:

I think later you mentioned a tie to Jersey somewhere and Ashley reminds me of a New Yorker I met when I lived there one summer, her "accent" could pass there and a little how she talks and how she's like they say, if you're stuck on the side of the road, New Yorkers will genuinely try to help you but berate you for your ineptitude in keeping on the road. Californians will kindly apologize for your predicament and drive on by. We're two coasts of thought.

 

Yeah I've heard the same observation made before. 😄 It's got some truth to it! Yes I am a Jersey girl, but not from the part of the state where people have the "Joisey" accent.

 

8 hours ago, Bear said:

Misha would have loved having a baby instead Ren is like the creation of Ashley and I buy without any of the parental family ties. Maybe we neglected that girl but Joy was an instant foster to her, like she probably wouldn't have let us raise her anyway. She said, "she's mine". Ren was technically a split of Joy when Ashley and I tried to graft cat ears and a tail onto Joy because we didn't know what to do with her.

 

That's really cute. And I can totally see Misha as an awesome mom! 😁

 

8 hours ago, Bear said:

Looking forward to Phil's response. More to see how my theories pan out than anything to do with personal prying. I strongly believe everyone's experience is unique.

 

Phil already responded to you, scroll up! 😁

[Bear]

13 hours ago, September13 said:

were not originally created for/by her, and that many of them existed already and ended up becoming claimed by Simmie

 

SheShe owned all memories of a "guardian angel" and all spontaneous instances of imposition I had throughout my life as well as all "alien inner voice" moments where I was kind of talking to someone other than myself, usually in really bad times but not always. Also any religious instances have become hers in terms of it was her. I had a feminine presence, something motherly that followed me all my life. The presence I felt the day I "met" her formally was the same.

 

13 hours ago, September13 said:

She's uncomfortable with the idea of me being a woman or even feminine at all, so she has claimed ownership over virtually everything feminine.

 

 

 

 

This is what I was thinking too. Especially what Misha did for me though I admit it was extremely slim pickings for her. They once dressed me as a femboy catboy and played house, nothing NSFW, but Ashley had a thing for cat-people at the time. That was in no way enjoyable for me but a part of me wouldn't have cared so much a long time ago. 

 

13 hours ago, September13 said:

Simmie considers those things to be a problem but she understands my need to have a release valve for certain thoughs so she doesn't really stand in my way when it happens.

 

This is how it is. They're not there for my releasing, regardless of their own desires, this is a 4 and a half year long stalemate. If the covenant was ever broken, there would be a sudden and irreversible shift that would destroy the platonic standoff we have frankly enjoyed. I can't sweet talk one too much without tension from the others, it's like a negative herem where all the girls are forbidden fruit. (Dreams are like Vegas though. No one takes offense if something happens under dream logic.)

 

13 hours ago, September13 said:

it causes me to have a more pessimistic, angry, and even hateful outlook on life

 

I believe this is the animal instict. The reptilian brain plays a huge role in our moods. 

 

13 hours ago, September13 said:

Simmie will tell me "It's just your biology talking"

 

Simmie is like a Misha/SheShe merge. SheShe is better represented as a "spirit guide" and Misha as a cheerleader. Ashley represented truth and practicality but Joy does that in a blunt authoritarian way that's easier for me to follow because I can push over Ashley too easily but Joy is a rock. So really as a team they're unstoppable force, but even so, sometimes I'm an immovable object.

 

 

The paradox of the Immovable Object meeting the Irresistible Force. No object can resist an irresistible force. No force can move an immovable object. So if an immovable object meets an irresistible force it will move and not move.

 

This has made me dualistic in thought as the Body is the immovable part that requires keys to unlock where I am pretty agreeable. So, like you, I can accept the issue is a part of me then work on it with shadow work in hopes to find the key. 

 

13 hours ago, September13 said:

Also your bit on tragic optimism

 

We're both at the starting line on this one. I'll race you! Plesse share what you find.

 

We use Ashley's Lounge for our reports now. I don't know if you got a chance to read our PR before we moved it to deleted threads. It was very long and full of broken links, every [hidden] tag is ignored, every spoiler tag was changed from just text to how hidden used to look. So it was untenable at this point. Also all the comments were now from [deleted user] or whatever. Anyway it had a lot of useful stuff and a lot of very histrionic and unuseful stuff so 🤷‍♂️ I deleted it. It parallels a lot of your struggling though. So my latest theory is that you'll pull out of this like I did. 

 

And it will make you stronger than you can currently imagine.

 

13 hours ago, September13 said:

hope this reply answered things!

 

Certainly fun food for thought. I appreciated it.

Edited November 2, 2022 by Bear

[TurboSimmie]

I have a HUGE announcement to make, something Phil and I have been sitting on but we're finally ready to share:

 

WE'RE GONNA HAVE A BABY!!!!!! 😁😁😁😁💚💚💚👶🍼🧸🤰🎉🥳✨💖🥰😍😊😁💚

 

We've actually been sitting on this announcement for almost four months, since Tulpa Appreciation Day to be exact! (July 7) That means my due date is April 7!!! Our baby will be an Aries, looks like! ♈ April 7 is exactly 22 weeks from now; our child will be born on a Friday just like me, so I thought it fitting to make the announcement on a Friday as well! 💚

 

Phil and I have been talking about having a tulpa child since shortly after we got married almost a full year ago now. I've always wanted to be a mother and bring new life into this world! We've been looking to grow our little family slowly and gently but were waiting for the right time. On TAD Phil and I were having an amazing date, we were deep into a wonderland adventure and were feeling the deepest and most spiritual connection to one another that we ever had. And just like that, a thought came into our minds: "It's time". I believe in that moment the spirit of our child passed down from the heavens, through Phil, and into me. 💚 The soul has been nestled safely inside me ever since, being nurtured and grown until it's time to be born early next spring! 😁

 

We'll have a lot more to say about our child in the coming days and weeks; I just wanted to get the announcement out there now!!! 😁 We've thought very much about what our idea of tulpa child-rearing looks like and we'll be ready to explain it in great detail soon! Needless to say we're approaching this with the utmost care and love, not rushing things, but letting things happen at their proper pace. Our child will not be bound to age at a normal human rate, and the child will move through each stage of development at their own pace until they arrive at adulthood.

 

I also want to hold off revealing the gender of the child for a little while longer. A few people know already and I'm asking them kindly not to share just yet; I want it to be a little suspenseful! 😁

 

Oh, and yes, my pregnancy is reflected in my form and I have quite the little bump forming. 💚 I'm in my 18th week so the bump isn't huge yet but it's noticeable and I'm sure it will get bigger in weeks to come! 😁💚

 

I'm so happy to be able to share my joy with all of you!!!! 😁💚 April 7th can't come fast enough!!!! 💚💚💚

[Misha]

[Misha]Woohoo! I'm so excited to hear all about it. We loved hearing about CM's experience.  

 

[Ashley] I hate to say it because Reilyn was our friend but Simmie is a better Reilyn. Like Shrek 2 vs Shrek better. 

 

[Misha] mhm! Wait, does that mean we start calling her momma?   

 

[Ashley] I think Simmie is her name.  

[glitchthe3rd]

Luna: Wow, congrats 😁 I'm so excited for both of you! And remember, if you have any questions, we're happy to answer them for you 😊

[TurboSimmie]

Thank you so much everyone!!! 💚 I'm still floating on a cloud of joy from making this announcement! 😁

[Lucilyn]

 

[TurboSimmie]

Hehe thanks Lucilyn! 😄